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11-23-2016, 12:34 PM | #21 | |
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Just trying to clarify...
Quote:
Last edited by thehef; 11-23-2016 at 12:35 PM. Reason: clean up on aisle 5 |
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11-23-2016, 12:53 PM | #22 | |
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- minor tweaks & fixes, but still no historical transactions & independent leagues/teams (& thus no access to all of the add'l players) - implement full & accurate arrangements only when that info becomes available and can be coded - implement a pretty robust system that includes historical transactions, tons more teams & players (incl. independents & negro), etc., like what's summarized in my OP I'll take that last one! It sure seems doable for OOTP 18. If we could get there, then, IMO, we'd have highly-playable & semi-close to full & historically-accurate minor league baseball available. It'd be a great foundation for future tweaks & improvements. |
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11-23-2016, 12:58 PM | #23 |
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I should have said "they already would" if their teams existed in ootp.
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11-23-2016, 01:41 PM | #24 |
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11-23-2016, 02:57 PM | #25 |
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I am wondering if for 18 rather than limiting leagues to affiliated ones limit them to those as well as any that contain future and/or former mlb players?
That way all those players will have full careers and everyone else will gain fuller careers. Adds 668 new League Years
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11-23-2016, 03:49 PM | #26 |
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'twould be marvelous! Here's to hoping. i can almost hear Jean Luc Picard - "Make It So."
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11-24-2016, 12:54 AM | #27 |
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You will notice the missing 1931 Western League that has caused so much consternation is on this list.
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11-24-2016, 03:57 AM | #28 |
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Regarding...
Very cool... For the most part that pretty much matches a list I was working on. A few suggestions:
While we're on the subject, any idea why these season-leagues - all of which have at least one team affiliated with MLB - were not included in OOTP historical minors? 1933 Dixie League 1936-1940 Northeast Arkansas League 1939 & 1946 Coastal Plain League 1940-1942 & 1946-1948 Wisconsin State League 1940 & 1947 Evangeline League* 1941-1942 Virginia League* 1942 & 1948 West Texas-New Mexico League* 1946 & 1948 Border League 1946 & 1948 Georgia-Alabama League 1946-1948 Florida International League* 1946-1948 Kansas-Oklahoma-Missouri League 1946-1948 North Atlantic League 1947 Cotton States League* 1947-1948 Illinois State League 1947-1948 Lone Star League 1947-1948 Sooner State League 1947-1948 Sunset League 1947-1948 Tobacco State League 1948 Big State League 1948 Colonial League 1948 Ohio-Indiana League 1948 Far West League 1948 Longhorn League An asterisk (*) means that they are included in your csv file of proposed leagues to include. |
11-24-2016, 11:49 AM | #29 |
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Not every league has been downloaded from bbref yet. Thanks for the list, I'll forward it to BigRod.
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11-24-2016, 03:18 PM | #30 | |
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Eastern League, 1892-1911; International League, 1912-present Connecticut State League, 1895-1912; Eastern Association, 1913-14 California League, 1898-1902; California State League, 1903-10 New England Leaue, 1901-15; Eastern League, 1916-32 Pacific Northwest League, 1901-02; Pacific National League, 1903-05 Southern League, 1901-19; Southern Association, 1920-61 Virginia-North Carolina League. 1901; North Carolina League, 1902 Missouri Valley League, 1902-04; Western Association, 1905-11 Iowa State League, 1904-07; Central Association, 1908-17 Copper County Soo League, 1905; Northern Copper County League, 1906-07 Northwestern League, 1905-17; Pacific Coast International League, 1918; Northwest International League, 1919; Pacific Coast International League, 1920-21; Western International League, 1922 Wisconsin Association, 1905-06; Wisconsin State League, 1907 Oklahoma-Arkansas-Kansas League, 1907; Oklahoma-Kansas League, 1908 Carolina Association, 1908-12; North Carolina State League, 1913-17 Central Kansas League, 1908-12; Kansas State League, 1913-14 Northern League, 1908; Minnesota-Wisconsin League, 1909-12; see special cases Wisconsin-Illinois League, 1908-14; Bi-State League, 1915 Empire State League, 1913; Georgia State League, 1914; Florida-Alabama-Georgia League, 1915 New York-New Jersey League, 1913; Atlantic League, 1914 South Dakota League, 1920; Dakota League, 1921-23 West Texas League, 1920-22; Panhandle-Pecos Valley League, 1923 New York-Pennsylvania League, 1923-37; Eastern League, 1938-present Arizona State League, 1928-30; Arizona-Texas League, 1931-32 Nebraska State League, 1928-38; Western League, 1939-41 New England League. 1933; Northeastern League, 1934 Arkansas State League, 1934-35; Arkansas-Missouri League, 1936-40 Alabama-Florida League, 1936-39; Alabama State League, 1940-41 North Carolina State League, 1945-52; Tar Heel League, 1953-54 Alabama State League, 1946-50; Alabama-Florida League, 1951-62 South Atlantic League, 1946-63; Southern League, 1964-present Western International League, 1946-54; Northwest League, 1955-present Arizona-Texas League, 1947-50; Southwest International League, 1951-52 Illinois State League, 1947-48; Mississippi Ohio Valley League, 1949-55; Midwest League, 1956-present Longhorn League, 1947-55; Southwestern League, 1956-57; Sophomore League, 1958-61 Sunset League, 1947-50; Southwest International League, 1951-52 Arizona-Texas League, 1952-54; Arizona-Mexico League, 1955-58 Western Carolina League, 1960-62; Western Carolinas League,1963-79; South Atlantic League, 1980-present Sarasota Rookie League, 1964; Florida Rookie League, 1965; Gulf Coast League, 1966-present Gulf States League, 1976; Lone Star League, 1977 Great Central League, 1994; Mid-America League, 1995; Heartland League, 1996-98 Texas-Louisiana League, 1994-2001; Central League, 2002-05; United League, 2006-10 Northeast League, 2003-04; Canadian-American Association, 2005-present Special Cases Minnesota-Wisconsin League, 1909-12, and Central International League, 1912; merged to form Northern League, 1913-17 Michigan-Ontario League, 1919-26, and Central League, 1926, merged in mid-season to form Michigan State League, 1926 Southern League and Texas League merged in 1971 to form Dixie Association; arrangement only lasted for that season Northeast League merged with Northern League for the 1999-2002 seasons; split from Northern League in 2003 Golden Baseball League, Northern League, and United League merged to form North American League, 2012-13 Note too leagues sometimes were better known by more informal names. E.g. the Illinois-Iowa-Indiana League was more commonly referred to as the Three-I League; the Border League of 1912-13 was also known as the Eastern Michigan League; the Pennsylvania-Ontario-New York League was usually called the Pony League; etc. |
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11-25-2016, 05:22 PM | #31 | |||||
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I would think that for simplicity & continuity purposes, it would be best to maintain as many of these relationships as possible (even if at times we sacrifice a bit of pinpoint accuracy). For example, in OOTP if you were to look at the history of the International League, it should include the Eastern League through 1911. And if you were to look at the history of the Southern Association (that ran from 1920-1961), it should include the Southern League from 1901-1919. For the Special Cases (mergers), I would generally keep the history of the longer-historied predecessor league as part of the subsequent/resulting league: Quote:
Quote:
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Finally, while I realize that many like to play random-debut or fictional-historical, and would like to do so with historical minors, I think the key to making historical minors in OOTP an awesome thing is to make it actually historical by allowing access to as many players and leagues as possible, and - most-importantly - incorporating historical transactions. Beyond fixing known bugs, that should be the primary focus, IMO... In other words... Quote:
Last edited by thehef; 11-25-2016 at 05:25 PM. Reason: clarity |
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11-25-2016, 06:16 PM | #32 | ||
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(1) To do otherwise means the two leagues operate as 7-team entities that year, yet play an interleague schedule, and with the Southern League's Birmingham club playing a schedule drastically different from the six other nominal Southern League clubs. (2) It was the first time in minor league history a league was divided into three divisions, and it was the first time an NFL-style wild card playoff qualifier was used. Quote:
No, I'm afraid not. Even the final standings for Negro leagues are not completely certain in some seasons. |
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11-25-2016, 06:46 PM | #33 |
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Unaffiliated leagues have been disavowed (for now).
So anything pertaining to them is just a mental exercise. I will look into combining leagues where appropriate.
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11-25-2016, 07:50 PM | #34 |
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I would be happy if the players remained in the organization that has their rights from one season to the next. Until this is fixed, the feature is unplayable.
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11-25-2016, 08:18 PM | #35 |
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11-25-2016, 09:29 PM | #36 |
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This not going to happen afaik. It does not happen for the mlb either unless you use the tranny file. Time to move on?
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11-26-2016, 05:46 AM | #37 |
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IRL an organization does not lose huge chunks of its players simply because a minor-league team or league ceases operation. So, at a minimum, OOTP needs to fix that (which I believe has been identified as a bug). Beyond that, for historical minors to be both playable and fun, it needs to be more than just a highly-inflexible way of getting some minor leaguers into your game, into a structure that somewhat mimics historical, but doesn't otherwise resemble history beyond some minor-leaguers importing to their original teams.
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11-26-2016, 06:25 AM | #38 |
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11-26-2016, 08:11 AM | #39 | |
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Of course, players move from one organization to another in real life. But they do so by virtue of actual transactions. The game does not create actual transactions for these erroneous movements. The transaction logs show nothing. One day a team owns their rights and the next day they are free agents for no contractual reason. That does not happen in real life. This is obviously a bug, and a quite serious one at that. It is definitely not "time to move on". It is time to admit that we have a problem, and devote some programming resources to fix it. Hopefully, it could be fixed with a patch to OOTP17. |
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11-26-2016, 09:22 AM | #40 |
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I mean it is time for me to move on. I am too discouraged to create any more bug reports. It seems like what it is now is going to be what it is. Way too much churn in players and the players on any milb team in game seem just to be random to me.
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