Rosters Draft/Training Camp

[jasonuk]

Would love to see full rosters, i.e. 90 players during training camp, then down to 75, etc.
More teams battling for undrafted free agent signings.
Whitling down to your final 53 + practice squad, etc.
Ability to sign other players practice squad players, etc.
This is something thats missing in Front Office Football.
Would really like to see this implemented properly according to the proper nfl timelines.

[Francis Cole]

Yes it's in.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by jasonuk

Would love to see full rosters, i.e. 90 players during training camp, then down to 75, etc.

More teams battling for undrafted free agent signings.

Whitling down to your final 53 + practice squad, etc.

Ability to sign other players practice squad players, etc.

This is something thats missing in Front Office Football.

Would really like to see this implemented properly according to the proper nfl timelines.

Yea this missing aspect completely turned me off from FOF7 (was a newcomer to that game)

Great to see its in for BTS!

[jasonuk]

awesome. i cant wait for this game to come out. im buying!

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by jasonuk

... Would really like to see this implemented properly according to the proper nfl timelines.

I'll just point out the roster sizes and cut down dates have varied over the years. I've found a bit of data on this.

For example, a number of changes were made after the 1987 season. Before then, clubs could open training camp with an unlimited number of players. Clubs then had to cut down to 60 players after the second full week of preseason games, then trim to 50 players after the 3rd full preseason weekend, then cut down to the final 47 players after the 4th full preseason weekend. After 1987, clubs could open training camp with a maximum of 80 players, and there were only two cut down dates: to 60 players after the 3rd full preseason weekend, then to 47 players after the 4th full preseason weekend.

Later, the first cut down limit was raised to 65 players, then to 75 players, while the second limit (of active/inactive players) was increased to 53 players. Practice squad sizes also changed over the years.

Back when NFL clubs played 6 preseason games, the cut down dates were: to 60 players after the 1st full preseason weekend; to 52 players after the 4th preseason weekend; to 48 players after the 5th weekend; and to 45 players after the 6th weekend.


Ideally, it'd be nice to make the roster limits and cut down dates customizable.
.

[olivertheorem]

Why am I not surprised that LGO posted that info?

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by olivertheorem

Why am I not surprised that LGO posted that info?

BTS has inspired me to do digging into things I had previously not given much thought to. Fortunately, these days the amount of information that is available online makes such digging a much easier task than it would have been even just ten years ago.

[da commish]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

BTS has inspired me to do digging into things I had previously not given much thought to. Fortunately, these days the amount of information that is available online makes such digging a much easier task than it would have been even just ten years ago.

Yeah, it's alot easier now than it was in my day when I had to go to the card catalog and the microfilm/fiche for research.

[r0nster]

curious what about rookie camp and some teams will have optional vets to participate as well .... thinking perhaps this might help improve skills for some players to reach potential quicker ???

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

I'll just point out the roster sizes and cut down dates have varied over the years. I've found a bit of data on this.

For example, a number of changes were made after the 1987 season. Before then, clubs could open training camp with an unlimited number of players. Clubs then had to cut down to 60 players after the second full week of preseason games, then trim to 50 players after the 3rd full preseason weekend, then cut down to the final 47 players after the 4th full preseason weekend. After 1987, clubs could open training camp with a maximum of 80 players, and there were only two cut down dates: to 60 players after the 3rd full preseason weekend, then to 47 players after the 4th full preseason weekend.

Later, the first cut down limit was raised to 65 players, then to 75 players, while the second limit (of active/inactive players) was increased to 53 players. Practice squad sizes also changed over the years.

Back when NFL clubs played 6 preseason games, the cut down dates were: to 60 players after the 1st full preseason weekend; to 52 players after the 4th preseason weekend; to 48 players after the 5th weekend; and to 45 players after the 6th weekend.


Ideally, it'd be nice to make the roster limits and cut down dates customizable.
.

Right now, when there won't be season replays in v1, this information is a bit abundant.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by dmytron

Right now, when there won't be season replays in v1, this information is a bit abundant.

Do not forget BTS users who want to create fictional leagues rather than just run current-day NFL leagues. Fictional league users always appreciate having options which allow them to customize the particulars of their league. (That these options would aid in accurate recreation of historical NFL seasons is simply an added bonus.)

[Francis Cole]

I, unfortunately, wouldn't get your hopes too up that those kinds of things are editable for V1.

The (AI) Roster Management is going to be hard to get "right" and that's even with me guaranteeing it will 90/75/53, if you now allow it to be X/Y/Z the difficulty will go way up.

Let's get V1 right first before we get ahead of ourselves

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

I, unfortunately, wouldn't get your hopes too up that those kinds of things are editable for V1.

Let me put it this way: don't lock in values in the code in such a way that it becomes impossible to change it later.

Even if not made editable in the first version, at least build the foundation with the ability to change such things in the future. OOTP has several things which are hard-coded and cannot be changed without a great deal of effort. That (effective) inability to change them forces certain less-than-desirable (IMO) compromises.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by le grande orange

let me put it this way: Don't lock in values in the code in such a way that it becomes impossible to change it later.

Hear, hear.

[Ambermonk]

In the early days of OOTP, spring training used to mean something. You could work on a player's skills, improve weaknesses, add positions, etc. But they have largely gotten away from this and gone to more of a cookie-cutter approach.

I hope that BTS won't make this same mistake. Here are some areas that I would like to see developed...

Conditioning - Teams like the 49ers & Seahawks have especially active conditioning programs, and it shows.

Practice - Teams which practice effectively, play more effectively.

Position meetings - Effective position meetings would reduce on-field screw-ups.

Film Room Study - Effective film study would make a player more effective - especially (but not limited to) quarterbacks.

Pre-season Games - These games should let us evaluate players to determine who will make the team. Have these games mean something.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by Ambermonk

Pre-season Games - These games should let us evaluate players to determine who will make the team. Have these games mean something.

There's another aspect to the preseason games to consider: the profit motive. The reason why the teams in the NFL, for a number of years, played 6 preseason games was because these were usually quite profitable. Players were paid only the small training camp fee for preseason games, while attendance at these games was often quite good (anywhere from 80%-90%+ on average of what regular season attendance averaged).

The preseason was eventually trimmed to 4 games for several reasons.

[goalieump413]

I agree that roster development should be a major focus of training camp and the preseason. I hope that Francis builds a roadmap of events that occur throughout the calendar year and includes some details of what's going to be implemented in v1.

BTW, one of the reasons that the Player's Assoc. has wanted to shorten the preseason from 4 to 3 games is money. But added to it, is the player injury risk in playing games that don't count towards a winning season.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by goalieump413

BTW, one of the reasons that the Player's Assoc. has wanted to shorten the preseason from 4 to 3 games is money. But added to it, is the player injury risk in playing games that don't count towards a winning season.

Yup, you can find articles in The Sporting News from the early 1970s (when the preseason period had 6 games) espousing much the same view. It was one of the reasons why the preseason period was reduced to 4 games. Another reason included season ticket holders being greatly annoyed at being forced to buy a couple of preseason games as part of the package. Another was the shift to the 'common opponents' schedule format in 1978, which worked with a 16-game regular season.

[Le Grande Orange]

A few tidbits of info about the number of preseason games played in earlier seasons. In 1953 and 1954 the Pittsburgh Steelers played 7 preseason games, all against other NFL clubs, while in 1954 the Philadelphia Eagles and Chicago Cardinals also played 7 preseason games. (The other clubs played 5 or 6 games in the preseason.) The regular season in both years was only 12 games long.

The preseason for these clubs was over half the length of the regular season. That'd be the proportional equivalent to an NFL team in today's era playing 9 preseason games.

[Ambermonk]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

A few tidbits of info about the number of preseason games played in earlier seasons. In 1953 and 1954 the Pittsburgh Steelers played 7 preseason games, all against other NFL clubs, while in 1954 the Philadelphia Eagles and Chicago Cardinals also played 7 preseason games. (The other clubs played 5 or 6 games in the preseason.) The regular season in both years was only 12 games long.

The preseason for these clubs was over half the length of the regular season. That'd be the proportional equivalent to an NFL team in today's era playing 9 preseason games.

Very interesting! Do you know why they played so many pre-season games?