My bullpen is always complete garbage and I don't know what to do about it.

Beaniegoose · 04-09-2017, 06:00 PM

I've tried going off stats from the past 2 seasons, I've tried ratings, I've tried veteranship vs. youth, nothing's working. My middle relievers' ERAs are on average about 5.00, with WHIPs in the 1.40s. This problem has occured across multiple franchises.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

TuckerDuckson · 04-09-2017, 06:03 PM

Have you tried extreme groundballers?

Beaniegoose · 04-09-2017, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TuckerDuckson

Have you tried extreme groundballers?

No, would that make a significant impact?

TuckerDuckson · 04-09-2017, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beaniegoose

No, would that make a significant impact?

It would reduce your home run rate by a significant margin. You don't need to all go "extreme" but you can go groundballers. Also, make sure your pitching coach matches the pitchers you put out in the field. If you trot out all ground ballers but have a "power" pitching coach you're getting no benefit.

Izz · 04-09-2017, 06:38 PM

If your players are defensively poor, this will also negatively affect your pitching.

Beaniegoose · 04-09-2017, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Izz

If your players are defensively poor, this will also negatively affect your pitching.

My starting pitchers are operating just fine with my defense. It's not a bad defense by any means, but it's definately not all-star caliber.

TuckerDuckson · 04-09-2017, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beaniegoose

My starting pitchers are operating just fine with my defense. It's not a bad defense by any means, but it's definately not all-star caliber.

What's your defensive efficiency?

BBGiovanni · 04-09-2017, 07:13 PM

It seems like mediocre relievers are pretty hard to hide in OOTP, at least in modern play. Relievers are often relatively easy to come by so I get as many good ones as I can. Sometimes mediocre starters are a lot better in relief (when you change their position).

Also, keep in mind by the nature of their appearances that sample sizes for stats are always quite small. They may be bad for half a season and then lights out, and it all evens out. Especially true for a LOOGY.

drhay53 · 04-09-2017, 07:22 PM

Also pay attention to how many innings your starters are eating. If your bullpen is overworked they'll underperform. When in doubt about the last guy or two in your rotation, lean a little towards stamina.

daveawrit · 04-09-2017, 08:16 PM

Dave Dombrowski? Is that you?

Levistus · 04-10-2017, 12:03 AM

Still in historical in this build, but I've been a big fan of lots of specialization in prior ootp modern bullpens.

Pay through the nose to get that Closer.
2 set up guys, if I have two guys who can get it done, otherwise just 1.
1 MR, unless I don't have that second set up guy, this guy can be pedestrian, but he's really just trying to get me through the 6th inning.
Lefty/Righty Specialists. Hunt through the free agent market and you can find guys who have outrageous stuff against just one or the other and are fairly cheap.

One thing to remember is that they don't pitch a lot of innings, so if you see a high era, it's still better to look at whip K/9 BB/9, they might have gotten lit up once but they've been serviceable or good outside that appearance.

If you're having issues finding relievers, look at starters who have 3 pitches, often you can take a 1-2 star swing guy and see he's really a fastball/slider/change 4 star reliever.

Bunktown Ballers · 04-10-2017, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beaniegoose

I've tried going off stats from the past 2 seasons, I've tried ratings, I've tried veteranship vs. youth, nothing's working. My middle relievers' ERAs are on average about 5.00, with WHIPs in the 1.40s. This problem has occured across multiple franchises.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Get rid of the WHITE SOX staff then. That's my problem. Lol

MrBojangles · 04-10-2017, 11:52 PM

In my fictional league I've built up a fantastic roster of SP and RP by trading and drafting strong young prospects, finding hitting coaches for all levels of my system that rate highly in teaching their craft (peeking at the editor screen) and by increasing the dollars I pump into my minor system budget.
It took a handful of years for the prospects to become ready for the big leagues, but now I have so many that the ones I can't fit on my roster are great trade bait to go out and get more young prospects.

kingcharlesxii · 04-11-2017, 12:04 AM

It's tough to say what's wrong just based on the info you gave.

The best thing you can do is look at the successful relievers in your league and try to find players that look like that. Depending on your league settings, these players could look very different.

Generally I've found you can't go wrong with guys with good control and stamina. If your home park is homer or double friendly, focus on guys with better movement. If you're playing in PetCo, you can probably get by with mediocre ratings in movement. Otherwise, stuff is always good but if you have a truly great defense, you won't be hurt as much by guys with non-dominant stuff.

buckeye22 · 04-11-2017, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveawrit

Dave Dombrowski? Is that you?

Came to say the exact same thing!

ThePretender · 04-11-2017, 07:57 AM

There are many factors that go into this. Do your SP go deep into games? Do you have a balanced bullpen or roles (ie multiple lefties, or a multi inning guy, or things like that)? You mentioned you paid a lot on the closer, does that mean your SU guys aren't nearly as good?

What ratings did you focus on for RP? Did you go for extreme stuff at the expense of other ratings?

You say your D isn't all star calibre, are we talking on a 1-100 scale guys who are closer to 60 across the board at their position, or 70, or 80?

NoOne · 04-11-2017, 06:11 PM

i forgot to hit auto-calc for year 1 of a real mlb league i just created for a little dinking around....

either way, they have a default slugging of .412 -- that's going to be steroid era and higher results... i use a custome set of LTs, and they are closer to last year's than this year's defaults... so it's an okay comparison to relate to for you, i think. (.404-.405 slugging last year? i jst don't see the default #'s often enouhg)

MR were terrible, but the league ERA was ~4.30-4.50 or somethign elevated like that... that was using the new defaults out of the box... i did forget to auto-calc, but the league was pretty much ther (it wasn't 1.000's, so they must have them set for year 1?)

year 2 after auto-calc with my LTs, those same MR had banner years, followed by more average or worse years, but still in line with their ratings, imo. never as high as they were that first year with slugging at ~.410+, for obvious reasons.

relievers of MR-quality and probably lower seem to be a bit more sensitive to whatever accounts for the elevated runs scored in the statistics. probably the sp, too... you may want to reduc HR from default, after an auto-calc start reducing HR ltm by a certain amount and tweak that amount over time as you learn what you need... making a couple assumptions that this relates... if not, nevermind.

FYI: if you drop HR, you are adding to balls in play and increasing BABIP... you need to either asjust the League Total for babip or adjust balls in play or hits another equal oppposing way. i think those LT#s are supposed to jive for best results. stick to LTM even if the # is not what you want - the LTM can get it there, alone. it's easier, midstream. if you auto-calc and can do so after an LT-change, it's no biggie.

chazzycat · 04-11-2017, 06:50 PM

Are you changing the default team strategy at all for relievers? I always bump the "favor L/R matchups" slider way up, seems to help.

04-09-2017, 06:00 PM	#1
Beaniegoose Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Missouri Posts: 25	My bullpen is always complete garbage and I don't know what to do about it. I've tried going off stats from the past 2 seasons, I've tried ratings, I've tried veteranship vs. youth, nothing's working. My middle relievers' ERAs are on average about 5.00, with WHIPs in the 1.40s. This problem has occured across multiple franchises. Any help is greatly appreciated.

04-09-2017, 06:03 PM	#2
TuckerDuckson Major Leagues Join Date: Feb 2016 Posts: 447	Have you tried extreme groundballers? __________________ Plays legit baseball now. My OOTP ratings are low. 2022 update: I'm two stars!

04-09-2017, 06:38 PM	#5
Izz Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2,467	If your players are defensively poor, this will also negatively affect your pitching. __________________ Not only do I play OOTP but I also write science-fiction: My Website A brief history of the Australia-New Zealand Baseball League (AUNZBL 2019-2119)--A Dynasty Report The National Penterham Four-Bases Association--A Dynasty Report

04-10-2017, 12:03 AM	#11
Levistus Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 34	Still in historical in this build, but I've been a big fan of lots of specialization in prior ootp modern bullpens. Pay through the nose to get that Closer. 2 set up guys, if I have two guys who can get it done, otherwise just 1. 1 MR, unless I don't have that second set up guy, this guy can be pedestrian, but he's really just trying to get me through the 6th inning. Lefty/Righty Specialists. Hunt through the free agent market and you can find guys who have outrageous stuff against just one or the other and are fairly cheap. One thing to remember is that they don't pitch a lot of innings, so if you see a high era, it's still better to look at whip K/9 BB/9, they might have gotten lit up once but they've been serviceable or good outside that appearance. If you're having issues finding relievers, look at starters who have 3 pitches, often you can take a 1-2 star swing guy and see he's really a fastball/slider/change 4 star reliever. __________________

04-11-2017, 12:04 AM	#14
kingcharlesxii Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,730	It's tough to say what's wrong just based on the info you gave. The best thing you can do is look at the successful relievers in your league and try to find players that look like that. Depending on your league settings, these players could look very different. Generally I've found you can't go wrong with guys with good control and stamina. If your home park is homer or double friendly, focus on guys with better movement. If you're playing in PetCo, you can probably get by with mediocre ratings in movement. Otherwise, stuff is always good but if you have a truly great defense, you won't be hurt as much by guys with non-dominant stuff. __________________ OTBA - Stockholm Royal Squirrels of Sweden OOTP Grand League Champion 2015

04-09-2017, 07:13 PM	#8
BBGiovanni All Star Starter Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Republic of California Posts: 1,850	It seems like mediocre relievers are pretty hard to hide in OOTP, at least in modern play. Relievers are often relatively easy to come by so I get as many good ones as I can. Sometimes mediocre starters are a lot better in relief (when you change their position). Also, keep in mind by the nature of their appearances that sample sizes for stats are always quite small. They may be bad for half a season and then lights out, and it all evens out. Especially true for a LOOGY.

04-09-2017, 07:22 PM	#9
drhay53 Major Leagues Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 355	Also pay attention to how many innings your starters are eating. If your bullpen is overworked they'll underperform. When in doubt about the last guy or two in your rotation, lean a little towards stamina.

04-09-2017, 08:16 PM	#10
daveawrit Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: California Posts: 326	Dave Dombrowski? Is that you?

04-10-2017, 11:52 PM	#13
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	In my fictional league I've built up a fantastic roster of SP and RP by trading and drafting strong young prospects, finding hitting coaches for all levels of my system that rate highly in teaching their craft (peeking at the editor screen) and by increasing the dollars I pump into my minor system budget. It took a handful of years for the prospects to become ready for the big leagues, but now I have so many that the ones I can't fit on my roster are great trade bait to go out and get more young prospects.

04-11-2017, 07:57 AM	#16
ThePretender All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,303	There are many factors that go into this. Do your SP go deep into games? Do you have a balanced bullpen or roles (ie multiple lefties, or a multi inning guy, or things like that)? You mentioned you paid a lot on the closer, does that mean your SU guys aren't nearly as good? What ratings did you focus on for RP? Did you go for extreme stuff at the expense of other ratings? You say your D isn't all star calibre, are we talking on a 1-100 scale guys who are closer to 60 across the board at their position, or 70, or 80?

04-11-2017, 06:11 PM	#17
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,167	i forgot to hit auto-calc for year 1 of a real mlb league i just created for a little dinking around.... either way, they have a default slugging of .412 -- that's going to be steroid era and higher results... i use a custome set of LTs, and they are closer to last year's than this year's defaults... so it's an okay comparison to relate to for you, i think. (.404-.405 slugging last year? i jst don't see the default #'s often enouhg) MR were terrible, but the league ERA was ~4.30-4.50 or somethign elevated like that... that was using the new defaults out of the box... i did forget to auto-calc, but the league was pretty much ther (it wasn't 1.000's, so they must have them set for year 1?) year 2 after auto-calc with my LTs, those same MR had banner years, followed by more average or worse years, but still in line with their ratings, imo. never as high as they were that first year with slugging at ~.410+, for obvious reasons. relievers of MR-quality and probably lower seem to be a bit more sensitive to whatever accounts for the elevated runs scored in the statistics. probably the sp, too... you may want to reduc HR from default, after an auto-calc start reducing HR ltm by a certain amount and tweak that amount over time as you learn what you need... making a couple assumptions that this relates... if not, nevermind. FYI: if you drop HR, you are adding to balls in play and increasing BABIP... you need to either asjust the League Total for babip or adjust balls in play or hits another equal oppposing way. i think those LT#s are supposed to jive for best results. stick to LTM even if the # is not what you want - the LTM can get it there, alone. it's easier, midstream. if you auto-calc and can do so after an LT-change, it's no biggie. Last edited by NoOne; 04-11-2017 at 06:54 PM.

04-11-2017, 06:50 PM	#18
chazzycat All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 1,685	Are you changing the default team strategy at all for relievers? I always bump the "favor L/R matchups" slider way up, seems to help.