Strategy for Loading Bases

battists · 09-02-2018, 07:27 PM

Soooo, in this modern day and age of sabremetrics and all of that, does one ever walk someone to load the bases?

If so, in what scenarios do you guys consider doing this?

Curve Ball Dave · 09-02-2018, 07:36 PM

If there are runners on second and third and less than two outs, loading the bases sets up a force everywhere. You're ground ball away from a double play. As long as you aren't putting a potential tying or winning run on base there's no harm in putting a guy on first to load 'em to set up the force.

battists · 09-02-2018, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curve Ball Dave

If there are runners on second and third and less than two outs, loading the bases sets up a force everywhere. You're ground ball away from a double play. As long as you aren't putting a potential tying or winning run on base there's no harm in putting a guy on first to load 'em to set up the force.

Perfect, thanks.

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ThePretender · 09-02-2018, 08:42 PM

I would put the go ahead run on if it meant I faced a significantly weaker hitter. Like if I'm facing the Angels and Trout is up, I'd IBB him even if he's the go ahead run because I know I'm way more likely to get the other hitter out.

But yes it's a situation where 2 runners on (any bases, not just second or third) to make force outs everywhere, and to face an inferior hitter. I also don't care how many outs there are. I'd be more concerned with who is hitting and who I'm avoiding giving a chance to drive in the runs.

Westheim · 09-02-2018, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curve Ball Dave

If there are runners on second and third and less than two outs, loading the bases sets up a force everywhere. You're ground ball away from a double play. As long as you aren't putting a potential tying or winning run on base there's no harm in putting a guy on first to load 'em to set up the force.

I don't believe in that stuff of "don't put the tying or go-ahead run on base". If I'm ahead by two runs in the bottom 9th, tying runs in scoring position and two outs, and their monster slugger is at the plate, that guy gets walked as long as I can either get a weaker bat up, or can get a platoon advantage for my pitcher. I'm not trying to not lose, I'm trying to win.

Curve Ball Dave · 09-02-2018, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

I don't believe in that stuff of "don't put the tying or go-ahead run on base". If I'm ahead by two runs in the bottom 9th, tying runs in scoring position and two outs, and their monster slugger is at the plate, that guy gets walked as long as I can either get a weaker bat up, or can get a platoon advantage for my pitcher. I'm not trying to not lose, I'm trying to win.

I don't disagree. If it means skipping the team's best hitter to face the weakest, go ahead and put the tying or winning run on. Everything depends on the situation. All things being equal you don't put those runs on, but circumstances may mean it's the wiser choice.

RchW · 09-03-2018, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by battists

Soooo, in this modern day and age of sabremetrics and all of that, does one ever walk someone to load the bases?

If so, in what scenarios do you guys consider doing this?

Modern day data collection confirms (edit what was already known) the strategic advantage of getting a force at any base. Baseball is about getting outs when on defense and not to get out when on offense.

Drstrangelove · 09-03-2018, 11:50 AM

Not exactly the same question, but of some historical note, but players have also been intentionally walked to avoid allowing them to bat simply because the manager didn't want them to possibly get a hit. This has been done to stop a player from winning a homer or batting title (iirc, Cobb or Ott), and also more recently done to stop a player from breaking Oh's single season home run record.

Juggernt · 09-04-2018, 12:41 PM

Barry Bonds was once walked with the bases loaded with two out in the ninth, the other team having a two-run lead.

dbqs · 09-04-2018, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juggernt

Barry Bonds was once walked with the bases loaded with two out in the ninth, the other team having a two-run lead.

Yup... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi7IPZAcP78

Of course, both the Yankees and D-backs won the WS after firing him and now ol' Buck is now managing a 40-98 team, so feel free to question his strategy and if it works for you. Lolz

sc_superstar · 09-04-2018, 01:18 PM

best part of that video...the tv broadcast shows IBB leaders and in 2nd place is Mark McGwife

Westheim · 09-04-2018, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbqs

Yup... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi7IPZAcP78

Of course, both the Yankees and D-backs won the WS after firing him and now ol' Buck is now managing a 40-98 team, so feel free to question his strategy and if it works for you. Lolz

I think his strategy worked perfectly well in that situation...

dbqs · 09-04-2018, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

I think his strategy worked perfectly well in that situation...

For sure, just taking cheap shots at Showalter.

texasmame · 09-04-2018, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by battists

Soooo, in this modern day and age of sabremetrics and all of that, does one ever walk someone to load the bases?

If so, in what scenarios do you guys consider doing this?

Pitcher up next and they are unlikely to pull him. Heck, I've plunked two consecutive hitters, loading the bases, just to face the pitcher.

Dyzalot · 09-04-2018, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by battists

Soooo, in this modern day and age of sabremetrics and all of that, does one ever walk someone to load the bases?

If so, in what scenarios do you guys consider doing this?

Tie game, bottom of the 15th, other team is out of position players on the bench, runners on 1st & 2nd with your standard "light hitting" #8 hitter up and a relief pitcher with less than 5 career MLB PA on deck. I think the play there is to walk the bases loaded even without the base open and pitch to the pitcher.

Curve Ball Dave · 09-04-2018, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dyzalot

Tie game, bottom of the 15th, other team is out of position players on the bench, runners on 1st & 2nd with your standard "light hitting" #8 hitter up and a relief pitcher with less than 5 career MLB PA on deck. I think the play there is to walk the bases loaded even without the base open and pitch to the pitcher.

Yep, it all depends on the situation.

Another scenario for the offense: runners on first and third and your best hitter is up. The last thing you want to do is steal second to make it second and third even if the defense gives you the base and even if that means eliminating the force at second. The play is put the hitter on to load 'em and take your chances with the next guy. Stealing the base takes the bat out of your best hitter's hands.

This is the beauty of baseball. Every decision depends on the situation.

RchW · 09-06-2018, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbqs

For sure, just taking cheap shots at Showalter.

An honorable pursuit.

Brad K · 09-07-2018, 05:00 AM

I only walk players if their run doesn't matter

Orioles123 · 09-07-2018, 05:45 AM

Dont walk unless you are for sure okay with giving up a walk off.

Tom the Fish · 09-07-2018, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drstrangelove

...also more recently done to stop a player from breaking Oh's single season home run record.

poor randy bass.

they couldn't stop this guy tho!

and
i
was
there!

09-02-2018, 07:27 PM	#1
battists Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 18,506 Blog Entries: 7	Strategy for Loading Bases Soooo, in this modern day and age of sabremetrics and all of that, does one ever walk someone to load the bases? If so, in what scenarios do you guys consider doing this? __________________ Come check out my dynasty report, Funky Times!

09-02-2018, 07:36 PM	#2
Curve Ball Dave Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,272	If there are runners on second and third and less than two outs, loading the bases sets up a force everywhere. You're ground ball away from a double play. As long as you aren't putting a potential tying or winning run on base there's no harm in putting a guy on first to load 'em to set up the force. __________________ "Hitting is timing. Pitching is upsetting timing"-Warren Spahn.

09-02-2018, 08:42 PM	#4
ThePretender All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,303	I would put the go ahead run on if it meant I faced a significantly weaker hitter. Like if I'm facing the Angels and Trout is up, I'd IBB him even if he's the go ahead run because I know I'm way more likely to get the other hitter out. But yes it's a situation where 2 runners on (any bases, not just second or third) to make force outs everywhere, and to face an inferior hitter. I also don't care how many outs there are. I'd be more concerned with who is hitting and who I'm avoiding giving a chance to drive in the runs. Last edited by ThePretender; 09-02-2018 at 08:43 PM.

09-03-2018, 11:50 AM	#8
Drstrangelove Major Leagues Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 346	Not exactly the same question, but of some historical note, but players have also been intentionally walked to avoid allowing them to bat simply because the manager didn't want them to possibly get a hit. This has been done to stop a player from winning a homer or batting title (iirc, Cobb or Ott), and also more recently done to stop a player from breaking Oh's single season home run record.

09-04-2018, 12:41 PM	#9
Juggernt Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 357	Barry Bonds was once walked with the bases loaded with two out in the ninth, the other team having a two-run lead.

09-04-2018, 01:18 PM	#11
sc_superstar Major Leagues Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 407	best part of that video...the tv broadcast shows IBB leaders and in 2nd place is Mark McGwife

09-07-2018, 05:00 AM	#18
Brad K Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2016 Location: St Petersburg Florida USA Posts: 5,442	I only walk players if their run doesn't matter

09-07-2018, 05:45 AM	#19
Orioles123 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 60	Dont walk unless you are for sure okay with giving up a walk off.