NFL 2019 Thread

[damientheomen3]

Originally Posted by Boomcoach

Completely agree. If you team is awful, you are better off building from the line out. You get a decent line, on both sides of the ball, and everyone else you have gets better. Build your core, then go for a QB.

Special mention should go to the Lions who spent several years trying to build from the wide receiver position first. That makes tanking for a QB look like a genius move!

While I agree with your first sentiment, there are a couple reasons teams don't do this:

1. Offensive linemen are tough evaluations and ofren take time to develop, more than most positions.

2. Front offices and coaching staffs have less time than ever to build up before they get ****canned.

3. The Rams set the blueprint for how to take your QB first and build out afterwards and the NFL is a copycat league. It has since been proven by teams like the Jets and Bears that it's not so easy, and it helps if you have a future DPOTY on the roster, along with an underrated OT and top-flight WR you can go get in trade or FA.

[damientheomen3]

Trola, is the Cleveland Browns job considered desirable, I wonder? Baker regressed heavily despite being surrounded with a ton of talent. And of course the ego management of that roster seems like a nightmare. They're interested in Josh McDaniels, I wonder if he'd consider taking that job considering the tools he'd have to operate with on offense.

I for one think the Browns should avoid the glorified offensive coordinator trend and get someone that'll get that locker room in line. The only struggle with that is all I can think of as far as available candidates would be retreads (Ron Rivera, who's apparently Washington-bound, Mike McCarthy, Chuck Pagano). Maybe they hire Tom Coughlin to be the ballboy.

[pilight]

Originally Posted by damientheomen3

The Rams set the blueprint for how to take your QB first and build out afterwards

And they've still missed the playoffs half the time since drafting Goff and are stuck wondering if his regression this season is a harbinger.

[damientheomen3]

Originally Posted by pilight

And they've still missed the playoffs half the time since drafting Goff and are stuck wondering if his regression this season is a harbinger.

That blueprint was set in years 2-4, so it got them to the playoffs twice and into a super bowl. The issue with the team is that they're constantly trading picks for players and signing expensive extensions, so their depth is atrocious. In 2018 they were very healthy, this past season not so much and it showed in the results.

I'm not saying it's an ideal blueprint, but at the end of the day they turned a directionless franchise into a Super Bowl team in 2 years. When 2-4 years seems to be the limit to the time most team builders get, it stands to reason that teams will try it.

[Déjà Bru]

I feel sorry for Pat Shurmur. Not only 9-23 with the Giants but a similar lack of success with the Browns years ago. With a career record of 18-46 the cards are stacked against him getting another NFL coaching job.

It's always the easiest thing to do, firing the coach, but I fail to see how much better anybody could have done with the Giants these past two years. They are a young, inexperienced team and it wasn't a matter of uninspired play or bad coaching that lost all those games; they just weren't good enough to win, particularly the defense.

The next easiest thing to do is to fire the general manager.

[damientheomen3]

Agreed Bru. The Giants had a lot of fight and imo Shurmur got that roster to play above its talent level. He deserved another shot at it, instead Gettleman stays so he can pick another defensive lineman in the first round.

[Déjà Bru]

Originally Posted by damientheomen3

Agreed Bru. The Giants had a lot of fight and imo Shurmur got that roster to play above its talent level. He deserved another shot at it, instead Gettleman stays so he can pick another defensive lineman in the first round.

Another perspective here:



http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=28395853

It's nonsense like this that has me avoiding sports talk shows like the plague. Even if what he is saying is true, the way he says it with such phony vituperation make me ill. He's not worked up; he's putting on a show at another man's expense. Hopefully if and when he gets fired, somebody will do a similar piece on him.

[dkgo]

it's stephen a smith everything he says is nonsense meant to get people talking

shurmur didnt have much chance given gettlemans awful drafting and general idiocy, but at the same time hasn't done much to prove he's worth keeping

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

Name one coach who has done a better job than Brian Flores.

To be honest, I think Mike Tomlin did a hell of a job with the hand he's been dealt. He almost got that crap sandwich to the playoffs.

Originally Posted by ForeverRoyalKC

Boy....not much rumbling from Dallas. Is it possible? Dare I say? Can it be?
Jason Garrett's job is....*gulp*......*hack*........SAFE?!

Maybe they still keep him, but Jerruh calls the shots on coordinators?

Garrett gone? I'll believe it when I see it. I wouldn't put a dime on it. Hopefully a new coach will bring in his own coordinators. You're not going to get much interest if you don't let them do that.

Originally Posted by Boomcoach

Completely agree. If you team is awful, you are better off building from the line out. You get a decent line, on both sides of the ball, and everyone else you have gets better. Build your core, then go for a QB.

Special mention should go to the Lions who spent several years trying to build from the wide receiver position first. That makes tanking for a QB look like a genius move!

Glad you brought this up. In fact, I never hear anyone bring this up. I'd be the most boring GM in the entire draft as I would draft OL and DL for the first 2 rounds almost every year. Can't have enough of them. That is not to say I wouldn't break protocol now and then. When the opportunity presents itself.

Originally Posted by damientheomen3

The Jets have taken three first round QBs since 2000, and Darnold wasn't perceived as a shaky prospect (although he should have been, he just got the USC bump). Same with the Bills and Cardinals (who obviously look worse by taking two in consecutive years). Washington has picked four but also traded away two firsts to get RGIII. And then Cleveland has picked 4, couldn't think of any others.

Overall I'd say the only teams that feel egregious in retrospect, at least in the last 20 years, are Washington and Cleveland. For reference, Miami has taken one first round QB in the last 20 and it hasn't meant anything for them.

I am probably a little too hard on Darnold. I still think he can be a good QB. It's hard to judge him with what he has right now. I think he can improve. But right now he's a level below Ryan Fitzpatrick He's too reckless.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Hrycaj

Your comment about the Lions is spot on. I just want to add that when the Lions were doing stuff like that they were always receiving top grades for their drafts from “experts”. My larger point here is I think winning the media/social media perception game is a larger focus than it should be with a lot of organizations. Look at this year. If the Bengals do not take Joe Burrows with the top pick they are going to get slayed. Yet, like you pointed out they probably do not have the pieces around him to allow him to be successful. So the cycle continues.

Agree. That's why you draft him and let him sit behind a vet a few years until you have the pieces. But an owner has to let a coach know he will get that kind of leeway.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by damientheomen3

Trola, is the Cleveland Browns job considered desirable, I wonder? Baker regressed heavily despite being surrounded with a ton of talent. And of course the ego management of that roster seems like a nightmare. They're interested in Josh McDaniels, I wonder if he'd consider taking that job considering the tools he'd have to operate with on offense.

Does it have to be Baker's fault? If you look at the all 22 and see what the Browns are trying to do, you might not think that. Mayfield doesn't design the plays, he just runs what's given to him. IMO whoever is running that show has a lofty opinion of their personnel.

The Browns don't have a solid offensive line, they knew that going in. Yet they run a lot of time consuming deep crossing routes. What do they use for a check down? their RB, but only if the offensive line is holding their own. If the RB is needed to pass block there is no check down option unless Baker just throws it away. It's a laughable system. I guess it could be effective if your OL was all pro from T to T.

[Rizon]

Stat of the Day: Ryan Fitzpatrick lead the Dolphins in rushing for 2019 with 243 yards.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by Rizon

Stat of the Day: Ryan Fitzpatrick lead the Dolphins in rushing for 2019 with 243 yards.

Lamar's brotha from anotha motha.

[damientheomen3]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Does it have to be Baker's fault? If you look at the all 22 and see what the Browns are trying to do, you might not think that. Mayfield doesn't design the plays, he just runs what's given to him. IMO whoever is running that show has a lofty opinion of their personnel.

The Browns don't have a solid offensive line, they knew that going in. Yet they run a lot of time consuming deep crossing routes. What do they use for a check down? their RB, but only if the offensive line is holding their own. If the RB is needed to pass block there is no check down option unless Baker just throws it away. It's a laughable system. I guess it could be effective if your OL was all pro from T to T.

Baker's average time to throw this season was one of the highest in the league despite the terrible O-Line, meaning he wasn't being decisive and inviting pressure. Could still be on the playcalling, but he showed a heavy tendency to drift right in the first half of the season even when the protection was good, and defenses picked up on it.

In the Bengals game, his average dropback was timed at 3.9 seconds, the second highest average in a game that PFF could find in their 11 or 12 years grading every game. Average is 2.5 seconds and 3 is considered high.

Baker also had awful interception luck this year, quite a few where guys fell or had the ball tick off their hands and into a defender's. He was generally less accurate than he had been in any past season, college or rookie year, according to the PFF guys. Obviously they need a better O-Line, but what I'd be really concerned with is coachability. With his penchant to snap at people every other week and the fact he said he already knows exactly what he needs to fix, well, I hope for their sake that he's right.

[damientheomen3]

So a prominent Jets beat writer wrote a scathing piece last week on Adam Gase, saying things like Gase responding to unapproving fans by saying he's "rich as ****" and asserting that people within the organization believe Gase or a family member has a burner twitter account to blindly defend him.

That same beat writer went to post his next article on social media, but he forgot to switch to his main account before doing so. As soon as he realized he deleted the tweet and the account, and posted the exact same tweet and link from his main account. Never a dull day in Jets land.

[Cobra Mgr]

[ukhotstove]

I've never understood some franchises in the 4 US sports or teams in other sports, there car crash mentality bemuse me. I mean if I do something wrong I figure another way to do it or someone will give me advice on how to do it right, franchises like the Browns seem to do it wrong over and over again. End of the day it all begins and ends with the owners, these owners usually run successful businesses so why can't they in sports.

[pilight]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

these owners usually run successful businesses so why can't they in sports.

Many of them, like Browns owner Jimmy Haslam, inherited already successful businesses and run them by not rocking the boat.

[Bluenoser]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

these owners usually run successful businesses so why can't they in sports.

They are - sports is like everything else in the world now, winning isn't measured on the field, it's measured on spreadsheets.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

End of the day it all begins and ends with the owners, these owners usually run successful businesses so why can't they in sports.

I'll tell you exactly why, In any other business, your employees present your product or service. In sports, your employees are your product and service. You can set protocols & quality control on a product. You can't do that w/people. Like in the Matrix, people will reject "perfection". Because perfection is subjective to each individual. The product on the field is not governed by the rules of business.