The AI Still Cheats! - Page 3

vukomanovic · 07-06-2017, 03:23 PM

I don't know if it cheats or not, but i've realized that when the AI has decided it's going to win a game, it's going to win a game.

I only play with the Reds, so i know they suck, but i was the playing the even worse - on the game - Braves. I was 6 games over 500, they were like 5 under. My pitcher's got 4 stars. They got Dickey and an empty bullpen. Rain delay of like an hour after the second inning and they beat me 15-12. With an empty bullpen and Dickey pulled out in the 3rd. Ozzie Albies with an OPS+ of 80 in AA got 5 hits and a walk. My closer - pretty reliable all season - surrenders 4 hits to mostly .180 batting average guys. I mean... When I managed to tie the game, their mighty bottom of the lineup destroys my closer... after hitting Iglesias in the sixth for 3 or 4 runs..

sreem · 07-06-2017, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vukomanovic

I don't know if it cheats or not, but i've realized that when the AI has decided it's going to win a game, it's going to win a game.

The AI doesn't "decide" to win. The engine is entirely based on probability based rolls with factor sets and opposing input offsets. Chance and luck play into it too.

I believe what you are experiencing is called confirmation bias and "Fandom". It's hard to see your team lose when everything points to winning, but, it happens. It happens all the time in real life, and so it happens all the time in this SIMULATION. If you prefer to always win when your team has the higher ratings than the other team, might I suggest you try MLB The SHOW, or some other arcade style baseball game.

I apologize in advance if this response seems antagonistic or rude, I do not mean it to be. It can be hard to convey intent in writing. I truly do empathize with you, as I have gone through the same feelings over the years.

vukomanovic · 07-06-2017, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sreem

The AI doesn't "decide" to win. The engine is entirely based on probability based rolls with factor sets and opposing input offsets. Chance and luck play into it too.

I believe what you are experiencing is called confirmation bias and "Fandom". It's hard to see your team lose when everything points to winning, but, it happens. It happens all the time in real life, and so it happens all the time in this SIMULATION. If you prefer to always win when your team has the higher ratings than the other team, might I suggest you try MLB The SHOW, or some other arcade style baseball game.

I apologize in advance if this response seems antagonistic or rude, I do not mean it to be. It can be hard to convey intent in writing. I truly do empathize with you, as I have gone through the same feelings over the years.

Quite the opposite, actually, or i wouldn't play with the Reds every single time in every single OOTP, haha.

But an empty bullpen for 6 innings seems too much to me, sorry.

curt · 07-06-2017, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vukomanovic

Quite the opposite, actually, or i wouldn't play with the Reds every single time in every single OOTP, haha.

But an empty bullpen for 6 innings seems too much to me, sorry.

There may be a AI steroid cheat involved here.

sreem · 07-07-2017, 11:03 AM

Okay, you are right, it cheats. I tried to convince you mostly to convince myself, but it is just to obvious. If I sim games, my team plays to expectations, but if I play out the game, my #3 ranked offense can't hit and my %$*@ pitching staff is worthless.

I am about to rage blow up my team, and promote the entire AAA roster!

I mean, come on, Billy freaking Burns?!?!?!?

sreem · 07-07-2017, 11:10 AM

It's like, last season we had good pitching, but couldn't hit. This year, with the exact same core group of players (My big offseason move was RE-SIGNING JD Martinez) we are killing it with the bats and the entire pitching staff is "Nuke" Laloosh!! I think the AI knows I'm tip-toeing on the edge, and it's laughing at me......

sreem · 07-07-2017, 11:37 AM

Okay, nevermind. We just beat the Indians 6 -1. I think this game is fair.

rjl518 · 07-08-2017, 08:34 AM

Nice to know that there are others that agree with me.
Yes, my Mets season is still going and I'm still having fun.
But it still doesn't matter.
The AI Cheats it's A$$ off!

drhay53 · 07-08-2017, 12:38 PM

whether serious or not, I have watched nearly 2000 games of OOTP in '17 and '18 and I can say unequivocally "thats just baseball". There is no cheating, sorry, get over it if you believe that.

DizzyDean · 07-14-2017, 01:46 PM

Sounds like the real Mets to me!

r0nster · 07-17-2017, 07:44 PM

we ALL have had games where we want to throw the computer out the window when something crazy happens. As much as its agony of defeat is the thrill of victory

Danius · 07-21-2017, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sreem

Okay, nevermind. We just beat the Indians 6 -1. I think this game is fair.

Not if Justin Verlander was pitching. If so, the game cheated in your favor.

rjl518 · 07-22-2017, 07:31 PM

The OOTP AI is a backstabbing, malevolent, conniving, underhanded CHEATER!!!
I love this game, but when you play out the games, you are at the mercy of a merciless AI!

CeeBod · 10-09-2017, 09:24 PM

Personally I think that the AI cheats in the name of balance - in order to keep all of the season totals looking reasonable, I would imagine that there is some element of code that kicks in from time to time to help regress some of the numbers back to the mean. Often this means that the AI "cheats" in the player's favour, but it's the times that it "cheats" against the player that stick in the craw and tempt the Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit!

In my current playthrough, I was trying very hard to play every game and avoid ragequitting, but sometimes the balancing / cheating is just too outrageous:

I replaced my starter, who was in the middle of a season where he was selected for the all-star game, in the 4th inning after he'd given up 8 runs, 6 of them earned. Pretty bad day, but that happens. My opponent then continued hitting the snot out off every pitch and beat up my bullpen to the tune of scoring another 6 runs over the next 2 innings. That had me annoyed, but again **** happens, and trying to manage an overtaxed bullpen through the next few games is part of the challenge of everyday playing. At the same time this was happening though, the starting pitcher for my opponent had a no-hitter going through 7 innings! For those things to happen in the same game was pretty unbelievable. Considering that it was a 1 star pitcher who'd played mostly at AAA level, and had a career ERA over 7.00 my reaction was at WTF levels! I finally Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit in the bottom of the 7th when the following happened: Their lead-off man hit a routine grounder to my sure-handed 2nd baseman, who muffed it. He advanced to 2nd on a pick-off error. He advanced to 3rd on a balk, and then he scored on a wild pitch! That was the straw that broke the camel's back!

Unfortunately having ragequit one game it's suddenly too easy to do it again, and I found myself doing it this morning after 3 batters, and my reaction to seeing all 3 get extra base hits was just "Nope!"

I <3 this game, but you need the serenity of a saint to get through a full season of playing every game without rage-quitting!

drowssap · 10-09-2017, 10:39 PM

I always get mad at the September bloodbath that is my team if I am anywhere CLOSE to the playoffs. It's like Final Destination in the clubhouse.

curt · 10-10-2017, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by curt

I've felt like that 2 seasons in a row. 1st time I fought my butt off to make playoffs. I tied for the final widcard with a team I beat all year. I lost 9-1 in wildcard. My team didn't show. This year I had the best team all year with 108 wins. Won the first playoff game and was destroyed in the next three. I was angry and depressed for a week. And I too questioned the AI cheating!!!!!!!

This season, the AI cheated for me. 3rd year now in my fictional league and I won the championship!!!!!! Me and the AI dominated

PSUColonel · 10-11-2017, 12:28 PM

This thread is something similar to what you might find on the Football Manager boards over at SI.

curt · 10-11-2017, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

This thread is something similar to what you might find on the Football Manager boards over at SI.

Is that a good or bad thing?

Sweed · 10-11-2017, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CeeBod

Personally I think that the AI cheats in the name of balance - in order to keep all of the season totals looking reasonable, I would imagine that there is some element of code that kicks in from time to time to help regress some of the numbers back to the mean. Often this means that the AI "cheats" in the player's favour, but it's the times that it "cheats" against the player that stick in the craw and tempt the Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit!

In my current playthrough, I was trying very hard to play every game and avoid ragequitting, but sometimes the balancing / cheating is just too outrageous:

I replaced my starter, who was in the middle of a season where he was selected for the all-star game, in the 4th inning after he'd given up 8 runs, 6 of them earned. Pretty bad day, but that happens. My opponent then continued hitting the snot out off every pitch and beat up my bullpen to the tune of scoring another 6 runs over the next 2 innings. That had me annoyed, but again **** happens, and trying to manage an overtaxed bullpen through the next few games is part of the challenge of everyday playing. At the same time this was happening though, the starting pitcher for my opponent had a no-hitter going through 7 innings! For those things to happen in the same game was pretty unbelievable. Considering that it was a 1 star pitcher who'd played mostly at AAA level, and had a career ERA over 7.00 my reaction was at WTF levels! I finally Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit in the bottom of the 7th when the following happened: Their lead-off man hit a routine grounder to my sure-handed 2nd baseman, who muffed it. He advanced to 2nd on a pick-off error. He advanced to 3rd on a balk, and then he scored on a wild pitch! That was the straw that broke the camel's back!

Unfortunately having ragequit one game it's suddenly too easy to do it again, and I found myself doing it this morning after 3 batters, and my reaction to seeing all 3 get extra base hits was just "Nope!"

I <3 this game, but you need the serenity of a saint to get through a full season of playing every game without rage-quitting!

So in other words in a post titled "Cheating AI" in a thread titled "The AI Still Cheats" you tell us all how you cheat.

Sweed · 10-11-2017, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

This thread is something similar to what you might find on the Football Manager boards over at SI.

Quote:

Originally Posted by curt

Is that a good or bad thing?

It is your basic "I lost so the AI cheats" thread. Nothing more, nothing less and no difference if posted here or at the FM board.

Not a good thing since neither game cheats.

07-07-2017, 11:03 AM	#45
sreem All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 673	Okay, you are right, it cheats. I tried to convince you mostly to convince myself, but it is just to obvious. If I sim games, my team plays to expectations, but if I play out the game, my #3 ranked offense can't hit and my %$*@ pitching staff is worthless. I am about to rage blow up my team, and promote the entire AAA roster! I mean, come on, Billy freaking Burns?!?!?!? Attached Images __________________ "What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger. Except for bears....."

07-07-2017, 11:10 AM	#46
sreem All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 673	It's like, last season we had good pitching, but couldn't hit. This year, with the exact same core group of players (My big offseason move was RE-SIGNING JD Martinez) we are killing it with the bats and the entire pitching staff is "Nuke" Laloosh!! I think the AI knows I'm tip-toeing on the edge, and it's laughing at me...... __________________ "What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger. Except for bears....."

07-07-2017, 11:37 AM	#47
sreem All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 673	Okay, nevermind. We just beat the Indians 6 -1. I think this game is fair. __________________ "What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger. Except for bears....."

07-08-2017, 08:34 AM	#48
rjl518 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Born in Shea Stadium, lives in LoanDepot Park. Posts: 6,240	Nice to know that there are others that agree with me. Yes, my Mets season is still going and I'm still having fun. But it still doesn't matter. The AI Cheats it's A$$ off! __________________ My Threads: MLB Project 32 by SFGiants58 "Colon looking for his 1st hit of the year and he DRIVES ONE! Deep left field! Back goes Upton! Back near the wall! ITS OUTTA HERE!!! Bartolo has done it!!! THE IMPOSSIBLE HAS HAPPENED!!! This is one of the great moments in the history of baseball! Bartolo Colon has gone deep!" ---Gary Cohen. (May 7, 2016) (Petco Park) NYM 6 @ SD 3

07-22-2017, 07:31 PM	#53
rjl518 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Born in Shea Stadium, lives in LoanDepot Park. Posts: 6,240	The OOTP AI is a backstabbing, malevolent, conniving, underhanded CHEATER!!! I love this game, but when you play out the games, you are at the mercy of a merciless AI! __________________ My Threads: MLB Project 32 by SFGiants58 "Colon looking for his 1st hit of the year and he DRIVES ONE! Deep left field! Back goes Upton! Back near the wall! ITS OUTTA HERE!!! Bartolo has done it!!! THE IMPOSSIBLE HAS HAPPENED!!! This is one of the great moments in the history of baseball! Bartolo Colon has gone deep!" ---Gary Cohen. (May 7, 2016) (Petco Park) NYM 6 @ SD 3 Last edited by rjl518; 07-22-2017 at 07:33 PM.

07-06-2017, 03:23 PM	#41
vukomanovic Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Madrid, España Posts: 73	I don't know if it cheats or not, but i've realized that when the AI has decided it's going to win a game, it's going to win a game. I only play with the Reds, so i know they suck, but i was the playing the even worse - on the game - Braves. I was 6 games over 500, they were like 5 under. My pitcher's got 4 stars. They got Dickey and an empty bullpen. Rain delay of like an hour after the second inning and they beat me 15-12. With an empty bullpen and Dickey pulled out in the 3rd. Ozzie Albies with an OPS+ of 80 in AA got 5 hits and a walk. My closer - pretty reliable all season - surrenders 4 hits to mostly .180 batting average guys. I mean... When I managed to tie the game, their mighty bottom of the lineup destroys my closer... after hitting Iglesias in the sixth for 3 or 4 runs..

07-08-2017, 12:38 PM	#49
drhay53 Major Leagues Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 355	whether serious or not, I have watched nearly 2000 games of OOTP in '17 and '18 and I can say unequivocally "thats just baseball". There is no cheating, sorry, get over it if you believe that.

07-14-2017, 01:46 PM	#50
DizzyDean Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2017 Posts: 6	Sounds like the real Mets to me!

07-17-2017, 07:44 PM	#51
r0nster Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 3,002	we ALL have had games where we want to throw the computer out the window when something crazy happens. As much as its agony of defeat is the thrill of victory

10-09-2017, 09:24 PM	#54
CeeBod Bat Boy Join Date: May 2015 Posts: 17	Cheating AI Personally I think that the AI cheats in the name of balance - in order to keep all of the season totals looking reasonable, I would imagine that there is some element of code that kicks in from time to time to help regress some of the numbers back to the mean. Often this means that the AI "cheats" in the player's favour, but it's the times that it "cheats" against the player that stick in the craw and tempt the Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit! In my current playthrough, I was trying very hard to play every game and avoid ragequitting, but sometimes the balancing / cheating is just too outrageous: I replaced my starter, who was in the middle of a season where he was selected for the all-star game, in the 4th inning after he'd given up 8 runs, 6 of them earned. Pretty bad day, but that happens. My opponent then continued hitting the snot out off every pitch and beat up my bullpen to the tune of scoring another 6 runs over the next 2 innings. That had me annoyed, but again **** happens, and trying to manage an overtaxed bullpen through the next few games is part of the challenge of everyday playing. At the same time this was happening though, the starting pitcher for my opponent had a no-hitter going through 7 innings! For those things to happen in the same game was pretty unbelievable. Considering that it was a 1 star pitcher who'd played mostly at AAA level, and had a career ERA over 7.00 my reaction was at WTF levels! I finally Ctrl-Alt-Del ragequit in the bottom of the 7th when the following happened: Their lead-off man hit a routine grounder to my sure-handed 2nd baseman, who muffed it. He advanced to 2nd on a pick-off error. He advanced to 3rd on a balk, and then he scored on a wild pitch! That was the straw that broke the camel's back! Unfortunately having ragequit one game it's suddenly too easy to do it again, and I found myself doing it this morning after 3 batters, and my reaction to seeing all 3 get extra base hits was just "Nope!" I <3 this game, but you need the serenity of a saint to get through a full season of playing every game without rage-quitting!

10-09-2017, 10:39 PM	#55
drowssap Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 110	I always get mad at the September bloodbath that is my team if I am anywhere CLOSE to the playoffs. It's like Final Destination in the clubhouse.

10-11-2017, 12:28 PM	#57
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 12,989 Blog Entries: 37	This thread is something similar to what you might find on the Football Manager boards over at SI.