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Old 09-12-2019, 10:08 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orcin View Post
You don't have to explain anything to the community, only the developers if and when they ask.
Unless one of the self-appointed morality police decides to post a screenshot of your roster, as has happened from time to time...
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Old 09-12-2019, 10:45 AM   #22
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I really REALLY wish the Devs would insert some kind of code that limited the degree to which someone could tank - AND provide a "reset" button to start over if you wanted to. ALL this continuous moaning about tanking would finally go away and the Devs wouldn't have to look at every little complaint.
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Old 09-12-2019, 12:56 PM   #23
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Well...

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If this were true, I would have been able to set my Bob Gibson as a 2 Way Player to take advantage of his surprisingly high speed as a pinch runner on my incredibly slow team. The game prevented me from doing this.
I said position players pitching, not pitchers playing positions. Sidebar: I wish we had no DH in PT, so that pitcher hitting could be a factor. It'd be great to have a Slugging Pitchers collection...
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:53 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by BigRed75 View Post
Unless one of the self-appointed morality police decides to post a screenshot of your roster, as has happened from time to time...
That roster screenshot would not require a response. It can simply be ignored.
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Old 09-12-2019, 09:26 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Orcin View Post
That roster screenshot would not require a response. It can simply be ignored.
It *would* require a response if you are not tanking, if you are running a theme team, but the morality police feel otherwise and you don't want your good name besmerched.

There's a reason Willie M's quote is in my sig file.
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Old 09-12-2019, 11:26 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by BigRed75 View Post
It *would* require a response if you are not tanking, if you are running a theme team, but the morality police feel otherwise and you don't want your good name besmerched.

There's a reason Willie M's quote is in my sig file.

That would be your choice, but not a requirement to avoid sanctions.
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Old 09-13-2019, 08:31 AM   #27
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"You gotta dance with the one that brung ya," (or better.) If you don't, you are tanking.
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Old 09-13-2019, 09:07 AM   #28
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These last 5 comments are exactly what I mean... if the game restricted itself by code on what was allowed, there would be no reason for these comments.
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Old 09-13-2019, 12:42 PM   #29
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These last 5 comments are exactly what I mean... if the game restricted itself by code on what was allowed, there would be no reason for these comments.
Further, if the game allows itself to be played in certain ways, then it should be expected that the game WILL be played in those certain ways.
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Old 09-13-2019, 12:50 PM   #30
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When you have to

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It *would* require a response if you are not tanking, if you are running a theme team, but the morality police feel otherwise and you don't want your good name besmerched.

There's a reason Willie M's quote is in my sig file.
call it the "Morality Police", you're de facto admitting that the conduct is immoral—hence wrong. Thanks fo settling this debate so succinctly.
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Old 09-13-2019, 03:24 PM   #31
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call it the "Morality Police", you're de facto admitting that the conduct is immoral—hence wrong. Thanks fo settling this debate so succinctly.
I continue to be surprised, though I guess I shouldn't, at the number of broken moral compasses these days. I was amazed to read that many of the people posting in another game forum said that rules were only to be followed by those who choose to follow them. For the most part (on the other forum), those who do follow rules are the ones getting the ridicule.
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Old 09-13-2019, 11:47 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed75 View Post
It *would* require a response if you are not tanking, if you are running a theme team, but the morality police feel otherwise and you don't want your good name besmerched.

There's a reason Willie M's quote is in my sig file.
I am honored.
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Old 09-14-2019, 09:11 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ty Cobb View Post
call it the "Morality Police", you're de facto admitting that the conduct is immoral—hence wrong. Thanks fo settling this debate so succinctly.
Um, not at all.

"Morality police" - or should I say, self-styled morality police - is a pejorative term used to characterize inflexible people who enjoy projecting their belief systems on everyone else. They tend to believe that they are always correct and those that disagree, however slightly, must be wrong. And usually punished.

"Naming and shaming" is a favorite tactic of the morality police. If they ever manage to rise to a level of real political power, generally within the confines of an autocracy or theocracy, then that shaming often graduates into pursuits such as stoning and other forms of public executions.

Trust me, you don't want to be a part of the morality police. Best case scenario, Vince McMahon lampoons you as part of a late 90s mid-card wrestling stable.
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Old 09-14-2019, 11:40 AM   #34
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I don't know why you're taking this so personally, Red. I don't think tanking is immoral, it's just expressly forbidden by the TOS and therefore I am against it. Why is that position hard to understand?

Let's say you're playing dodgeball. We all know the rules. Let's say you get clipped by a ball. Nobody notices. Are you allowed to stay in the game? Sure, but that's not part of the agreed-uppn ruleset. But, if you were allowed to stay in if nobody noticed, I'd completely agree with this decision.

Now let's say you're caught as being hit by the ball, and other people playing the game witness this happening. If you have a tantrum and refuse to leave because nobody is explicitly forcing you to sit down, is that immoral? I don't think so, it's just childish. Why sign up to play dodgeball if you weren't going to follow the rules?

Now let's complete the analogy. Let's say you're playing competitive dodgeball, one with a video review system and a judge. Let's say you get clipped by a ball, but don't think it hit you. Others did, so they ask the judge to review the footage. Are you going to call your competitors the "morality police" for just asking the judge if you got hit? What about football; are coaches the "morality police" for challenging plays made by their opponents? Are teams "morality police" for asking for investigations into e.g. contract violations, PED use, spying on playcalling, etc.? Are they all the morality police too?

At least in some of the examples I gave above, there might be some personal financial incentive to try to cheat. But why sign up to play a game, one with no stakes whatsoever, if you aren't going to follow the rules?
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Old 09-14-2019, 12:02 PM   #35
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Quote:
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Let's say you're playing competitive dodgeball, one with a video review system and a judge. Let's say you get clipped by a ball, but don't think it hit you. Others did, so they ask the judge to review the footage. Are you going to call your competitors the "morality police" for just asking the judge if you got hit?
In your analogy, the judge is the development team, not the other players. The method for asking the judge is the "report team" button in the game, not posting a screenshot of the offending roster on this forum.
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Old 09-14-2019, 12:41 PM   #36
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In your analogy, the judge is the development team, not the other players. The method for asking the judge is the "report team" button in the game, not posting a screenshot of the offending roster on this forum.
Do fans in the stands get to witness challenge replays in football/baseball/any other sport? Are those fans allowed to have opinions as to what the ruling should be? Sure, that's completely allowed and there's no problem with that. No difference here. Doesn't make any impact on the ruling of the judge either, it's just part of being a spectator to the game.

Also, I don't think team screenshots are posted *that* regularly. I can think of one recent-ish example, maybe two if I wrack my brain. It's mostly just words being exchanged like it is here.

EDIT: Also, if it wasn't clear, I do completely agree with your point.
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Old 09-14-2019, 01:20 PM   #37
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Also, I don't think team screenshots are posted *that* regularly. I can think of one recent-ish example, maybe two if I wrack my brain. It's mostly just words being exchanged like it is here.
I agree, but I was referring to this comment.

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Unless one of the self-appointed morality police decides to post a screenshot of your roster, as has happened from time to time...
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:08 PM   #38
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To me games have rules, society has laws.

If I see someone breaking into my neighbors car in clear violation of the rules/law am I the morality police for calling the cops?

Red, I have no idea why you used that term.
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:48 PM   #39
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I understand completely why Red used the term Morality Police, and it is absolutely appropriate for some of the conduct on this forum.

The issue here is that the TOS does not sufficiently and completely delineate fair and appropriate play. There is not a universal definition for cheating in this game, which is precisely the reason the admins have to deal with it on a case by case basis. This creates a lot more work as a manual investigation must be conducted, even in obvious cases where automation could streamline the corrective process or prevent the issue entirely. This also frustrates players, both those publicly accused of cheating when they don't believe they are and those who see cheating even when it may not be.
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:49 PM   #40
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Somehow, I think we keep missing the point. No one (or very few of us) are saying we shouldn't follow rules or try to take advantage of them.

But any rule that can diluted by saying "oh, in that case it's ok" isn't a rule - it's a guideline - "to be defined at a later date by the Devs".

A game can't survive that way - or at least can't survive without constantly being questioned.

As it stands now, the Devs have said under certain conditions you can take your best players off the field if you're creating a themed team, or if your going to train them at a new position, or if your going to inactivate them - but yet by definition you are also not trying as hard to win.

Whether a situation is right or wrong it becomes subjective... what's wrong today in this case may not be wrong in 2 months when something similar happens again. And in the meantime, some people here are forever posting that "that" should be allowed while others are posting "that's" against the rules"

If we want the game to be as enjoyable as possible, all this has to be clear and concise, and coding is the only way to do that. If the game allows it, it's ok.

I know the Devs don't want to hear that, but right now it's open season on the rules to define what they really mean. If winning at all costs is the only way to play this game "legally" then it won't be flexible enough to do anything but play your best 25 players. If you want the largest customer base to enjoy the game for an entire 12 months, then you have to add the coding that removes options you don't want to see happen.

My 2 cents.

The game has to stop you from doing what is not acceptable. Period.
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