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Old 02-09-2014, 01:37 PM   #41
Honorable_Pawn
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I have not played FM but from what I gather here this sounds optimal.
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Old 02-09-2014, 05:08 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by PSUColonel View Post
Expansion of generated players would include all the stats....so you would still be able to identify them. What I am proposing is similar to the non-playable leagues found in Football Manager.
are they all created one time, or historically correct?... i actually enjoy seeing how the 16 y.o who tore the league in his 2nd year does the following.

not a major issue if not, just curious...
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Old 02-09-2014, 05:33 PM   #43
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yes, I think it would be better in leu of feeders. Draft eligible player generation should be deeply expanded upon, rather than having feeders.
See, this is what I don't get and don't like.

I have no problem with getting the draft classes expanded as you're requesting.

What I do have a problem with, is asking for Feeders to be taken out of the game. They're optional, nobody is forcing you to use them.

I'm sorry, but not everybody is in the "I don't like Feeders" group.

Personally, I like them and hope they stay. I don't use them all the time, but when I do I like the control I have over them.

I never have a problem with the talent being out of whack, but then I don't mind spending time setting them up either.


Feel free to continue your quest for improvements to the draft classes, but please don't assume everybody wants feeders out of the game just because you do.
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Old 02-09-2014, 07:35 PM   #44
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I don't think he is saying that he would like feeders to be gone completely in favor on random generated players.

I think he means he would like to see feeders handled a different way like they are in other text sim games.

Here is an example of feeder leagues in EHM. These leagues come when the game by default. They are non playable feeder leagues (BTS is going this route)



That's a screen shot of different Amateur hockey leagues in the USA alone. it's 27 pages long and it includes High school and College.

Here is a screen shot of the Michigan Wolverines roster. These players are fully scout-able and they also accumulate stats every year.


Last edited by SirMichaelJordan; 02-09-2014 at 07:40 PM.
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Old 02-09-2014, 07:39 PM   #45
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I don't think he is saying that he would like feeders to be gone completely in favor on random generated players.

I think he means he would like to see feeders handled a different way like they are in other text sim games.

Here is an example of "feeder leagues" in EHM. These leagues comes when the game by default. They are non playable feeder leagues (BTS is going this route)



That's a screen shot of different Amateur hockey leagues in the USA alone. it's 27 pages long and it includes High school and College.

Here is a screen shot of the Michigan Wolverines roster. These players are fully scout-able and they also accumulate stats every year.

Yes thank you, I've played EHM for a few years.

"In leu of" and "rather than have". Sounds like he doesn't want feeders.


Also saw another post that says "Yes, scrap feeders". Again, sounds like that individual wants to get rid of them.

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

At the end of the day, why mention "in leu of" and "rather than have" or "scrap feeders" at all? Why not just expound upon the request for improvements to the random draft classes. No need to mention those terms at all if the meaning isn't to get rid of them.

Last edited by Bluenoser; 02-09-2014 at 07:43 PM.
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Old 02-09-2014, 07:44 PM   #46
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Yes thank you, I've played EHM for a few years.

"In leu of" and "rather than have". Sounds like he doesn't want feeders.


Also saw another post that says "Yes, scrap feeders". Again, sounds like he wants to get rid of them.
Thats pretty much taken out of context considering what he has been saying in this thread and in other threads.

"Feeders" would be the referencing of the current state that the feature is implemented in the games as of now. At least that is what I've got from reading his posts.

Last edited by SirMichaelJordan; 02-09-2014 at 07:47 PM.
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Old 02-09-2014, 07:44 PM   #47
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Thats pretty much taken out of context considering what he has been saying in this thread and in other threads.
Please enlighten me then - "Scrap Feeders"?????
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Old 02-09-2014, 07:50 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan View Post
I don't think he is saying that he would like feeders to be gone completely in favor on random generated players.

I think he means he would like to see feeders handled a different way like they are in other text sim games.

Here is an example of feeder leagues in EHM. These leagues come when the game by default. They are non playable feeder leagues (BTS is going this route)



That's a screen shot of different Amateur hockey leagues in the USA alone. it's 27 pages long and it includes High school and College.

Here is a screen shot of the Michigan Wolverines roster. These players are fully scout-able and they also accumulate stats every year.


This
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Old 02-09-2014, 09:10 PM   #49
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I do think that this would be a better way of handling the randomly generated classes then the existing method. Since you often end up with far fewer feeder league teams than exist in RL, I always kind of considered them independent baseball academies myself.

That said, I'm willing to let BTS get this method under their belt first, which may entail a couple editions of OOTP passing, before Markus adds it. Lets him get a better feel for the method, to my mind.
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Old 02-09-2014, 09:24 PM   #50
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Late to the party, revisiting my original question, but it seems I've answered it. As goes the kind of diversity I've come to expect, it's because I have Feeder Leagues Plus Additional Players checked in the generation box. No wonder.
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Old 02-09-2014, 09:52 PM   #51
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Please enlighten me then - "Scrap Feeders"?????
PSU didn't say scrap feeders. I did. We all know that feeders will not be removed. In fact, that is not what is being advocated. Scrapping feeders as currently implemented in favor of a better idea which is implemented by a different platform is what is being discussed, I think.

Sure we get that you like feeders just the way they are. That's cool. But, me personally, I'd like to see them handled completely differently because I do not like the limitations and the amount of effort for almost no return that I currently have to deal with.

Hopefully, you are not angry that we do not like feeders as implemented and hopefully you are not looking to just pick a fight. With that being said, we do not think that feeders as implemented are working well for what we would like to accomplish. Here are the things that we don't like:

1. We don't like that everyone is the same age.
2. We don't like that everyone is from the same few schools in the feeder system. Yep, we could add 1,000's and 1,000's of schools from all over the country in order to get the variation that we want but that causes two problems. One, too much talent. Two, most importantly, is the fact that it would take us hundreds upon hundreds of hours to ever get that set-up complete.
3. We don't like that the best-potentials do not put up the best stats and that complete scrubs that graduate highschool move on to the college feeder system.
4. We don't like how much bloat a feeder system causes and the ensuing slow-down on simulation speed.

These are just some of the problems that we don't like. Since we don't like these things we thought we could discuss them civilly and perhaps offer solutions. I really don't think the intent was to flame.
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Last edited by Honorable_Pawn; 02-09-2014 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 02-09-2014, 10:42 PM   #52
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PSU didn't say scrap feeders. I did. We all know that feeders will not be removed. In fact, that is not what is being advocated. Scrapping feeders as currently implemented in favor of a better idea which is implemented by a different platform is what is being discussed, I think.

Sure we get that you like feeders just the way they are. That's cool. But, me personally, I'd like to see them handled completely differently because I do not like the limitations and the amount of effort for almost no return that I currently have to deal with.

Hopefully, you are not angry that we do not like feeders as implemented and hopefully you are not looking to just pick a fight. With that being said, we do not think that feeders as implemented are working well for what we would like to accomplish. Here are the things that we don't like:

1. We don't like that everyone is the same age.
2. We don't like that everyone is from the same few schools in the feeder system. Yep, we could add 1,000's and 1,000's of schools from all over the country in order to get the variation that we want but that causes two problems. One, too much talent. Two, most importantly, is the fact that it would take us hundreds upon hundreds of hours to ever get that set-up complete.
3. We don't like that the best-potentials do not put up the best stats and that complete scrubs that graduate highschool move on to the college feeder system.
4. We don't like how much bloat a feeder system causes and the ensuing slow-down on simulation speed.

These are just some of the problems that we don't like. Since we don't like these things we thought we could discuss them civilly and perhaps offer solutions. I really don't think the intent was to flame.

what do you mean WE?
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Old 02-09-2014, 10:56 PM   #53
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What 'choo talking about, Willis?

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Old 02-09-2014, 11:39 PM   #54
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PSU didn't say scrap feeders. I did. We all know that feeders will not be removed. In fact, that is not what is being advocated. Scrapping feeders as currently implemented in favor of a better idea which is implemented by a different platform is what is being discussed, I think.
yes
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Old 02-09-2014, 11:50 PM   #55
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What I am really looking for, is a superior way of imitating feeders...why some people are against progress is beyond me
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Old 02-10-2014, 07:47 AM   #56
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:20 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn View Post

1. We don't like that everyone is the same age.
2. We don't like that everyone is from the same few schools in the feeder system. Yep, we could add 1,000's and 1,000's of schools from all over the country in order to get the variation that we want but that causes two problems. One, too much talent. Two, most importantly, is the fact that it would take us hundreds upon hundreds of hours to ever get that set-up complete.
3. We don't like that the best-potentials do not put up the best stats and that complete scrubs that graduate highschool move on to the college feeder system.
4. We don't like how much bloat a feeder system causes and the ensuing slow-down on simulation speed.
This exactly.
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Old 02-10-2014, 08:48 AM   #58
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What I am really looking for, is a superior way of imitating feeders...why some people are against progress is beyond me
And why you would make a comment like that is beyond me.

You've made plenty of suggestions over the years. Yet every time someone responds with a different opinion, well then you feel they're against the idea. They must be against progress? Give me a break.

You started out talking about draft classes, then it got to "in leu of" and "rather than" feeders.

I pointed out why feeders were put in the game.

Never got a response from you on that. You chose to ignore it.

I'm not against improving the random draft classes, and said as much.

I also defended feeders. I don't want something "in leu of" or "rather than" feeders.

I guess that makes me "against progress"?

The fact that I like feeders and how they work and aren't afraid to spend time setting them up properly also makes me "against progress"?

And anyone who thinks HP's suggestion to "Scrap Feeders" equates to anything other than getting rid of them must have a different dictionary.

Please continue your quest for improved draft classes. I can assure you I will continue my quest to defend feeders, and if that makes me against progress, so be it.
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Old 02-10-2014, 01:45 PM   #59
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Why can't we crusade for improved draft classes AND improved feeders?
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Old 02-26-2014, 02:34 PM   #60
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For those not wishing to use feeders

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Boys! Boys! Don't make me turn this car around!





Why can't we crusade for improved draft classes AND improved feeders?

I don't see how this addition would be any difference from us getting official international leagues this year..

"Official feeders" would mostly likely only include colleges anyways as high schools in the US and "amateur leagues" in countries like Dominica, Venezuela and Cuba would be hard to get info on. I wouldn't mind those players being generated. Officially adding Colleges shouldn't take away the ability to add your own feeders just like adding the Nippon league will not stop us from creating another league in Japan.

At the end of the day, I think we all would like to see Indy, Winter and Australian leagues along with US colleges eventually make their way into future OOTP Baseballs.

Last edited by SirMichaelJordan; 02-26-2014 at 02:35 PM.
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