Are namesets good?

Have you corrected problem in namesets, for example, in Russian nameset? I don't know about v14 but if there are name's like Yurochka and Vovochka, it's completely wrong.

And what about multiple Spanish namesets, one for each country? There has been a plead for it recently in suggestions thread.

And maybe add more namesets?

[Bluenoser]

Search the MODS Forum for questdognamesfiles. Not sure if it covers foreign language names but it's a very good MOD.

[Charlie Hough]

These files are fully modifiable. So that's the solution for now.

Unfortunately, there is probably not enough demand for more accuracy or diversity in the namesets to make it worthwhile for the developer to focus much time on this. There are very few OOTP gamers that play with namesets other than those that are used for historical or current MLB games.

Thankfully, we have mods and the freedom to do anything we want with the namesets. And, if someone comes up with an improved nameset that is more realistic, I'm sure that Andreas from OOTP Developments would be glad to review it for possible inclusion in the game.

So I would recommend searching the mods forum or creating a new Russian nameset of your own. Maybe there is a chance for you to contribute an improvement to the game.

As for the Spanish namesets by country, I think that is a problem that is impossible to fix without a major recoding of the game. The game only allows 40 ethnicities, and it would require adding ethnicities to the game to create the result that you want for Spanish-speaking countries. Markus has said that there are no plans to increase the limit of ethnicities because this would require a massive change to the game. And, again, there is not enough customer demand for this.

However, you could create your own ethnicities files with corresponding namesets, so you could create your own mod that replaces many of the existing ethnicities with specific ethnicities for Mexico, Panama, Cuba, Venezuela, etc. Unfortunately, though, you would have to sacrifice some of the existing ethnicities.

[joefromchicago]

Rather than repeat everything that Charlie Hough just said, I'll add that there's about zero percent chance of the developers improving the namesets. At this point, they are what they are. Any changes will come from the modding community.

It's true that there are issues with the namesets. I've been modifying some of the European ones, and there are obvious errors in nearly every one of them. There are, for instance, a lot of Danish names in the Swedish nameset and a lot of English and Welsh names in the Irish nameset. Most players, I think, don't really care about those sorts of things, and the ones who do care take the time to modify the files.

I'm not sure if anyone has modded the Russian nameset (I certainly haven't), but if you do, you should post it to the mods forum.

[Marinersfan51]

The only thing that I would request of namesets would be a way to tie them to years, like Questdogs historical namesets all being in the same file and the names that are used changes on its own as time progresses.

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by Charlie Hough

However, you could create your own ethnicities files with corresponding namesets, so you could create your own mod that replaces many of the existing ethnicities with specific ethnicities for Mexico, Panama, Cuba, Venezuela, etc. Unfortunately, though, you would have to sacrifice some of the existing ethnicities.

I'm guessing that a user who really wants to focus his league on the minute differences in namesets among Spanish speaking countries isn't going to miss namesets like Albanian, Serbian, Turkish and Azerbaijan, if those are the ones he ends up replacing.

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by joefromchicago

It's true that there are issues with the namesets. I've been modifying some of the European ones, and there are obvious errors in nearly every one of them. There are, for instance, a lot of Danish names in the Swedish nameset and a lot of English and Welsh names in the Irish nameset. Most players, I think, don't really care about those sorts of things, and the ones who do care take the time to modify the files.

Do you know for reals that English surnames are very uncommon in Ireland? I would think given England's occupation of Ireland for centuries, there would still be a fair number of people with English surnames there, even after 90 years of independence.

[chucksabr]

Apropos of nothing, when I was putting together my dynasty, which has a complex nationality component to it, I put together this guide for me to help me remember how to make changes I need to when they need to be done. I cobbled it together while I was learning piecemeal how ethnicities, facegen and nation editor works. Feel free to correct anything you see that I got wrong.

This is UK specific, but you can apply its principles to any country setup you want.

[joefromchicago]

Originally Posted by chucksabr

Do you know for reals that English surnames are very uncommon in Ireland? I would think given England's occupation of Ireland for centuries, there would still be a fair number of people with English surnames there, even after 90 years of independence.

I have no doubt that there are plenty of English and Welsh names in Ireland. But that doesn't make them Irish names. Mohammed, after all, is one of the most common first names in the UK, but I wouldn't exactly call it English or Welsh or Scottish.

If you just want to go down the phone book and find the most common names, then that's one way to compile a nameset. The problem, though, is that you'll get names from all sorts of ethnic groups. OOTP, on the other hand, already has a way to deal with multi-ethnic societies - if the population is composed of 80% Irish names and 20% English names, then 80% of your names should be drawn from database 18 and 20% from database 20. Mixing English names into the Irish nameset because there are people with English names living in Ireland defeats the purpose - it actually throws off the percentages. Furthermore, because first names are tied to last names, you end up with combinations like "Sean Wellesley" or "Brendan Thistlethwaite," which are are no more likely than "Trevor O'Reilly" or "Algernon McGillicuddy" (or "Mohammed Ponsonby").

The better method, therefore, is to have ethnically uniform namesets. Those, then, can be factored in when creating a multi-ethnic player pool.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by joefromchicago

I have no doubt that there are plenty of English and Welsh names in Ireland. But that doesn't make them Irish names. Mohammed, after all, is one of the most common first names in the UK, but I wouldn't exactly call it English or Welsh or Scottish.

If you just want to go down the phone book and find the most common names, then that's one way to compile a nameset. The problem, though, is that you'll get names from all sorts of ethnic groups. OOTP, on the other hand, already has a way to deal with multi-ethnic societies - if the population is composed of 80% Irish names and 20% English names, then 80% of your names should be drawn from database 18 and 20% from database 20. Mixing English names into the Irish nameset because there are people with English names living in Ireland defeats the purpose - it actually throws off the percentages. Furthermore, because first names are tied to last names, you end up with combinations like "Sean Wellesley" or "Brendan Thistlethwaite," which are are no more likely than "Trevor O'Reilly" or "Algernon McGillicuddy" (or "Mohammed Ponsonby").

The better method, therefore, is to have ethnically uniform namesets. Those, then, can be factored in when creating a multi-ethnic player pool.

One issue is that a lot (if not all of the non-US / Canadian ones, I haven't checked) of the default name-sets don't have any number other than '1' set for the frequency, so every name is equally likely, so you are just as likely to get an English player generated with the name Iestyn (which is a rare Welsh name) as you are with the name John.

[Lukas Berger]

Does anyone care enough about this and have the time to try to coordinate a project to get a bunch of folks working on making better name files?

I'm swamped with OOTP work and can't add any more to my plate, but it'd be really cool if we could get a community effort going to 'fix' the namesets.

If we could get the namesets 'fixed' I think we'd almost certainly be able to get Markus to include them in the default game.

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by joefromchicago

I have no doubt that there are plenty of English and Welsh names in Ireland. But that doesn't make them Irish names. Mohammed, after all, is one of the most common first names in the UK, but I wouldn't exactly call it English or Welsh or Scottish.

And yet, Mohammed (or some variation) shows up under French and Norwegian, in addition to Arabic and African.

I'm guessing the original idea is to reflect the most common names in those countries, rather than the most ethnically or linguistically pure names. I think that's why there's a difference, for instance, between German and Austrian, even though they both speak German and have many of the same names. Sae with UK and Australia, or French and French Canadian for that matter. In fact, French Canadian contains a lot of English language surnames, I presume for the purpose of reflecting the preponderance of English surnames among French Canadian people.

I'm not saying I disagree with your critique of the namesets, but I think it's because you're coming at it from a different angle than the originators intended.

[joefromchicago]

I'm close to being reasonably satisfied with a number of namesets that I've been working on. I'll post them when I'm finished.

[joefromchicago]

Originally Posted by chucksabr

And yet, Mohammed (or some variation) shows up under French and Norwegian, in addition to Arabic and African.

Yes. I think that's a bug, not a feature.

Originally Posted by chucksabr

I'm not saying I disagree with your critique of the namesets, but I think it's because you're coming at it from a different angle than the originators intended.

I agree. I think my way is better.

There should be a Latvian Nameset in the OOTP office now

[joefromchicago]

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

One issue is that a lot (if not all of the non-US / Canadian ones, I haven't checked) of the default name-sets don't have any number other than '1' set for the frequency, so every name is equally likely, so you are just as likely to get an English player generated with the name Iestyn (which is a rare Welsh name) as you are with the name John.

Yeah, the first-name files need as much work as the name files.

[chucksabr]

Originally Posted by joefromchicago

I agree. I think my way is better.

I don't disagree, but then would you have to expand beyond the forty to accommodate it?

[MUFC1878]

This is something I hoped they had improved. But can't say I'm disappointed they didn't.

I've been working on a Venezuelan nameset, on and off. Added maybe about 300-400 names so far, but last names I've only worked up to the A's. Hopefully I can finish by the time 15 is out.

[joefromchicago]

Originally Posted by chucksabr

I don't disagree, but then would you have to expand beyond the forty to accommodate it?

Ideally, we should have an unlimited number of possible namesets. Given the limited worldwide appeal of baseball, though, I don't feel unduly restricted by the forty nameset barrier.

[hfield007]

I myself use my own customized version.


Quite frankly, even though I don't often play starting with the current MLB rosters, the name set for current US is abysmal if you want names that reflect what will be coming in the next 10-20 years in your drafts of fictional players. There are more than a few omissions of top boy names currently in the United States that don't even appear in the game.

Other than this, the UK is just amazingly thin. It almost makes no sense.

Always updating my name set though and thank the lord it is able to be edited.