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Old 05-12-2019, 12:14 PM   #1
mpokrandt
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26-Man Roster for Doubleheaders

Does OOTPXX have the functionality to go to a 26-man roster on the days of doubleheaders?
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Old 05-12-2019, 12:29 PM   #2
slugga27
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Originally Posted by mpokrandt View Post
Does OOTPXX have the functionality to go to a 26-man roster on the days of doubleheaders?


No.


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Old 05-13-2019, 01:18 AM   #3
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This question is asked from time to time. The answer is that programming the AI to use this feature effectively would be too much work for so specialized a feature. It would be nice if it could be added someday. Baseball's roster rules have, I fear, reached the point where a simulation that replicated them all would have to be run on a quantum supercomputer.
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Old 05-13-2019, 07:16 AM   #4
slugga27
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Originally Posted by TomVeal View Post
This question is asked from time to time. The answer is that programming the AI to use this feature effectively would be too much work for so specialized a feature. It would be nice if it could be added someday. Baseball's roster rules have, I fear, reached the point where a simulation that replicated them all would have to be run on a quantum supercomputer.


The MLB is going to 26-man rosters next year, so at the end of the day, this particular rule goes away.


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Old 05-13-2019, 07:58 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by slugga27 View Post
The MLB is going to 26-man rosters next year, so at the end of the day, this particular rule goes away.


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They are going to allow a 27th player for double headers next year, so the rule technically is the same.

Additionally starting in 2020, active roster limits will expand from 25 to 26 players for Opening Day through August 31. (Teams will be allowed a 27th player for doubleheaders.) Beginning in September, rosters will expand only to 28 players, compared to the previous mark of 40 players.

Last edited by ohiodevil; 05-13-2019 at 08:22 AM.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:04 AM   #6
Orioles1966
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You could change the league player limit to 26 or next year to 27 for the double header then switch back after the game's are over(I think you can do it in commish mode-not 100 percent certain).
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:14 AM   #7
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You could change the league player limit to 26 or next year to 27 for the double header then switch back after the game's are over(I think you can do it in commish mode-not 100 percent certain).
This has been a work around for a few years, but the problem is that is effects all teams and when you flip it back to the "normal" roster limit, you sometimes get guys on DFA/Waivers that normally would not be there.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:19 AM   #8
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I just disable rainouts. One way around the double header problem. Because if you ever sim a double header chances of the AI manager killing all your pitchers is extremely high.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:25 AM   #9
Orioles1966
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This has been a work around for a few years, but the problem is that is effects all teams and when you flip it back to the "normal" roster limit, you sometimes get guys on DFA/Waivers that normally would not be there.
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Last edited by Orioles1966; 05-13-2019 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 05-13-2019, 08:29 AM   #10
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The work around to that would be prevent UI from making roster moves then manually add players to the teams that are playing the double headers. You could probably do that at the beginning of that day's games and don't bother with it until the games are completed because all the other teams wouldn't be able to add players or make player transactions(or something).
True but that kind of defeats the purpose of the AI if you are choosing who they bring up for that game if it's not you own team. And if you forget to do this before the first games of the day or to turn it off after, it could hurt your league a little but.It's doable, just not easy and without manual intervention.

I know they have been saying that it is too difficult to implement since 2015, so hopefully they have looked into this more and maybe we can get this for OOTP 21!
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Old 05-13-2019, 09:35 AM   #11
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I don't see the problem... addition by restriction:

1. Add the extra roster spot for a double-header, but only for teams that play one.

2. The AI is forced to select a rested pitcher as the extra player.

3. The AI must send back the same player after the double-header is over.

4. If another pitcher is injured during the double-header, the AI may DL him and keep the extra pitcher instead.

Now someone whip that into C++ real quick and we're good.

Disclaimer: I don't do programming for a living, I have never programmed anything fancy even in Excel, and I am scared to death of the Xerox in the next room.
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Old 05-13-2019, 12:23 PM   #12
TomVeal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westheim View Post
I don't see the problem... addition by restriction:

1. Add the extra roster spot for a double-header, but only for teams that play one.

2. The AI is forced to select a rested pitcher as the extra player.

3. The AI must send back the same player after the double-header is over.

4. If another pitcher is injured during the double-header, the AI may DL him and keep the extra pitcher instead.

Now someone whip that into C++ real quick and we're good.

Disclaimer: I don't do programming for a living, I have never programmed anything fancy even in Excel, and I am scared to death of the Xerox in the next room.
Back in the very, very old days, which few now remember, programs were much simpler and were written in languages like BASIC and Pascal, which ordinary human beings could use. That's all the programming experience that I have, but I remember how much trouble it was to introduce minor exceptions that applied only under unusual circumstances without generating bugs. I doubt that it's any easier with modern programming languages and vastly bigger programs.
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Old 05-13-2019, 02:15 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by TomVeal View Post
Back in the very, very old days, which few now remember, programs were much simpler and were written in languages like BASIC and Pascal, which ordinary human beings could use. That's all the programming experience that I have, but I remember how much trouble it was to introduce minor exceptions that applied only under unusual circumstances without generating bugs. I doubt that it's any easier with modern programming languages and vastly bigger programs.


if double_header=true
then roster_limit=26
else
roster_limit=25.


lol
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Old 05-13-2019, 02:23 PM   #14
DaBears
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Much better to disable rainouts. We have had several discussions about ways to help the AI out, and this is an obvious one. Any way you can keep the AI from having to deal with things that require “individual thinking”, for lack of a better term, the better the game is. Some scenarios are not a “program”, but more based on the situation and you really can’t program those.
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Old 05-13-2019, 03:03 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by TomVeal View Post
Back in the very, very old days, which few now remember, programs were much simpler and were written in languages like BASIC and Pascal, which ordinary human beings could use. That's all the programming experience that I have, but I remember how much trouble it was to introduce minor exceptions that applied only under unusual circumstances without generating bugs. I doubt that it's any easier with modern programming languages and vastly bigger programs.
It's easy to give a solution when you don't have to be responsible for fixing all the other things it may break.
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Old 05-13-2019, 10:15 PM   #16
slugga27
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26-Man Roster for Doubleheaders

Quote:
Originally Posted by ohiodevil View Post
They are going to allow a 27th player for double headers next year, so the rule technically is the same.

Additionally starting in 2020, active roster limits will expand from 25 to 26 players for Opening Day through August 31. (Teams will be allowed a 27th player for doubleheaders.) Beginning in September, rosters will expand only to 28 players, compared to the previous mark of 40 players.


I stand corrected. This makes perfect sense; I didn’t know the MLB agreed though.


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Old 05-14-2019, 02:46 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by jimmysthebestcop View Post
I just disable rainouts. One way around the double header problem. Because if you ever sim a double header chances of the AI manager killing all your pitchers is extremely high.
This.
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Old 05-14-2019, 10:59 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by andyhdz View Post
if double_header=true
then roster_limit=26
else
roster_limit=25.


lol
If it was only that simple. The reality is that there is probably much more to it than that. Not knowing how it works, but logically the roster limit is probably a league wide variable. Each team would now have to have their own roster limit, because it could be different from team to team on the same day. Everywhere it accesses that variable would have to be changed to access the new team variable. Could be thousands of places. The AI would also need to be altered to know it has to call up someone when the rosters expand and send the same player back down when the roster goes back to normal. I would love to see this as well, but I can understand how it might be huge undertaking for something that only happens rarely these days when a rainout forces a doubleheader.
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Old 05-14-2019, 11:21 AM   #19
Matt Arnold
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Originally Posted by jeffw3000 View Post
If it was only that simple. The reality is that there is probably much more to it than that. Not knowing how it works, but logically the roster limit is probably a league wide variable. Each team would now have to have their own roster limit, because it could be different from team to team on the same day. Everywhere it accesses that variable would have to be changed to access the new team variable. Could be thousands of places. The AI would also need to be altered to know it has to call up someone when the rosters expand and send the same player back down when the roster goes back to normal. I would love to see this as well, but I can understand how it might be huge undertaking for something that only happens rarely these days when a rainout forces a doubleheader.
It may be as few as 200 places

But yeah, the simple fact of "double-header today give an extra roster spot" is pretty easy, but it's all the other stuff. You have to make sure when you're evaluating trading logic that teams aren't trying to build a 26-man roster and value a trade differently whether they have a double-header on that day or not. You probably want to make sure they're not making a waiver claim just for that 26th man spot. You need to make sure that roster logic doesn't go haywire when teams have an extra roster spot every couple weeks, causing them to churn through player options or DFA guys and whatnot.

Probably a bunch of other stuff too. I'd love to have this in, don't get me wrong. But it's definitely a lot more than a 5 minute fix
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Old 05-14-2019, 11:42 AM   #20
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As a human player, I like the challenge of rainouts and doubleheaders. If I were an AI, I'd doubtless react to them irrationally, as Matt suggests. Perhaps the best workaround in a solo game is to set the roster limit one higher than real life (26 this year, 27 next year) but restrict one's own team to the actual limit except for double headers.
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