OOTPs Longest-Running Sim League in Jeopardy

[Qrashman]

The Hickory Baseball League started in March of 2001 (real-time) with OOTP 2 as it's engine (I think OOTP3 was almost out but we started with 2). An offshoot of a High Heat league called the USBL, the HBL started with a handful of these USBL owners and attracted others from message boards and the OOTP website as well as the disbanding XBL run by Joe Winsarske which was one of the first-ever OOTP leagues.

Fast forward almost 14 years later and the HBL is now in the year 2056. 56 seasons have gone by and the record books rival the long history of the real major leagues...or at the very least the modern era of major league baseball.

The HBL has gone from the original 24 teams down to 20 back up to 24 and then down to 20 again. The same teams are turning over again and again. Perhaps its because new owners cannot grasp the fictionality of the league (all players are obviously fictional by now). We just did our customary "Are you coming back next season" thread and 3 owners have said they are not returning. A couple more have not responded.

The end may be near. I myself stepped down as commissioner after 55 seasons last year. The reason? I don't use a laptop or desktop anymore. I'm strictly tablet and iPhone. A couple others, including (edit: some) of the ones that are quitting the league have said the same.

[edit: This paragraph is an afterthought, not the point of this thread.]
I'm genuinely concerned for the future of OOTP if the game stays as an installable game. I have no doubt we could keep owners a lot easier if the game was completely web-based. Or perhaps on iOS but I've been told that iPads just can't handle it yet. It seems odd to me that the game is not web-based. Everything is "in the cloud" now and moving away from installable programs from what I've seen.

So the HBL may be losing 4-6 GMs and I don't think we can recover from that.

Any thoughts from past or present HBL GMs or on-lookers?

[baseballonly]

Well....just because one league is in jeopardy of shutting down doesn't mean OOTPb is doomed....the are many other well-running leagues.

That said, a web version would be nice, if a) it could fully handle the game's features, and b) the same once-year, no extras/things you have to buy to be good model was kept. ( I say that because many online games charge money either every month or make you pay for special credits to be any good.

[Qrashman]

I never said OOTP is doomed, I said I am concerned. I'm sure it will live on without batting an eye at the HBL. Just simply relaying a concern.

I've been one of the biggest supporters of OOTP since the beginning but even I am starting to hate using my laptop. My concern has nothing to do with the offerings of OOTP itself.

[TGH-Adfabre]

So the HBL may be losing 4-6 GMs and I don't think we can recover from that.

Our league had recovered from sizable losses. We usually co-commish, I am solo at the moment, and we have been through 5+ since 2007 when I joined. The important part to me is that most of the owners are consistent contributors and the commish will fill in the gaps or find "part time" Gm volunteers to cover gaps. Recruiting involves a fair amount of proactive work also.

Looking at the file size and image customizations for OOTP I think the disk space to run the game on the cloud is really problematic. I know HD space is the cheapest part of IT but the way OOTP stores individual games will make it very problematic.
The quantity of options is a huge barrier. The games I have played that are server hosted do not allow for the individualization that OOTP does. They allow a narrow group of changes the user can make.

I do not see tablets and Ipads as the solution because they will always be second rate from a memory. graphics and processing standpoint.

[Antonin]

I don't have a ipad, a tablet or a smart phone. I don't plan on spending my hard-earned money on any of these devices, since my job situation is not stable and there is no demand in the job market for employees my age.

I have used an ipad, but to be honest, to me the screen is just too small for any kind of gaming.

I'm sure I would be considered old fashioned, but I like installable programs. I have no interest in being online all the time. If "everything" becomes web-based, then I suppose I just will not bother with it. As far as games are concerned, I will play what I have as long as I can.

[Honorable_Pawn]

I am sympathetic to your plight and I hope that one day the options that you long for become available. At the same time, I see your post as an attempt to half-camouflage your true intention which is not really about your long-running league and its demise.

In my opinion, your true intention is to suggest that OOTP be made available for tablet-use. As much as I am sympathetic to your story I am, quite honestly, a little taken aback by the histrionics behind your suggestion for improvement.

If I were in your position I would have just come straight out and asked for tablet-use functionality in the future and left all of the superlatives out of it.

$0.02

[Qrashman]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

In my opinion, your true intention is to suggest that OOTP be made available for tablet-use. As much as I am sympathetic to your story I am, quite honestly, a little taken aback by the histrionics behind your suggestion for improvement.

$0.02

not true. I've already done that in a post a couple months ago. Flat out asked when/if a tablet version was coming. Got a good answer straight from the big guy. Had no hidden intentions behind this post. It was more of a post about the league and the history and a probable goodbye. We've been around almost 14 years. Figured it was worth a post.

[Honorable_Pawn]

I realized after I posted that I sounded like a dick. Sorry about that.

I really do agree with you (even though I don't use them) that tablet-use would be good for the game.

[RchW]

Not piling on here but I would be gone in a flash if OOTP went completely web-based or was configured primarily for tablets and touch screens. I can see and support the idea of different versions more platform specific but an installable game capable of producing high resolution on a large screen is a must for me.

As HP said just ask for what you want. It is a legitimate request. Edit note not being a mind reader (or a reader of every post) my comment stands.

The incipient demise of your online league is unfortunate but certainly not confirmation that everything is in the cloud and laptops are moribund just yet. I may have little privacy left but what does remain will not be on the cloud anytime soon.

[Qrashman]

Originally Posted by RchW

As HP said just ask for what you want. It is a legitimate request. [

Read my earlier post, I did that months ago. The online thing was an afterthought and its becoming the focus. This was more a thread for past GMs, future GMs and anyone that has seen the league in the past to comment. In 14 years we've had a great group of GMs and I'm sure a lot of them are still here.

Just figured I couldn't post a "end of the HBL" thread without a reason why.

[Ike348]

Not to mention all of the database mods and such that are relatively easy to implement on a local device compared to online. Imagine how hard it would be, looking for your "saved_games/League.lg/news/html/images/player_pictures" folder on the cloud!

I think it's a fair request, but not one that I and most likely many others would like to see. Perhaps a "lite" online version that would be used for your MLB or fictional online leagues, not say, a dynasty that requires many settings/mods.

[Izz]

Originally Posted by Ike348

Not to mention all of the database mods and such that are relatively easy to implement on a local device compared to online. Imagine how hard it would be, looking for your "saved_games/League.lg/news/html/images/player_pictures" folder on the cloud!

It wouldn't necessarily be that difficult to implement Each player would have a user name, and saved games and all relevant files would be saved under that user name (eg: "Ike348/saved_games/League.lg/news/html/images/player_pictures").

That being said, getting the resource allocation right could be pretty tricky.

[Qrashman]

The ipad/online thing was an afterthought and its become the focal point for some reason. This was not supposed to be a discussion about the merits of another platform. Sorry if it came off that way. The lack of another platform is not the reason why the league is in trouble, has nothing to do with that.

[ra7c7er]

Originally Posted by Qrashman

The Hickory Baseball League started in March of 2001 (real-time) with OOTP 2 as it's engine (I think OOTP3 was almost out but we started with 2). An offshoot of a High Heat league called the USBL, the HBL started with a handful of these USBL owners and attracted others from message boards and the OOTP website as well as the disbanding XBL run by Joe Winsarske which was one of the first-ever OOTP leagues.

Fast forward almost 14 years later and the HBL is now in the year 2056. 56 seasons have gone by and the record books rival the long history of the real major leagues...or at the very least the modern era of major league baseball.

The HBL has gone from the original 24 teams down to 20 back up to 24 and then down to 20 again. The same teams are turning over again and again. Perhaps its because new owners cannot grasp the fictionality of the league (all players are obviously fictional by now). We just did our customary "Are you coming back next season" thread and 3 owners have said they are not returning. A couple more have not responded.

The end may be near. I myself stepped down as commissioner after 55 seasons last year. The reason? I don't use a laptop or desktop anymore. I'm strictly tablet and iPhone. A couple others, including (edit: some) of the ones that are quitting the league have said the same.

[edit: This paragraph is an afterthought, not the point of this thread.]
I'm genuinely concerned for the future of OOTP if the game stays as an installable game. I have no doubt we could keep owners a lot easier if the game was completely web-based. Or perhaps on iOS but I've been told that iPads just can't handle it yet. It seems odd to me that the game is not web-based. Everything is "in the cloud" now and moving away from installable programs from what I've seen.

So the HBL may be losing 4-6 GMs and I don't think we can recover from that.

Any thoughts from past or present HBL GMs or on-lookers?

That's hardly true at all plus their are other tablet options besides Ipads. Just because your league (sad to see any league fail) is losing members doesn't mean the whole state of the industry is failing. Not everyone has every type of internet capable device.

Originally Posted by Qrashman

The ipad/online thing was an afterthought and its become the focal point for some reason. This was not supposed to be a discussion about the merits of another platform. Sorry if it came off that way. The lack of another platform is not the reason why the league is in trouble, has nothing to do with that.

If you feel it has nothing to do with it why bring it up? Obviously you do feel it has something to do with it. Being a part of something that is failing and not having the answers to fix it sucks. But trying to say it's the games fault by saying they don't support certain things is wrong. Your league survived a long time without any apple product support. Stuff fails all the time. Perhaps instead of lamenting the good old days and complaining about the future you want to be like the good old days why don't post in the online leagues thread and look for more stable players. That's what I would have done.

The game is way to massive to be a browser based online game. It's over quadruple the size of your typical browser based game. (Evony, Rise of Mythos, Tyrant, etc). Plus you'd lose mods.

[ra7c7er]

Also why not just shrink the teams again till you can find some good stable owners? No reason you can go down to 16 or something.

[HuachucaThunder]

I have been associated with a few online leagues via a different game in the past. The primary reason why I left was the facilitator of the league "disbanded" leagues due to high turnover and almost no recruitment to fill the vacant GM slots. I will say that game, when they transitioned to a total web-based, and now tablet format, has lost a lot of those who played. The quality of the game suffers quite a bit due to not being able to handle the game's depth that can be handled in a "fixed" format.such as computers.
I do agree with ra7c7er in that why not downsize the league until new GMs can be recruited or ask to join. Then the league could expand again and make another run of it.

[Qrashman]

wow did this thread take a sharp turn in the wrong direction.

[Honorable_Pawn]

[Qrashman]

Probably my fault for even bringing up my concerns in the first place, but in my head it was so inconsequential to the meaning of the post I didnt think it would get much attention. Stepping back I understand.

Sim leagues rarely last 14 real-time years. That was mostly my intent, to get the attention of any past GMs, current GMs and whatnot and to highlight the longevity of the league. If anything it's a testament to the strength of OOTP. I probably did a disservice by even mentioning my concerns.

I didn't do the "thanks to X, thanks to Y" because I'd be here all day typing. We've had a TON of contributors over 14 years there's just too many to list. In the end the HBL may live on. If it doesn't its just out of laziness and time restriction. When the HBL started I was barely out of college. We have a few owners that have been in for 10+ years. We now have kids and careers. It's crazy to think of the difference where I was then and where I am now.

That's what I should have said, I guess. I was typing from my iPhone so kept it short. Maybe I should go back to my laptop!!!!

[Honorable_Pawn]

I think I helped to set the negative tone so you can place the blame on me.