Please support us on Steam Greenlight!

[JeffR]

Originally Posted by dave1927p

fyi - the two greenlight icons on the forum show "unknown item" and cannot be found when I click on it.

Strange, I've tried them on different browsers, both logged into and out of Steam, and it seems to work every time. You might've caught Steam when the community-releated features were down, they've gone out a couple of times on me today.

[JeffR]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

Can't imagine it is after only 4-5 days.

Didn't Markus say he hoped they'd know before Christmas?

Oh, yeah, it's going to be a while before we get approved. Most of the choices for the current round of approvals were probably made before we even started our campaign last week. Markus's estimate is our best guess, but predicting when things get Greenlighted right now is trying to hit a moving target - Valve has really ramped up their acceptance rate in the last two and a half months. This is the second group of 100 they've done, and at this point I think they're approving faster than people are submitting - which is needed when there around 1400 candidates still waiting. The impression I get is that they want it to be more inclusive than exclusive, and the main holdup at the moment is having enough manpower at their end to help get the approved games into ready-for-sale status - a lot of the developers involved are new and, I'd suspect, need a bit of hand-holding through that process.

[Aliean]

voted yes on both games.tried the ootp14 a while back just to see what it was about and i hate baseball but all the features in that game is awsome and the customization is brilliant.cant wait untell Fhm is half way where ootp is

[dave1927p]

Originally Posted by JeffR

Strange, I've tried them on different browsers, both logged into and out of Steam, and it seems to work every time. You might've caught Steam when the community-releated features were down, they've gone out a couple of times on me today.

Oh, well I see it back up now.

[geckon]

Originally Posted by JeffR

Oh, yeah, it's going to be a while before we get approved. Most of the choices for the current round of approvals were probably made before we even started our campaign last week. Markus's estimate is our best guess, but predicting when things get Greenlighted right now is trying to hit a moving target - Valve has really ramped up their acceptance rate in the last two and a half months. This is the second group of 100 they've done, and at this point I think they're approving faster than people are submitting - which is needed when there around 1400 candidates still waiting. The impression I get is that they want it to be more inclusive than exclusive, and the main holdup at the moment is having enough manpower at their end to help get the approved games into ready-for-sale status - a lot of the developers involved are new and, I'd suspect, need a bit of hand-holding through that process.

Good news, keep voting then!

[omjo]

I'll vote for OOTP 14 without hesitation, unfortunately I don't think FHM 14 is ready for Steam yet.

Now, it would be the only hockey manager (actually might be the only hockey game!) on Steam, so you definitely have a chance to dominate the hockey genre early and set the standard. Hopefully that will be enough reason to fix the game up and make it close to perfect.

I'll vote anyway though.

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by omjo

I'll vote for OOTP 14 without hesitation, unfortunately I don't think FHM 14 is ready for Steam yet.

Now, it would be the only hockey manager (actually might be the only hockey game!) on Steam, so you definitely have a chance to dominate the hockey genre early and set the standard. Hopefully that will be enough reason to fix the game up and make it close to perfect.

I'll vote anyway though.

It depends on your standard.

If you compare FHM to OOTP or FM, the titans in the same field, then yeah, FHM has a ways to go.

But that's not the comparison that you should be making as to whether it should be on steam. The more fair/accurate things is to compare it to the average/typical game that's actually on Steam, not to mention the typical text based sports sim... In that case, FHM is already better than 95% of the competition. So it's definitely more than steam worthy using that criteria.

[omjo]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

It depends on your standard.

If you compare FHM to OOTP or FM, the titans in the same field, then yeah, FHM has a ways to go.

But that's not the comparison that you should be making as to whether it should be on steam. The more fair/accurate things is to compare it to the average/typical game that's actually on Steam, not to mention the typical text based sports sim... In that case, FHM is already better than 95% of the competition. So it's definitely more than steam worthy using that criteria.

Oh no, I meant its not ready in that it still has quite some work to do adding some crucial features and fixing bugs.

It'd be foolish to compare it to either of those games at this point in the FHM development. Its a young gsme. (I'm an oilers fan so I know all about how a "young team" needs to work out its kinks throughout the season. Kind of the same thing here lol)

And ultimately I agree, which is why I voted yes anyway. The extra exposure will only help the game get better, quicker too.

[AlpineSK]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

It depends on your standard.

If you compare FHM to OOTP or FM, the titans in the same field, then yeah, FHM has a ways to go.

But that's not the comparison that you should be making as to whether it should be on steam. The more fair/accurate things is to compare it to the average/typical game that's actually on Steam, not to mention the typical text based sports sim... In that case, FHM is already better than 95% of the competition. So it's definitely more than steam worthy using that criteria.

But here's another thing to remember.. there are not many text based sports sims on Steam. And what's the major one??? Football manager which year after year is the OOTPB of soccer (football) sims. My personal concern with BOTH projects being on Steam would be: 1. Someone downloads FHM BEFORE OOTPB and they realize its the same company, I'd be afraid they wouldnt try OOTPB and let's face it, we are in hockey season. There's a possibility that would happen. Or 2. They would download FHM and realize what a lacking game that it actually is.

The company can have A LOT more discretion at their disposal with patches and beta patches if they keep it OFF Steam giving their community better access TO those patches, and let's face it.. FHM is a game that needs a ton of patching to make it where it SHOULD be.

My opinion? Release OOTPB on Steam. Build the fan base that way. When FHM is actually a game that is ready for the sports sim world, you THEN release it to Steam.

It aint that game yet.

Also with the team's experience making OOTPB I struggle with calling FHM a "young" game. There are SO MANY features that they could have ported over from one game to the other (the UI for example) that would have made FHM a better game right off the bat but they chose not to.

There needs to be more intermingling in the code and the features... That's the answer to making FHM successful if you ask me..

[Stinson]

Originally Posted by AlpineSK

Also with the team's experience making OOTPB I struggle with calling FHM a "young" game.

Only Sebastian has any previous experience with OOTP, working on the mobile port of OOTP Baseball.

Originally Posted by AlpineSK

There are SO MANY features that they could have ported over from one game to the other...

Are there, though?

Are you sure the FHM team was hired to OOTP, and then started an OOTP hockey game from scratch, with full freedom to borrow any existing OOTP assets...

...or, did Malte already have a hockey game started as a personal project of his, which OOTP then picked up for integration into the OOTP line of games?

[JeffR]

Not that that's inaccurate, Stinson, but the post was a few months old - I think Alpine SK gets enough new opportunities to air his beefs with us already.

But I do have some Steam-related news: last night FHM passed the number of yes-votes OOTP had when it was greenlighted. OOTP had a bit of an advantage because it has a Linux version, though, since 50% of Valve's recent greenlights have been Linux-compatible as they build up the game catalogue for the Steam Machine. So I don't think our approval is imminent, but we're getting there.

[emren13]

I get it. It's never perfect, can't make everybody happy. You are doing what you can. We are all expecting this game to go through defining changes with the next patch and hope for a vast improvement. Until that happens though, I find it rather ridiculous and morally wrong to ask for votes, etc. This game should not be sold on STEAM, it should not be as expensive as it is given its current state. Just saying, everybody is trying to understand all the delays, etc. and that is NOT the issue. The issue is, you guys are acting like the game is in great shape and to spread the word. In all good conscience I could not endorse this game right now.

[pens66]

Originally Posted by emren13

I get it. It's never perfect, can't make everybody happy. You are doing what you can. We are all expecting this game to go through defining changes with the next patch and hope for a vast improvement. Until that happens though, I find it rather ridiculous and morally wrong to ask for votes, etc. This game should not be sold on STEAM, it should not be as expensive as it is given its current state. Just saying, everybody is trying to understand all the delays, etc. and that is NOT the issue. The issue is, you guys are acting like the game is in great shape and to spread the word. In all good conscience I could not endorse this game right now.

Markus Heinsohn actually called FHM "a big success" in the Beyond The Sideline announcement thread. Let that sink for a while...

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Originally Posted by pens66

Markus Heinsohn actually called FHM "a big success" in the Beyond The Sideline announcement thread. Let that sink for a while...

To be honest, I don't get people like you and AlpineSK: we all know that you hate the game, you think it will never develop into anything good and still you post it over and over again (in the case of AlpineSK: thank every negative post now). So why do you bother anymore? Just get your money back, leave the board and play something else. Wouldn't that make more sense?

[IvanIvanovich]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

To be honest, I don't get people like you and AlpineSK: we all know that you hate the game, you think it will never develop into anything good and still you post it over and over again (in the case of AlpineSK: thank every negative post now). So why do you bother anymore? Just get your money back, leave the board and play something else. Wouldn't that make more sense?

Maybe they want the game to succeed?

Some people (like me) are passionate about their gaming and want a game they like to play to be good.

I bought FHM way too early myself. As a long time player of the EHM (including shareware version) and a purchaser of every game Mr. Gindin has ever released I cannot but compare my experiences with those two (three) franchises.

When I first heard of FHM I thought - Great! At last something that will improve upon what EHM did.

Unfortunately FHM is not even close to the level of playability that EHM is and that is a game that was canned 7 years ago!

There are parts where FHM is better than EHM is (assistants actually capable of making intelligent line-ups) but for the most part this game not in the same league.

We all want something better than this because we really do want FHM to be a good game and a better game than others have in the past. That's the clou - we want an improvement on what we already have not something that's not-quite-as-good.

I do hope that it is possible for the team behind FHM to get there but I also really think that you need to listen to those gamers that have been playing NHL-sims for longer than a decade. We (at least sometimes) know what we're talking about.

Ivan

[Aliean]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

To be honest, I don't get people like you and AlpineSK: we all know that you hate the game, you think it will never develop into anything good and still you post it over and over again (in the case of AlpineSK: thank every negative post now). So why do you bother anymore? Just get your money back, leave the board and play something else. Wouldn't that make more sense?

i dont think you really understand why some people complain a lot but here it is people are getting tired of the gaming industry releasing buggy unfinished games for prices that are beyond ridiculous and has been for years now so people are just getting tired of it and as no one can do anything about it we can only complain.look at steam you cant really get a refund from them even tho here in europe by law they have to if the game isent up to standard and deliver what they promise steam just dont care and the same goes that we are by law aloud to sell our steam accounts if we so like in eurpoe but if steam get to know that you have it will be banned right away.game companies only care about 1 thing now days and thats money quality isent a priority anymore instead its hurry get the game out so we can make money fast instead of them taking a bit more time to develop and have a good quality release and many people would find that alot better.but i want to add that some people are just complaining because they have nothing better to do and cant give any feedback on anything.just ignore them

[pens66]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

To be honest, I don't get people like you and AlpineSK: we all know that you hate the game, you think it will never develop into anything good and still you post it over and over again (in the case of AlpineSK: thank every negative post now). So why do you bother anymore? Just get your money back, leave the board and play something else. Wouldn't that make more sense?

That's really the only thing you can come up with, it seems. Get a refund...

You really don't understand anything, do you?
I made this point so many times, but your reaction just proves that you really do not have a good idea what people have been posting here for the last 12+ months.
I don't hate this game. What stupid thing would that be. Why would I still be here? I want this game to succeed and I did everything I could to help since day one of the beta.
But just be honest: You ignored what was going on here for looong, loooong stretches. I don't know why. Maybe you were over your head with this project. I don't know. You never told us what was going on, which is exactly the point. You didn't communicate and all those guys who willingly paid money to be your beta testers tried to help but rarely, if ever, got any feedback. Don't try to argue that point. You know it's true. I posted so many things and I got exactly one response, which funnily enough was right after one of my rants and which was in response to my suggestions for the custom leagues. Also funny: Of that whole thread exactly one thing found its way into the game. The rest? Haha...

I really don't know why all this happened the way it did. I only know that I felt kind of insulted by how we customers were treated in the last months. We could post whatever we wanted, nobody even bothered. That included harsh criticism. You guys never replied. That created an environment here on the boards which certainly wasn't very enjoyable. At times there was not even any moderating or at least an attempt to by you guys to shed some light on the status of the game. You just let everything happen.

I'll stop now. I could write so many things, but why bother. You actually ignored my last post as well, which - of course - was critical as well towards your attitude.
One last thing: Stop being so overly defensive and stop playing the refund card. It's pathetic.

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Edit: took the discussion to PM to (hopefully) settle it in private.

[Stinson]

Originally Posted by pens66

One last thing: Stop being so overly defensive and stop playing the refund card. It's pathetic.

It's not pathetic, it's legitimate advice. If you feel like you wasted your money, then simply go get it back and leave. If you want to see this game succeed, then quit blubbering and start posting something productive. Have you tried helping, but the developers aren't listening? Then, again, take your money back and leave them to fail.

Seriously, it's been almost a full year now, and FHM 2014 obviously is not... and will never be... the game you thought it was going to be a year ago. We all know by now that this series is going to take a few years. So, what exactly do you want at this point; what exactly are you trying to coax from the OOTP team? Do you need a heartfelt hug? A plate of fresh cookies? A hand-written apology for their crimes? What is so important that you guys need to stick around and continue to dump on the OOTP team? Don't think it deserves to be on Steam? Great, then don't vote for it.

I'm certainly disappointed, and have little confidence left in the FHM team, but I can't even begin to blame them for being so defensive after enduring a year of mindless abuse and apparent revenge-seeking from people like you.

[skywalkr2]

Originally Posted by Stinson

I'm certainly disappointed, and have little confidence left in the FHM team, but I can't even begin to blame them for being so defensive after enduring a year of mindless abuse and apparent revenge-seeking from people like you.

I bought the game day one based on the OOTP brand... It was probably not a wise decision, but I am happy that hopefully my meager contribution will allow the franchise to continue to grow and improve. I hope that in 2 - 3 years it will be fun (I found it hard to play / dull in its present form).