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Suggestions for Future OOTP Versions Post suggestions for the next version of Out of the Park Baseball here!

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Old 07-02-2019, 08:58 PM   #1
One Post Wonder
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Separate OOTP into two games. It's for the best.

Just came here from the Steam forums where I read a couple of discussions on OOTP 20 and where OOTP is going. I've seen similar sentiments/discussions here which have led me to this conclusion, too.

There seem to be two groups of OOTP players ATM.

1. The historical/fictional player who has more interest in historical than modern baseball, or enjoys baseball but wants to play it with different rules, league arrangements, and settings than the modern game. These are the types of players who tend to like things like promotion/relegation, realistic historical minor leagues, negro leagues and the like.

2. The modern era player - who will buy the game and play a few seasons with their favorite, most recent team. Live updates are important to them and they they generally wont spend a lot of time customizing or messing around with historical/fictional stuff. I'd say this group has a lot more interest in PT than the other group.

I know some players might like both, or crossover and so on but stay with me. These seem to be the 2 general types of players. The first group has been around for longer, but there are more of the second group and a bigger pool of potential new customers with the second group too.

IMO those two groups are not interested in the same game at all. Things which are important to one are absolutely worthless to the other. It is not possible to make both groups happy.

People might say the hell with group 1, that the big money is in PT and the like and I'm sure that's true, but weren't previous versions of OOTP making money too? Why can't that end be kept up to maintain the old group of players?

Football Manager had this dilemma a few years ago. One group of players who wanted deeper and deeper management immersion and the other who wanted to play a few seasons with their favorite team with no mess. They recognized this problem and came up with Football Manager Touch.

Why can't OOTP do the same sort of thing? Have that OOTP Classic for historical/fictional players who would like to get crazy in-depth with their teams or their imaginary leagues and a 'New OOTP' for the people who want a modern experience with their live updates and their cards?

Note that this is not a rant against PT. This is an observation that OOTP has dominated this niche so much at this point that anyone wanting to play text-based baseball is here, but their interests outside of 'text based baseball' are so different that it requires more than one version.

Last edited by One Post Wonder; 07-02-2019 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 12:39 AM   #2
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there are two groups of people in the world

those who separate everything into two groups and those who don't
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Old 07-04-2019, 09:46 AM   #3
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Alright there, Ghandi. You're really playing that card, as contentious as this forum can be?

I've been playing OOTP for 17 years and OOTP XX represents a new concept to me. It is the first time I haven't updated not because of instability rumors or price, but simply because I'm not interested in it. It's not some protest thing. I showed up at the big sale like I do every year, looked at the updates and for the first time ever saw there wasn't a single meaningful thing there that I had interest in.

I don't see that changing next year either, looking at where the priorities seem to be. If you guys think every person who plays OOTP is into this change in focus then you are nuts. It's only working well now because there's no competition ATM.

Last edited by One Post Wonder; 07-04-2019 at 09:51 AM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 10:42 AM   #4
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How does it change anything if they split the games? Still the same coders making the same games (yes I said games). Right now you get a menu with links to two games, they are already separate.
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Old 07-04-2019, 05:11 PM   #5
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Marcus or someone else from OOTP was quoted on Steam as saying,

OOTP says most of its users base starts a new save each year with their favorite team. That is the most common play through. Then its Perfect team. With online, historical and fictional falling way way to the rear. Those 3 are in the super minority.

So 5 categories. Do the people in those last 3 categories sound like the same people who would spill over into the first 2?

That 'most common playthrough' sounds exactly like the type of person who would play FM touch over the standard FM. That's the demographic which OOTP is focusing on at this point. That wooing has clearly come at the expense of the last 3 categories and I don't see that changing anytime soon.

We don't currently have 2 separate games. We've got half a game in PT and 1.5 games in OOTP. PT would need an OOTP lite to go with it, to appeal to players who just want to get a few seasons in with the 2019 Yankees or something.

If you have two separate games, each team will have a distinct market and they can tailor each game for them. Then some of those suggestions you see in the big thread just below this one will actually make it into OOTP 21. Perhaps coaching and minor league managing would even get fixed. And with game #2, they could make the product as streamlined and modern as they want to appeal to the broader market. All of that isn't so much about the coders as about the designers.

As is, I'm betting that OOTP21 will be more 'accessible' and have a broader PT game and will attract more new players, but not offer any more to traditional players than OOTP 20 did. I'm concerned the traditional game will atrophy over time without a split.

Last edited by One Post Wonder; 07-04-2019 at 05:16 PM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 05:40 PM   #6
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Well in place of OOTP Lite, as you call it OOTP Go is in the works

Still seeing no advantage to separation.

I guess on could argue if you are correct about PT vs OOTP than OOTP would cease to exist if not paired with PT. After all why put any time into the lesser money maker?

Thank goodness Markus' vision was to make the best baseball game and not the best dollar generator. You can suggest all you want, it's your opinion and you're entitled. I just don't see OOTP on that path as long as Markus is around.
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Old 07-04-2019, 06:08 PM   #7
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It sounds to me as though the OP is concerned that some areas of the game are being ignored (and will continue to be ignored) for the sake of Perfect Team. If so, I share his concern. Money talks, and PT is bringing in the dough. Now, Markus has promised that this revenue will allow them to do more with the traditional game. New programmers are being hired. So, we'll see.
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Old 07-04-2019, 06:31 PM   #8
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I only have this to add, and it’s pure speculation. As goes the divergence of efforts and monies, as pstrickert mentions, I know at one time the ballpark creator was a bit of wishlist project for Markus. In addition, and this may be faulty memory or of my imagination, but I thought he’d also commented that it would be moving up on the list with a new programmer with that focus.

In any event, OOTP and PT are now the ball and glove. If you wanna play the game, you’re bringing both to the park.
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Old 07-05-2019, 11:08 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweed View Post
Thank goodness Markus' vision was to make the best baseball game and not the best dollar generator.
When OOTP first came out, I don't think Markus ever could have predicted the unique landscape that exists right now. Right now there is no PC Baseball outside of OOTP. No text based games, no 'The Show' to fill the needs of the casual player. Nothing. RBI Baseball and Mega Baseball would have been laughed out of the room in 2005. The genre has totally regressed. Take away OOTP Baseball and PC baseball gaming is back in 1989, just with better graphics.

So with this complete void out there, a dollar generator now is going to make a lot more than a dollar generator would have made 15 years ago. Yes, Markus's and OOTP's vision was to make the best baseball game, but they're not monks. I'm sure they all like hookers, cocaine, and 80's style speedboats as much as the rest of us. I wish I was in his position right now.

Anyway, I think the market could certainly handle two separate releases by the same company in this environment because there is nothing else out there. It would be giving OOTP a bigger net.

Last edited by One Post Wonder; 07-05-2019 at 03:14 PM.
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Old 07-05-2019, 03:32 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by One Post Wonder View Post
When OOTP first came out, I don't think Markus ever could have predicted the unique landscape that exists right now. Right now there is no PC Baseball outside of OOTP. No text based games, no 'The Show' to fill the needs of the casual player. Nothing. RBI Baseball and Mega Baseball would have been laughed out of the room in 2005. The genre has totally regressed. Take away OOTP Baseball and PC baseball gaming is back in 1989, just with better graphics.

So with this complete void out there, a dollar generator now is going to make a lot more than a dollar generator would have made 15 years ago. Yes, Markus's and OOTP's vision was to make the best baseball game, but they're not monks. I'm sure they all like hookers, cocaine, and 80's style speedboats as much as the rest of us. I wish I was in his position right now.

Anyway, I think the market could certainly handle two separate releases by the same company in this environment because there is nothing else out there. It would be giving OOTP a bigger net.
Just wanted to say this post gave me a good chuckle, thanks.
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