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Old 10-20-2017, 11:58 AM   #41
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General tidbits from the WHA?
Always like looking at the WHA. Thanks. Pretty busy weekend with my son’s hockey but will try and get something written on Sunday.
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Old 10-21-2017, 09:46 PM   #42
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This may be interesting to look at. Im from a small town and would like to see if any of these players made a career.

Samuel Russell (Rusty) Crawford (played between 1917-1920s) and my uncle lol
Leo Boivin
Ben Hutton
Todd Gill
Eric Selleck
Ryan Van Stralen (did he make the nhl? Only played for 67s in real life)
Alyn McCauley

These guys are from Brockville, Prescott, Spenserville, Edwardsburg/Carfinal area

Thanks
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Old 10-22-2017, 10:36 AM   #43
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The WHA

WORLD HOCKEY ASSOCIATION

I always enjoy looking back at the WHA whenever I do a historical sim as that league was one I followed very closely, or at least as close as one could in the pre-internet, pre-cable tv era. I was 7 years old in 1972 when the league formed and remember watching the WHA game of the week on tv for a couple of years. I had a new group of hockey heroes like Ron Ward, Andre Lacroix, Marc Tardif and Robbie Ftorek to follow along with the NHL stars.

In the sim none of those players played in the WHA but the league had a new group of stars, along with a few familiar names. Let's start with the all-time scoring leaders in WHA history.

Mike Rogers leads the league in career points with 662. He would score over 100 points in each of his five WHA seasons and lead the league in scoring twice while playing his entire WHA career with Edmonton. Rogers is the WHA single season point leader with 157 in 1975-76, one more than Anders Hedberg of Winnipeg recorded the following year. He would stay with the Oilers when they moved to the NHL before ending his career with a couple of seasons in St Louis. Rogers had decent NHL numbers, scoring 126 goals and 353 points in 521 games.

Here are the top 10 in WHA career points
Code:
Mike Rogers	Edmonton	662
Pat Hickey	Tor/Birm	630
Anders Hedberg  Winnipeg	629
Blair MacDonald	Edmonton	570
Mike Antonovich Minn/Wpg	555
Wayne Dillon	Tor/Birm	553
Ulf Nilsson	Winnipeg	513
Mark Howe	Houston		490
V. Nedomansky   Tor/Birm	489
Terry Ruskowski	Hou/NEng	486

The dominant team in the WHA was the Winnipeg Jets, winners of 3 straight Avco Cups and led by the Swedish duo of Hedberg and Nilson, along with goaltender Michel Dumas-who led them to the 3 titles.

1972-73

The first season of the WHA saw the Philadelphia Blazers run the table in the playoffs, winning 12 straight games including a sweep of the Ottawa Nationals to win the first Avco Cup. The Blazers would also dominate the regular season, going 67-7-1 to finish 29 points ahead of second place Ottawa in the East. The Minnesota Fighting Saints topped the West Division followed by Winnipeg and Chicago.

The Blazers, like most of the WHA in that first season, were a collection of unknowns. Their scoring leaders were Don Herriman (40-69-109) and Dennis Meloche (36-72-108) while Yves Archambault (43-4-2, 1.87) was between the pipers. Herriman would top 100 points the following season when the team moved to Vancouver before being sent to Quebec and seeing his point total drastically decline. He was out of hockey by 1977. Meloche would drop to 69 points the following season and have a steady decline until he too was finished by 1977. Archambault's career would be even shorter. The goalie would win 17 games in 27 starts for Vancouver the following season but was demoted to the minors in 1975 and was out of hockey at the end of that season. However, for one season the three of them and the rest of the collection of unknowns were WHA champions.

The scoring leader in the inaugural season was Keith Christiansen of the Minnesota Fighting Saints. The 28 year old, who had not played anywhere in the game prior to the 72-73 campaign, led the league in goals with 58 and points with 135. His WHA career would last 3 more seasons but as more talent came into the league his point totals would drop significantly. In real life, Christiansen was a captain of the University of Minnesota-Duluth hockey team and a 1972 Olympian before playing 138 career WHA games with Minnesota.

The assist leader in 72-73 was Christiansen's linemate Bob MacMillan - with 80 assists and 117 points. MacMillan would enjoy a very productive sim career, earning 363 points in 4 seasons with the Fighting Saints before going on to play over a decade in Los Angeles where he had 621 career NHL points.

1973-74

The Ottawa Nationals, after losing in the finals the previous season, claimed their first and only Avco Cup but it was under a new name as the team moved to Toronto and became the Toros. The Blazers moved to Vancouver and switched divisions but they easily finished first in the West ahead of the Fighting Saints.

After disposing of Houston in 4 straight games the Toros beat Vancouver in 5 games before topping the Cleveland Crusaders in 6 to win the title. Cleveland had swept Minnesota in the other semi-final.

The Toros leading players matched the real life club in many ways as Pat Hickey (52-61-113), Wayne Dillon (26-79-105) and Lou Nistico (32-55-87) all starred with Gilles Gratton (49-9-2, 2.22) in net.

Ray Adduono (45-100-145) of Cleveland won the league scoring title. Just like in real-life he would never play in the NHL but Adduono did earn 383 career WHA points in 299 games. In real-life he earned 197 points in 227 games with a career best 90 for the 1975-76 San Diego Mariners.

Mark Howe would join Houston as an 18 year old and be named the WHA MVP for the first of 3 times in his career. He was also given the Dennis A. Murphy Trophy as the league's best defenseman. Howe would win that award three times. Other winners were Dave Hutchinson, Tom Edur, Lars-Erik Sjoberg and Rod Langway.

1974-75

The 74-75 season marked the beginning of the only dynasty in the short-lived WHA as the Winnipeg Jets won their first of three straight titles. The WHA went to three divisions and the Jets had 122 points in the regular season, good for second overall but also only good enough for second place in the Canadian Division behind the Edmonton Oilers 136 points. The Canadian Division also saw the defending champion Toronto Toros rack up 100 points to finish fourth overall. Sandwiched in the middle was the Houston Aeros who led the West Division with 117 points. The Cleveland Crusaders were tops in the East but finished with only a .500 record.

The top 4 seeds all easily advanced through the opening round of the playoffs setting up a pair of terrific semi-final series. Edmonton and Houston would go a full seven games before the Oilers ultimately advanced to the finals. Winnipeg, on the other hand, had a surprisingly easy time sweeping Toronto in four straight. The more rested Jets dropped the Oilers in 6 games to win the Avco Cup.

While Houston's Howe was again league MVP and top defenseman the Jets did get their share of hardware as well. Sjoberg, with 17 points in 15 playoff games was named the post-season MVP while Anders Hedberg was named rookie of the year and won the scoring title with 58 goals and 136 points. Rick Dudley also played a key role with a 45 goal season. The season also marked the debut of Ulf Nilsson, who had 16 points in 13 games but would play a much bigger role the next couple of seasons.

1975-76

The Jets finished third this time in the Canadian Division behind Edmonton and Toronto but they were still fourth overall in league standings as Houston was the only US based team to finish with more than Winnipeg's 118 points. The Jets drew the Toros in the opening round of the playoffs and for the second straight year swept Toronto four straight. A second round sweep of the Phoenix Roadrunners allowed Winnipeg some rest before defending it's title. Edmonton would once again be the opponents as the Oilers also swept their way to the finals, beating Calgary and then Houston. The Oilers would fall for the second straight year to the Jets as Winnipeg won in 5 games.

Even though there was no Bobby Hull on the Jets in this universe to join them, Ulf Nilsson and Anders Hedberg dominated the WHA this season. Nilsson was named MVP after scoring 155 points - second behind only the record 157 from Edmonton's Mike Rogers, while Hedberg finished third in scoring with 138 points and then added 24 more in 13 playoff games to win the postseason MVP award. Rick Dudley, who joined Hedberg and Nilsson on the Jets big line, scored a career high 56 goals. Dudley would play 5 seasons in Winnipeg- scoring 188 times in 383 WHA games. He would have much less success in the NHL as he scored a grand total of 1 goal in 37 career games.

1976-77

The WHA was down to 12 teams and two divisions but the top teams did not change. The Oilers led the West Division and the league with 135 points - five more than the second place Jets. In the East the Birmingham Bulls - the new home of the Toronto Toros - finished first with 118 points. The finals would feature Winnipeg and Edmonton for the third straight season. The Jets swept Minnesota and Phoenix to advance while the Oilers swept New England and San Diego. The Mariners pulled off the biggest upset as they ousted the Bulls in the opening round. The finals followed the script of the past two seasons as once again Winnipeg, despite trailing the Oilers in the regular season, proved to be the superior team in the playoffs. The Jets captured their third straight Avco Cup in 6 games.

Anders Hedberg scored 156 points and won his second MVP award. Linemate Nilsson was second in scoring followed by Edmonton's Blair MacDonald, who established a WHA record with 65 goals. Birmingham's Vaclav Nedomansky reached the 60 goal mark for the second straight season. The league's top goaltender was Edmonton's Glenn Resch (57-8-2, 2.27). It was Resch's second season in Edmonton - a franchise he would go on to play a combined 649 NHL-WHA games for and earn 350 wins between the two leagues.

1977-78

The league dropped to 8 teams and just one division. Houston proved the class of the regular season with 130 points followed by the 3-time defending champion Jets (111) and the thrice bridesmaids from Edmonton (101). At the other end of the spectrum were a pair of awful clubs in the Cincinnati Stingers and Indianapolis Racers - who were a combined 28-115-7 on the season.

The playoffs were just two rounds and while Houston beat fourth place Quebec in 5 games the Jets and Oilers were set to do battle yet again. Winnipeg would prevail once more but this time Edmonton pushed the Jets to the full seven games before succumbing. The finals would also be a 7 game series and when the dust settled the Jets run had come to an end as the Aeros claimed their first and only Avco Cup title.

Houston had a good young team led by Mark Howe (27-90-117), who won the MVP award, John Tonelli (51-66-117), Terry Ruskowski (39-62-101), Morris Luckowich (39-59-98) and Rich Preston (39-54-93). The goaltender was Ron Grahame (40-6-3, 2.20), who would go on to play a couple of NHL seasons for the Colorado Rockies.

Hedberg won his third and final WHA scoring title while Mark Howe won his first playoff MVP award to go with his third and final regular season MVP and top defenseman trophies.

1978-79

The league dropped to seven teams as the Aeros folded and would not be back to defend their title. Birmingham finished with the best regular season record followed closely by the Edmonton Oilers. Winnipeg and Quebec rounded out the playoff participants. Cincinnati and Indianapolis remained at the bottom of the standings but there was a budding superstar for the Racers in Wayne Gretzky. The Great One, just 17 years old, led the Racers in scoring by a wide margin as he notched 43 goals and 96 points and was named rookie of the year. One of Gretzky's teammates was goaltender Mike Palmateer, who started 51 games and in his two years in Indianapolis compiled a record of 20-69-10. Palmateer - perhaps shell shocked from his WHA experience, would go on to play just 4 NHL games in his career. The other teammate of note was a fellow 17 year old in Mark Messier. Messier had 14 goals and 29 points in 69 games this season for the Racers but would go on to play over 1500 NHL games, primarily with Winnipeg, and scored 2126 career NHL points.

A number of young stars emerged in Birmingham as Rod Langway was named the top defenseman in just his second year in the league. Langway would go on to have a strong NHL career, playing over 1000 games for Hartford. The Baby Bulls had some other future stars in Ken Linseman - who scored 100 points as a 20 year old - and would notch 713 NHL points in 1044 career games. 19 year old Rick Vaive had 36 goals before moving on to Boston of the NHL. Vaive would not live up to his real-life stats as he would score just 115 NHL goals in 553 games. Craig Hartsburg and Rob Ramage were also 19 year old rookies with the Bulls. Each would enjoy solid NHL careers with Hartsburg in St Louis and Ramage with Montreal. Rounding out the baby bulls was Michel Goulet, who as an 18 year old had 13 goals in 30 games in Birmingham. He would later scored 432 times in 997 NHL games with the Flames.

The final youngster of note I should mention is Mike Gartner, who scored 42 goals and 81 points as a 19 year old with the Cincinnati Stingers. Gartner would join Goulet with the Flames when the WHA folded and would score 612 goals in an NHL career of nearly 1400 games.

As for the final WHA playoffs the Edmonton Oilers would at last get their revenge on Winnipeg. After being eliminated by the Jets four years in a row the Oilers advanced to the finals with a win over their hated rivals for the first time- taking the series in the full seven games. That momentum spurred Edmonton on to a six game win over Birmingham, which had beat Quebec in 5, to give the Oilers their final Avco Cup.


EPILOGUE

While all of the great talent to come out of the WHA certainly helped shape the NHL in the next decade, it was the bitter Edmonton-Winnipeg rivalry that the league is perhaps best remembered for. That rivalry carried over to the NHL as the Oilers, led by Wayne Gretzky, and the Jets, with Mark Messier in charge, would meet many times in the future. Neither would enjoy the ultimate success of a Stanley Cup in the Gretzky-Messier days but their would be plenty of bitter playoff series between the two clubs. Winnipeg never did win an NHL Cup - at least not for the franchise which moved to Phoenix, although the new Jets did get back to back titles in 2027 and 2028. The Oilers needed until 2014 to win their first Cup and would add a second a decade later when Connor McDavid led the team.
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Old 10-22-2017, 11:24 AM   #44
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This may be interesting to look at. Im from a small town and would like to see if any of these players made a career.

Samuel Russell (Rusty) Crawford (played between 1917-1920s) and my uncle lol
Leo Boivin
Ben Hutton
Todd Gill
Eric Selleck
Ryan Van Stralen (did he make the nhl? Only played for 67s in real life)
Alyn McCauley

These guys are from Brockville, Prescott, Spenserville, Edwardsburg/Carfinal area

Thanks
I love that idea. It is a great way to look at a cross-section of players from different eras. I may just pick a few other small towns or areas and see how careers panned out. Let's see how your guys did.


RUSTY CRAWFORD

I pride myself on my knowledge of NHL history but Crawford was a player I had not heard of before. In real life he played 38 NHL games with Ottawa and Toronto before going out west to the WCHL/WHL for a few years.

He had a good rookie season with Ottawa in my sim, scoring 10 goals and 21 points in 24 games as a 32 year old in 1917-18 but was dealt to Toronto over the summer of 1918. The Arenas, as they were called then, used Crawford in just 10 NHL games (3-3-6) in 1918-19. He would spend much of his time in the minors with the Amherst Ramblers the next few seasons with his only NHL call up being a 2 game stint in 1920-21. He did score twice in those two games and finished his NHL career with 15 goals and 29 points in 36 games. At the tail end of his career he went out west and played one season for Vancouver and two in Victoria, scoring 7 goals and 20 points in 51 games. Crawford's only 2 playoff games came with Vancouver in 23-24, when he was scoreless as the Maroons lost a 2-game total goal series 10-3 to the Metropolitans, who would go on to win the Stanley Cup that year.

LEO BOIVIN

His career came very close to real life in the sim. Boivin's real-life career saw him play 1150 NHL games and record 322 points. He spent the bulk of his career with Boston but also played defense for Toronto, Detroit and with expansion got a few extra seasons in with Pittsburgh and Minnesota.

In the sim Boivin played 1136 career games and had 406 points. Instead of Toronto, Boivin made his sim NHL debut with Boston in 1952-53 and made the all-rookie team after scoring 20 points in 70 games that year. He would remain with the Bruins as an NHL regular until being exposed in the 1967 expansion draft. The Penguins selected him 41st overall and Boivin would play his final NHL season in 67-68, scoring 6 goals and 27 points for the Pens. He would retire after that season having left Boston just before their Cup success of the early 70s. Boivin was on some bad Boston teams and played just 14 playoff games (1-3-4) in his 17 year career.

TODD GILL

Gill got a Cup in the sim as he won one as rookie with the Leafs in 1984-85. He didn't score but did have 5 assists in 20 playoff games that season and would finish with 138 career playoff games (6-26-32) as the Leafs had a couple of decent runs during his 16 year career.

Gill debut with 14 regular season games for the 84-85 Leafs and would go on to play 1146 career NHL games, scoring 92 goals and 391 points. He played all but 84 of those games in a Toronto uniform as he finished his career with just over a year in Dallas. Never a star, he was generally good for 20-30 points a season with the Leafs.

In real life Gill had 354 points in 1007 NHL games with seven teams.


ERIC SELLECK

In real life Selleck is still active as a 30 year old with the Hartford Wolf Pack. He played 3 NHL games: 2 with Florida in 2012-13 and one more for the 15-16 Arizona Coyotes.

In the sim he only spent one season in the NHL but did get to play 82 games for the 2012-13 San Jose Sharks, scoring 6 goals and 13 points while collecting 235 pims. Originally Montreal property, he was traded to the Sharks prior to the 12-13 season in exchange for Jim Slater. After his one season in San Jose the Sharks let him become a free agent and signed with the Bruins organization. He would bounce around the minors for the next 7 seasons, playing 405 games while scoring 70 goals and 184 points with Providence, Charlotte and Grand Rapids before retiring in 2020. He never made it back to the NHL after his year with the Sharks.

RYAN VAN STRALEN

Because Van Starlen has not yet played any professional hockey he does not appear in the database for a historical game. He is with Carleton University right now so perhaps he is in the game when you play a modern game.



ALYN McCAULEY

The real life McCauley played 488 games for Toronto, San Jose and Los Angles and scored 69 goals and 166 points in his career, which was shortened by concussions.

Our sim version of McCauley had a little longer career, getting 604 games in with New Jersey, Calgary and Nashville. He scored 78 goals and 198 points in his career. McCauley never won a Cup but did reach the conference finals twice - once with Calgary in 2000 and five years later with Nashville. In all, McCauley had 1 goal and 6 points in 35 career playoff games.

In this universe he was never traded from the Devils to Toronto in the deal that brought Doug Gilmour and Dave Ellett to the Devils so his NHL career began in the Meadowlands after two seasons in Albany. He played 34 games, scoring 7 goals and 14 points for the 98-99 Devils as a 21 year old but he would be selected by Atlanta in the 1999 expansion draft. He never played for the Thrashers as he was flipped to Calgary and would play 67 games for the Flames in 99-00, scoring 13 goals and 30 points as he helped Calgary reach the conference finals that year.

It was a short stay in Alberta as he was selected in the expansion draft again, this time by Minnesota. Again he never played a game for the team that selected him in an expansion draft as he was dealt to Nashville a month after the draft for defenseman Mike Wilson. He found a home in Music City, playing 7 seasons for the Predators and enjoyed one more good playoff run when the Preds reached the conference finals in 2005. His career ended in 2009 after finishing with 2 seasons for the Milwaukee Admirals.
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Old 10-22-2017, 04:43 PM   #45
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Are you able to look at players from different countries.

Like the highest scoring player from Japan?

If so I would like to know the highest scoring players from.

Belarus
Austria
Latvia
Slovenia
Australia
Japan
China

Or any other non traditional hockey country lol
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Old 10-22-2017, 11:54 PM   #46
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Thanks for the WHA stuff. I'm still a little disappointed with how the game the cpu handles the league and talent.
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Old 10-24-2017, 10:32 AM   #47
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I noticed you had a way to see how many times single game records were had. But when i go to this screen I am limited to the most recent time someone scored "7" goals. How do you see the history of each individual record?

Also is there a way to go back and look at your teams stats and player stats from previous years in your dynasty without individually checking each players stats?
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Old 10-26-2017, 09:32 PM   #48
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Are you able to look at players from different countries.

Like the highest scoring player from Japan?

If so I would like to know the highest scoring players from.

Belarus
Austria
Latvia
Slovenia
Australia
Japan
China

Or any other non traditional hockey country lol
Not sure that I can sort them that way. Will have to look but remember this was a historical sim so for countries like Japan and China there will likely be none...unless a couple of players snuck in once I advanced past 2016-17
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Old 10-26-2017, 09:39 PM   #49
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Thanks for the WHA stuff. I'm still a little disappointed with how the game the cpu handles the league and talent.
I agree. Need to have some system where the NHL will lose some players to the WHA right off the bat in '72, similar to Bobby Hull, Cheevers, Frank Mahovlich, Bernie Parent and others who jumped.

The first year or two of the WHA is the big issue. You don't get any established stars moving over and there are also no fringe NHLers going either. The guys who would be the 5th-10th defenseman or 9th-15th forwards are content to sit on the bench or play in the minors in the game when they should be just the players who jump leagues.

Instead the WHA rosters are filled with players not good enough to make the NHL 50 man protected list so you have a league with a ton of very bad players and a few good rookies who signed with the WHA after being drafted instead of the NHL.

The WHA player allotment is getting a little better this version but still needs a lot more attention.
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Old 10-26-2017, 09:42 PM   #50
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I noticed you had a way to see how many times single game records were had. But when i go to this screen I am limited to the most recent time someone scored "7" goals. How do you see the history of each individual record?

Also is there a way to go back and look at your teams stats and player stats from previous years in your dynasty without individually checking each players stats?
I went to each team's individual game record page. Might still have missed a guy if one team had more than 1 player do it but at least I found almost all, if not all of them.

Only way to look at team stats from previous year is to go to league or team history and select a team from a particular year. You can view the individual player stats on that team for the season. Would love an OOTPstyle historical almanac and hopefully it makes the cut for next year's version.
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Old 10-31-2017, 05:54 PM   #51
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How about the Flyers' history? I know you mentioned they won the Cup once, and you gave the individual histories of a few players, but how did the franchise do overall?
Individually, how did Bill Barber, Dave Schultz, Mikael Renberg, Mark Recchi, John Leclair, Simon Gagne, Brian Boucher, and Eric Desjardins do?
Oh, and was Alexandre Daigle the bust he was in real life?
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Old 11-01-2017, 10:15 AM   #52
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Howd the Flames do? i seen you say they won in 89'.. Any other big moments for them? surprised to not see Monahan or Iggy on that top goal scorers list. Maybe i just missed them lol
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Old 11-01-2017, 02:19 PM   #53
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Also im curious how Harry Yorks career ended up. His brother lived across the road from me and hes from my town. Met him once when i was younger. I think he only managed 70 or so points in 250 games in real life. Curious if he panned out any better in the sim.
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Old 11-01-2017, 05:24 PM   #54
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Also im curious how Harry Yorks career ended up. His brother lived across the road from me and hes from my town. Met him once when i was younger. I think he only managed 70 or so points in 250 games in real life. Curious if he panned out any better in the sim.
Thanks for the continued interest in this. I will get to the Flames, Flyers and the guys listed when I have a bit more time but I have time to do a quick update on Harry York right now.

HARRY YORK
York's numbers compare pretty closely with his real life totals. He played 273 NHL games in the sim - all with St Louis, but scored just 15 goals and 51 points. In real life he had 29 goals and 75 points in 244 games.

The York of this sim joined the Blues as a 22 year old in 1996-97 and enjoyed the best season of his career, scoring 6 goals and 18 points in 75 games. The following year he had a serious cut to his ear and missed some time, playing in just 45 games while scoring only 1 goal. He would play 74 games the following season (3-5-8) but only 58 in what would be his final full season with St Louis in 1999-00, scoring 5 goals and 14 points.

He started the 2000-01 campaign with the Blues but after registering just 4 points (all assists) in 21 games he was put on waivers by the Blues. York signed with Edmonton but the Oilers assigned him to Hamilton of the AHL where he had 17 points in 37 games. He would end his career in the AHL by spending 2 more seasons with the Bulldogs. He was not resigned after the 02-03 campaign and became a free agent, however York would not get signed anywhere and his career came to an end.
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Old 11-01-2017, 06:08 PM   #55
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Nashville

This is very cool stuff. I've been a Nashville Predators fan since the early expansion days so I'm curious how the franchise performed in a universe where the 2007 fire sale never happened. I'm also specifically interested in the careers of some of the players I remember from the early days like David Legwand, Scott Hartnell, Tomas Vokoun, Scott Walker, Martin Erat, and Kimmo Timonen.
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Old 11-01-2017, 09:04 PM   #56
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Quote:
How about the Flyers' history? I know you mentioned they won the Cup once, and you gave the individual histories of a few players, but how did the franchise do overall?
Individually, how did Bill Barber, Dave Schultz, Mikael Renberg, Mark Recchi, John Leclair, Simon Gagne, Brian Boucher, and Eric Desjardins do?
Oh, and was Alexandre Daigle the bust he was in real life?
The Flyers only Cup came in 1985-86 when a team led by Tim Kerr (56-59-115), Mark Howe (26-66-92), Pat LaFontaine (32-55-87), Brian Propp ((28-59-87) and Dave Poulin (33-43-76) won it all. Pelle Lindberg (40-17-6, 2.85) had the best season of his career that year but it was a 21 year old rookie by the name of Ron Hextall who led them to the Cup. Hextall had just one regular season game under his belt when he replaced an injured Lindberg for the opening round against the Rangers. The Hextall-led Flyers would win the best of five series in 4 games and follow that up with consecutive 5 game series wins over New Jersey and Boston to reach the finals. Hextall and company would sweep the Calgary Flames for their first and only Cup.

It was a rough start for the expansion Flyers although they did make the playoffs in their inaugural year of 1967-68 after going 14-55-7. Philadelphia would miss the playoffs each of the next 5 years and not enjoy a winning seasons until 1974-75 when they finished with 86 points. It was also the year of their first division title and their first playoff series win as they topped Detroit in 7 games in the quarterfinals before losing 4 straight to Chicago in the semis.

That 74-75 Flyers club was led by Bobby Clarke (26-63-89), Bill Barber (35-35-70), Bill Clement (23-38-61) and Andre Lacroix (16-44-60) along with the goaltending of veteran Les Binkley (23-22-4, 3.24)


Philadelphia would make the semi-finals again in 1980 but lost in 5 to the Islanders. They came within a whisker of a Cup three years later but lost to the Toronto Maple Leafs in a 7 game final. The Leafs and Flyers would meet again 2 years later with Toronto again emerging with the Cup after a win in 6 games. The next season the Flyers finally got their title.

The 1980's ended with a couple of more decent runs but the result was elimination in the conference finals on both occasions. That set the stage for the lowest period in Philadelphia hockey history as the Flyers won just 1 playoff series in a 23 year span starting in 1990.

That drought ended in 2012-13 with the Flyers reached the conference finals only to fall to eventual Cup champion Montreal in a 7 game series. After missing the postseason altogether in 2013-14 the Flyers again reached the conference finals in 2015 but fell in 5 games to Pittsburgh as the Penguins won the Cup. Those teams were led by Jeff Carter, Claude Giroux, James van Riemsdyk, Jordan Staal and Erik Gustafsson with Sergei Bobrovsky in net.

More lean years followed but after missing the playoffs 4 straight seasons the Flyers reached the conference finals in 2028-29 with a cast of fictional players. The next year also saw Philadelphia in the conference finals but that would be the final playoff berth for the Flyers before I stopped the sim at the end of the 2035-36 season.

As for the players you asked about:

BILL BARBER
Barber had a great career which was spent entirely in orange and black. He broke in as a 20 year old in 1972-73 by scoring 13 times and adding 25 assists. He would play until the age of 35 and finish his career with 407 goals and 1018 career points in 1094 games. Barber had back to back 103 point seasons in 1977-78 and 78-79 with the latter year including a career best 54 goal performance.

He added 121 points in 161 career playoff games including a goal and 2 assists late in his career in the Cup winning season. He made the all-rookie team and was named a second team all-star in 1978-79. He was also elected to the Hockey Hall of Fame in the game.

DAVE SCHULTZ
There were no Broad Street Bullies in this game as Schultz was a Detroit Red Wing although he was a teammate briefly of Don Saleski's with the Wings. Schultz played 467 games in his NHL career, scoring 44 goals and 104 points while racking up 1677 penalty minutes. He had 216 minutes as a rookie in 1973-74 and 2 years later would amass 356 minutes in 80 games. After 7 seasons with Detroit he was dispatched to the minors where he ended his career with the Springfield Indians in 1981-82 by picking up 152 pim's (and 9 goals) in 65 games.

Schultz did not crack the single season pim leaders as top spot surprisingly went to Gary Roberts after the Calgary winger earned 440 minutes (and 59 goals) in 1990-91 (How many would he have scored had he stayed out of the box). In Schultz' era the big penalty guy was Keith Magnuson as the former Hawk and Capital had 3 seasons with over 350 pim including 406 in 1975-76 with Washington.

Mikael Renberg
Renberg had a great start to his career, scoring 53 points as a rookie and 92 the following season. He spent his entire career with Philadelphia including a career best 1995-96 campaign when he had 38 goals and 103 points. Injuries derailed him late in his career and his final season was at the age of 29 in 2001-02. In all, Renberg played 750 NHL games, scoring 250 goals and 634 points.
He was a finalist for the Calder Trophy, a first team all-star in 1993-94 and won the Lady Byng Trophy in 1997.

Mark Recchi
Reechi enjoyed a very productive career, scoring 489 goals and 1510 points in 1587 NHL games - all with Pittsburgh. He added another 116 points in 144 playoff games but like his famous linemate Mario Lemieux never did win a Stanley Cup. Real life numbers for Recchi were quite close - 1652 NHL games with 577 goals and 1533 career points.

He ranks fourth all-time in points by a Penguin behind Lemieux (2336), Crosby (2002) and Jagr (1980) and is 35th all-time in career NHL points - ranking just ahead of former Flyer captain Bobby Clarke. He was named to the first all-star team once and the second squad on 3 occasions. He also won a Mark Messier Leadership award in 1997 and was elected in to The Hockey Hall of Fame.

JOHN LECLAIR
No Legion of Doom in this history as Renberg was the only Flyer. Lindros spent his career in Quebec/Colorado and later New Jersey while Leclair stayed in Montreal until very late in his career. Leclair played 1039 NHL games, a little more than in real life, but was a fair bit less productive as he scored just 310 goals and 612 points (real life was 967 games, 406 goals and 819 points).

He was more of a second line player in Montreal - scoring around 25 goals a season although he did peak with 46 in the 1995-96 campaign. Never recognized for an individual award, Leclair did win a Stanley Cup with the Habs and played in 145 playoff games, scoring 49 goals and adding 35 assists. He ended his 14 year career with a season in Phoenix after signing as a free agent.

Simon Gagne
Gagne had a great start to his career, scoring 31 goals and 62 points as a 19 year and won the Calder Trophy as rookie of the year. That would be the best season offensively of his career as he dealt with a number of different injuries. In all Gagne played 757 NHL games, all with Philadelphia, scoring 166 goals and 402 points. He ended his career at the age of 33 after a couple of seasons with Adirondack of the AHL. In comparison in real life he played 822 games, scoring 291 times and adding 310 assists for 601 points.

Brian Boucher
Boucher was a career minor league, playing in just 39 NHL games. He played 1 game for the Flyers as a 19 year old in 95-96, getting a win despite allowing 4 goals against. He was stuck behind Dominic Roussel and Ron Hextall in the Flyer system so he moved on to Buffalo in 1998. He backed up Manny Fernandez for a season, playing in 31 games and going 11-11-3 but was demoted to Rochester early the following year. He would bounce around the minors in the Flames and Rangers systems but never got back to the NHL. He had a respectable AHL record, going 168-91-22 with a 2.21 career GAA. By 2005 at the age of 29 he was done with professional hockey.


ERIC DESJARDINS
It took Eric a couple of seasons to crack the Montreal defense but once he did make the NHL in his third pro season he was there to stay, playing 976 games on the Canadiens blueline, scoring 152 goals and 533 career points. He won 2 Stanley Cups in his career, including his rookie season when he had 13 points in their playoff run. Desjardins played 128 postseason games, scoring 27 goals and 67 points. He never won an individual award but was a leader on the Montreal defense for many years, retiring a Hab after the 2004-05 season.

ALEXANDRE DAIGLE
Never panned out here either and he bounced all over the place. In all, Daigle played 328 NHL games but scored just 45 goals and 118 points. He also played an additional 367 games in the minors.

Daigle never played for Ottawa as the Sens traded him to San Jose for a then 39 year old Dave Taylor before his rookie season. Taylor would spend the year in PEI of the AHL before retiring while Daigle would score 3 goals and 7 points in 15 games with the Sharks, who demoted him to Kansas City the following year.

The Flyers took a chance on him as a 20 year old in 1995-96 as they gave up a pair of career minor leaguers for him. Daigle played 53 games for Philadelphia that season, scoring 8 goals and 18 points and had 16 points in 68 games the following year.

He was on the move again that off-season when Philadelphia traded him to Buffalo in exchange for Bob Boughner. Daigle spent most of the next 3 years in Rochester before getting a shot in 1999-2000 with the Sabres. He had 11 points in 40 games that season in Buffalo and followed that up with the best year of his career as a 25 year old when he had 15 goals and 43 points. After dipping to 15 points the following season he was demoted to Rochester and then dealt to Providence for a minor leaguer. A year later the Sabres got him back from the Bruins organization but kept him in Rochester.

He would finally get back to the NHL at the deadline in 03-04 when Colorado acquired him for long-time minor leaguer Cam Severson. Daigle had one assist in 3 games with the Avalanche in what would turn out to be the final games of his NHL career.





I will get to the Flames and Nashville in the next few days. Thanks again for following along.
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enf91 (11-01-2017)
Old 11-01-2017, 09:50 PM   #57
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Figured I had time to get through Calgary quickly while watching the ball game.

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Howd the Flames do? i seen you say they won in 89'.. Any other big moments for them? surprised to not see Monahan or Iggy on that top goal scorers list. Maybe i just missed them lol
CALGARY FLAMES

From humble beginnings and some bad teams in Atlanta the Calgary Flames emerged as a dynasty with 3 straight Cups in the late 1980s.

The Flames joined the NHL along with the New York Islanders in 1972-73 and that first season featured names such as Bill Lesuk, who led the team with 45 points, along with veterans Bruce MacGregor, Ralph Backstrom and Dean Prentice. In net was Phil Myre. The cast changed over the next 8 years quite a bit but the result was the same as the Flames struggled season after season. In 8 years in Atlanta beginning in 1972-73 the expansion Flames made the playoffs 3 times but never won a playoff series and did not even win a playoff game until their final year in Atlanta.

1980-81 saw them move north to Calgary and while the club did miss the playoffs they had acquired some young talent ready to break out. Phil Myre was still there as the goalie and playing quite well but the aging veterans of the expansion days were replaced by young guns Mike Gartner (40-41-81) and Michel Goulet (23-48-71) - a pair of teenagers fresh from a year in the WHA, along with 19 year old rookie defenseman Paul Reinhart. Kent Nilsson had missed most of the 80-81 season with an injury but was back the following season and teamed with Gartner and Goulet on one of the league's top lines.

Calgary won their first playoff series in franchise history that year, beating LA in the preliminary round before falling to rival Edmonton in the quarterfinals. Edmonton would knock Calgary out in the opening round each of the next two seasons but in 1984-85 the young Flames were starting to mature and be considered a legitimate contender. Calgary swept Winnipeg and Vancouver, who had eliminated Edmonton, in the first two rounds only to run into a more experienced Toronto team in the conference finals.

Calgary went a step further the following season, reaching the finals by beating Toronto only to lose in 4 straight to the Flyers. The next season, 1986-87, was a year Flames fans will never forget. They swept Vancouver in the opening round and then survived a tough 7-game series with Edmonton - the first time they ever beat the Oilers. It was easy the rest of the way as 8 straight wins over Toronto and Montreal gave Calgary it's first Cup.

Flames fans had another year of celebration the following season as the Flames breezed by Winnipeg, Edmonton, Detroit and then Carolina in the finals...losing just 1 game in the process. It was old hat for the fans the next season as they celebrated the three-peat with a first round win over Edmonton before knocking off Los Angeles, Detroit and Mario Lemieux's Penguins to win the Cup once again.

That would be the end of the parades, at least for a while as the rapidly improving Red Wings knocked off the champs in the conference finals in 1990. The Wings and Flames would meet in the conference finals again the next two seasons with the Wings winning in 7 games each time. In 1993 the Flames fell in the first round to Edmonton and the dynasty was over.

Calgary would win one more Cup, it's fourth in 2033 with a fictional player dominated roster that also included an aging Sean Monahan. Those great Calgary teams of the late 1980's featured a star studded cast that in addition to Goulet and Gartner, also featured Al MacInnes, Joe Nieuwendyk, Gary Suter, Gary Roberts, Brett Hull and for the final two seasons Theo Fleury. There was still a link to the expansion year as Phil Myre was a member of all three Cup winners, although Michel Plasse was the number one by that time.

SEAN MONAHAN
Monahan had an incredible career that lasted until 2033. In all he scored 801 career goals and 1881 points in 1604 NHL games - all with Calgary. He is the all-time leader for the Flames in most offensive categories and ranks 11th in NHL history in points and 10th all-time in goals. Here are the names of the players who have scored more than the 801 goals Monahan recorded: Howe, Gretzky, Yzerman, Lemiuex, Messier, Robitaille,Jagr, Crosby and Selanne.

He also ranks 19th in career playoff points with 206 in 195 games. His Flames made the finals 5 times in his career but won their only Cup in 2033, near the end of his career. He won a Hart Trophy, a Conn Smythe in 2018 despite losing in the finals, 4 Art Ross Trophys and 4 Maurice Richard Awards as the league goal scorer.

Monahan had 5 fifty-goal seasons including a career high 57 in 2024-25. He is obviously in the Hall of Fame and like the real-life Lanny McDonald ended his career with a Stanley Cup win as a Flame.

JAROME IGINLA

In this world the Dallas Stars did not trade a young Iginla to the Flames so he spent his entire career in Texas. It was not as productive as real-life as Iginla played 1441 career NHL games while scoring 401 goals and 941 career points. He trails only Mike Modano (1594), Neal Broten (1373) and Dino Ciccarelli (1267) in points by a Star but the numbers pale in comparison to the real life totals (1554 GP, 625-675-1300).

Iginla was a solid 60 point a year player but never a superstar. His career best was 36 goals in 08-09 as a 31 year old and 85 points, which he earned the previous season. The Stars were a bad team for most of his career and Iginla only played in 26 playoff games in his career as a result. He had 7 goals and 11 points in the postseason.


Preds history is up next but unfortunately don't have time tonight.

Last edited by Tiger Fan; 11-01-2017 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 11-02-2017, 02:45 PM   #58
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Nashville

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This is very cool stuff. I've been a Nashville Predators fan since the early expansion days so I'm curious how the franchise performed in a universe where the 2007 fire sale never happened. I'm also specifically interested in the careers of some of the players I remember from the early days like David Legwand, Scott Hartnell, Tomas Vokoun, Scott Walker, Martin Erat, and Kimmo Timonen.
Thanks. Glad you enjoy it as it is a lot of fun for me looking at different teams and players.


NASHVILLE PREDATORS
The Preds joined the NHL in 1998-99 and made the playoffs with a 30-40-12 record that first season. A five year playoff drought followed but patience was rewarded as the Predators won a Stanley Cup in 2007 - less than a decade after joining the league. They made the playoffs every season from 2005 to 2013 but that was followed by a long drought and the '07 Cup remains the only one in franchise history.

The first playoff round win in franchise history came in 2005, when they beat Anahiem in 7 games and then blanked Detroit 4 straight behind sound goaltending from Craig Billington before falling to Cup champion Colorado in the Western Conference Finals. The following season they were upset by Vancouver in the opening round but in 2007 the Predators went all the way after finishing the regular season as the number 5 seed in the West. The Preds lost just twice in 18 games as they breezed through the post-season beating St Louis, San Jose, Detroit and Toronto to win the Cup. Although they would make the playoffs each of the next six seasons, Nashville would win just one series in that time.

2013-14 was the beginning of a decade long drought when Nashville missed the playoffs 11 straight season. In 2026 the Predators were led by fictional player Nate Van Dousen, who led the league with 100 points that season. Van Dousen, who is Nashville's all-time point leader with 862 and is a 2-time Hart Trophy winner, carried the team to the conference finals but they lost in 7 games to Edmonton. Their only other deep playoff run came this past season (2035-36) when they reached the finals only to fall to Toronto - the team they defeated for the '07 Cup, in 6 games.

The '07 Cup club was led offensively by Jason Pominville (33-49-82), Scott Upshall (33-34-67) and Shea Weber (17-41-58). The key to Nashville's success was it's team defense and goaltender Pekka Rinne, who went 41-24-1 with a 2.34 GAA in the regular season and followed that up with an incredible playoff run that saw him win 16 of 18 games with a 1.57 GAA and a .934 save percentage. It was Shea Weber and not Rinne who won the Conn Smythe Trophy that year. Weber had 17 points and a +15 rating in the 18 playoff contests. Weber also won a pair of Norris Trophy's in his career and is the all-time leader in assists by a Pred with 543 while trailing only fictional player Van Dousen in points.

DAVID LEGWAND
Ranked third all-time on the Preds in goals (263) and points (767), Legwand played his entire career in Nashville starting as an 18 year old rookie in the franchise's first season. He had 12 goals and 23 points that season and evolved into a consistent 50 point a year player. He missed much of the regular season in the Cup year but did play in 17 playoff games, scoring twice and adding 8 assists.

In 1273 games Legwand's numbers were 263-504-767. He ended his career in 2015-16 with a brief demotion to Milwaukee to end the season. Those 10 games in Milwaukee were the only minor league games he ever played.

SCOTT HARTNELL
Only fictional player Nate Van Dousen scored more goals as a Pred than Hartnell's 362. He spent his entire 15 year NHL career in Nashville, appearing in 1090 games while earning 754 points. He had a mean streaka in the game and recorded 2307 career pim's, including 348 minutes in 2013-14.

He played in 81 playoff games and had 54 points, including 13 points in the Cup run of '07.

TOMAS VOKOUN

Vokoun took a while to make the NHL but made the most of his stay. He spent nearly a decade in the Habs minor league system before getting a shot with Montreal as a 29 year old in 2005-06. He spent just 4 years in Montreal and only 2 as a starter but had a long playoff run in each of them. Vokoun would lead the Habs to a conference final and also a Cup win, which came in 2008 and he was named the Conn Smythe winner that year. In all, he played in just 173 NHL games, going 119-36-13 with a 1.95 career GAA. He was 33-18-2 in the playoffs with a 2.27 GAA and .907 save percentage.

Vokoun was dealt to Ottawa late in his career in a trade that saw Nick Foligno go the other way but he never played for the Senators as he spent his final year with Binghamton of the AHL.

SCOTT WALKER
The Preds all-time penalty minute leader with 2377 played 882 games in a Nashville uniform. He scored 161 goals and 378 points in 11 and a half years with Nashville.

Walker began his pro career in the Kings system, playing in the minors for his first two season but did get called up for 2 games with LA as a 22 year old. The following season he got into 5 games with the Kings, scored his first goal and earned 16 pim's.

LA dealt him to Montreal in exchange for goaltender Martin Brochu at the trade deadline in 1998 and he would play 1 game for the Canadiens that season, earning an assist and a 5 minute major. He started the 98-99 season in Fredericton but was dealt to the Rangers that December, which finally gave him a chance to be an everyday player in the NHL. The Rangers dressed him for 42 games and he had 9 points and 91 penalty minutes.

A free agent that off-season he signed with the Phoenix Coyotes, returning to the city his pro career began while with Los Angeles' farm club - the Phoenix Roadrunners. In 99-00, Walker played 61 games and scored 10 goals and 19 points with the Coyotes but that March he was traded to the Predators along with defenseman Corey Foster in exchange for defensemen Jayson More and Alexander Boikov.

Walker would finish his career in Nashville and play a role in the '07 Cup win. He had 6 points that playoff year and in all played 68 postseason games in his career, scoring 8 times and adding 14 assists to go with 198 pim's. His career regular season numbers including the games with LA, the Rangers, Coyotes and Montreal along with Nashville saw Walker play 993 games, scoring 176 goals and 409 points with 2582 penalty minutes.

MARTIN ERAT
Erat is another of the players who spent his entire NHL career in Nashville. He played in 1059 games, scoring 177 times with 535 points, good for 7th on the team career points list behind Van Dousen (862), Weber (793), Legwand (767), Hartnell (754), Jeffrey Bailey -fictional (567) and Ryan Suter (546).

He played in 86 post-season games and had 13 points in the Cup run of 2007. He scored a career high 22 goals as a 28 year old in 09-10 and his best point total was in 2004-05 when he went 15-37-52.

KIMMO TIMONEN
Timonen was never a Predator in this universe. He began in the Kings system as an 18 year old and would play his entire NHL career in LA except for his final season with Carolina. Timonen played 997 NHL games, scoring 140 goals and 542 points.

He did not make the NHL for good until 98-99 as a 23 year old but would be a fixture on the LA blueline until a trade to Carolina just prior to the 2010-11 season. Timonen, who was 35 at the time and just coming off a Bill Masterton Trophy win in 2010, was dispatched to the Hurricanes for Harold Druken and Brian Dumoulin. He would end his career with 20 points in 64 games with Carolina.

There was not much playoff success for Timonen as his Kings won just 1 series in his time there and he played in 58 postseason games, recording just 17 points including 1 assist in 5 games with Carolina in his final year.

Timonen was a second team all-star once in his career, 2000-01 when he had 56 points as a 26 year old. He followed that up with back to back 57 point campaigns, which was his career high.


CRAIG BILLINGTON
You didn't ask about him but he deserves mention for his long NHL career including 9 seasons in Nashville that ended with a Stanley Cup in 2007. Billington played a decade in New Jersey but was deemed expendable for the expansion draft in 1998 because the Devils had Martin Brodeur and Mike Dunham. Nashville took Billington with their first pick and he was their number one goalie until Rinne took over in 05-06.

Billington is third all-time in wins and shutouts by a Predator and has a career record of 290-368-109 between New Jersey and Nashville with 64 shutouts. He helped carry Nashville to the conference finals in 04-05, going 9-6 with a 2.16 GAA that playoff. In all he played 36 postseason games and was 13-18 with a 3.22 GAA. He did not play in the '07 playoffs but was the backup for every game behind Rinne as a 40 year old. He retired immediately after the Cup win.
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Old 11-02-2017, 05:49 PM   #59
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Thanks for the Flyers info. Did they have any unexpected or ahistorical players do well?
Also, how did Peter Forsberg, Jakub Voracek, Reggie Leach, Rick MacLeish, Rod Brind'Amour, Keith Primeau, Justin Williams, Jeff Carter, Mike Richards, Patrick Sharp, Steve Mason, Martin St. Louis, Vincent Lecavalier, Pavel Bure, and Wayne Simmonds do?
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Old 11-02-2017, 11:11 PM   #60
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Quote:
Thanks for the Flyers info. Did they have any unexpected or ahistorical players do well?
Also, how did Peter Forsberg, Jakub Voracek, Reggie Leach, Rick MacLeish, Rod Brind'Amour, Keith Primeau, Justin Williams, Jeff Carter, Mike Richards, Patrick Sharp, Steve Mason, Martin St. Louis, Vincent Lecavalier, Pavel Bure, and Wayne Simmonds do?

No one on the skater leaderboard for the Flyers team history looks out of place but Mike Smith is a name that jumps out as a goalie you would not expect to have success as a Flyer. He started with Dallas and had a couple seasons in Buffalo before being dealt to the Sabres in exchange for Derek Roy as a 25 year old in 07-08. Smith would play 12 seasons with the Flyers and finished as the franchise's all-time leader in wins and shutouts. He had 368 wins with Philadelphia, topping Ron Hextall (312) and Pete Peeters (244). In all, Smith was 404-273-68 in an NHL career that included 60 shutouts.

PETER FORSBERG

Second to only Brian Propp in career points as a Flyer, Forsberg spent 14 years in Philadelphia before ending his career with 2 seasons in Detroit. He had 1212 points including 458 goals in 1182 career NHL games. He won the Hart Trophy 3 times and the Selke twice but saw very little playoff action with Philadelphia - playing in just 48 games with Philadelphia but got another 27 post-season games in his 2 years in Detroit. He was dealt to the Wings in September of 2006 in exchange for 32 year old Jason Arnott.

The deal was a bust for the Flyers as Arnott failed to record a point in the 4 career games he played with the Flyers to end his NHL career. Forsberg is a member of the Hockey Hall of Fame.

JAKUB VORACEK

Another Hall of Famer, Voracek spent the bulk of his career in Columbus before finishing with 2 seasons in Dallas. In all he played 1403 NHL games, scoring 456 goals and 1134 points. He won the Conn Smythe in 2017 when he scored 33 points in 26 playoff games to lead the Blue Jackets to their first Stanley Cup. He is the Blue Jackets all-time leader in goals , assists and points.

REGGIE LEACH

Leach was one of the few Flyers I liked as a young Leafs fan in the 1970s. In this sim he never left Boston and would win a Cup with the Bruins in 1974. He made his NHL debut in 71-72 as a 21 year old and scored once in 4 games before becoming a regular the following year. Leach would spend 8 full seasons with the Bruins with his best year being 1978-79 when he scored a career best 31 goals and 53 points. By age 30 his skills had eroded and he bounced around the minors for a couple of seasons but did play his final 8 NHL games with Buffalo.

In 684 career NHL games, Leach had 155 goals and 290 points.

RICK MACLEISH

He spent 9 seasons in Boston before ending his career with 2 years in Hartford. MacLeish broke in to the NHL in 1970-71 and would win a pair of Stanley Cups with the Bruins in 1972 and 1974. His best offensive season was a 30 goal, 66 point campaign in 1975-76. Hartford selected him in the expansion draft when the Whalers moved over from the NHL and he played his final 91 games with them.

Final totals are 694 games with 203 goals and 469 points.

ROD BRIND'AMOUR

Brind'Amour had a hall of fame career, appearing in 1711 games and scoring 577 goals while recording 1352 points. Those numbers rank him 39th all-time in goals (tied with Mats Sundin) and 48th in points.

Brind'Amour led the NHL in goals with 49 in 05-06, which was his final season in St Louis, a team he broke in with as an 18 year old in 1988-89. The 05-06 season also saw Brind'Amour and the Blues win their first Stanley Cup. He would be dealt to Los Angeles that off-season for Kenny Jonsson and Alexander Edler but after less than a full season he was sent to Nashville for Alex Radulov and would win a second straight Cup as helped the Predators win their first title. He would play 4 more seasons in Nashville before retiring at the age of 40.

KEITH PRIMEAU

Primeau spent his entire 14 year career with Detroit, scoring 214 times and notching 496 points in 1082 games. He was a depth player on a Detroit powerhouse and earned 8 Stanley Cup rings in his career. His 223 career playoff games rank 15th most all-time. Of course that list is dominated by Red Wings of that era.

JUSTIN WILLIAMS

Williams had an outstanding career in this sim, playing 1151 games while scoring 256 goals and 654 points. He spent nearly ten years with the Flyers before he was dealt to Montreal in a deadline deal in 09-10 that saw a young Jordan Staal go the other way. Williams would win a Cup with Montreal in 2013 before finishing out his career with a couple of seasons in St John's. He retired following the 2016-17 season at the age of 35.

JEFF CARTER

Played 1200 games for the Flyers and finished with 460 goals and 1089 points. Carter broke in as an 18 year in 2003-04 and would remain with Philadelphia until his retirement in 2021. Best year was 04-05 when he led the league in goals (45) and points (100). He did get over the century mark in points one other season in his career. He was third all-time in career goals as a Flyer behind Propp (519) and Giroux (468).

MIKE RICHARDS

Richard played 1044 NHL games, all but the last one of his career in a Flyers uniform. He didn't score a lot, getting just 134 goals and 340 points in his career. Started as an 18 year old with 3 points in 28 games in 03-04 and stayed with the Flyers organization until the released him in 18-19 at the age of 33. Pittsburgh signed him and he played 52 games in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton but also got called up for 1 game with the Pens. He retired at the end of that season.

PATRICK SHARP

Started his career as a 20 year with Philadelphia, playing 16 games in 01-02 but getting no goals and 5 assists. He moved to Toronto the following season and would remain with the Leafs for 14 seasons, playing 1003 total NHL games while scoring 280 goals and 690 points. He won a Stanley Cup with the Leafs in 2004. His best season was a 40 goal, 91 point campaign in 06-07 but he generally was a 25 goal-60 point player most seasons.

STEVE MASON

Mason was not much more than a career minor league, playing 549 games in the minors. He did spent 3 seasons with Columbus in his mid-twenties including 2012-13 when he played in a career high 43 games. He played 71 games total for the Blue Jackets and would not resurface in the NHL again until 2021-22 when he got 6 games with Vancouver and then 8 more the following season. In all, Mason played 85 NHL games and was 30-39-5 with a 2.99 GAA.

MARTIN ST LOUIS

Played 1253 NHL games with 3 teams, scoring 350 goals and 900 career points. He broke in with Calgary and played a decade for the Flames before being dealt to Montreal for the 08-09 season. His stay in Montreal was just one year before he was moved to Buffalo in a deal that sent Jordan Staal to the Habs (Staal would be moved to Philadelphia a short time later). Typically a 20 goal scorer, St Louis had a career year in 02-03 with the Flames when he was 38-57-95. He would win a Lady Byng Trophy and a Bill Masterton Award late in his career.

VINCENT LECAVALIER

Only Steven Stamkos had a better career with the Tampa Bay Lightning than Lecavalier. In 18 NHL seasons with the Bolts, Lecavalier scored 444 times and earned 1076 points in 1337 career games. He never won a Cup and only had one good playoff run, in 08-09 when he had 16 points in 15 games as the Lightning reached the conference finals.

He was on the cusp but deemed just not quite good enough for the Hall of Fame. His only recognition was being named a second team all-star twice in his career. Best season was 06-07 when he had 43 goals and 88 points, both career highs.


PAVEL BURE

The Russian Rocket played exactly 1000 NHL games, all with Vancouver. He scored 303 goals and 719 points in his career. There were no dominant seasons - best year was 36 goals in his second season - but Bure had 8 straight years of 20 goals or more.

WAYNE SIMMONDS

Spent his entire career in Los Angeles appearing in 664 games while scoring 125 times and earning 247 points. Injuries probably led to a premature end to his career as he was primarily a minor leaguer his final few seasons and retired at the age of 32. Best season was 2013-14 when he scored 25 goals and 47 points...the only year he surpassed the 20 goal mark.
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