Too many leagues? Too many non-committed owners? - Page 4

Fearbobafett · 01-31-2003, 02:05 PM

I started out with a lazy POS commish who was all Mr. Active during the first season and then just vanished. It did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but I loved the game so much I took about a month searching for a league that I thought looked great, had a lot of participation and extremly low turnover. I did this not only by looking into league's who advertised they had opennings (only a couple I even made inquiries on though) but but looking into some of the league's that never had positings but users with a lot of post or who said something out of the norm on thier league. I must have looked at over a 100 of em. I feel that I lucked out in getting into the USBA so quick, as they had expansion right after I was poking my nose around. I am also in the MBBA which just started out and although we had some high turnover in the early going, I think it is better to get the dead weight out of there ASAP. The league has only been up for about a month but the remainning owners have more post than the majority of most league's do.

The key at the start is for both sides to do thier homework up front.

satchel · 01-31-2003, 02:39 PM

The .400 Studios league database is a great resource, especially with the league finder that allows one to define what one is looking for, as far as financials, number of teams, etc. There should be a link to it at the top of this forum. But the information there is incomplete and inaccurate in many instances; I think lots of leagues submitted their info before they had actually started, for example several leagues in the database say that they use fiancials and actually don’t, and vice versa. This is what we need though.

crackpott · 01-31-2003, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Red Blow
Presentation and perception are important. Icons, screen names, grammar, even tone are all little things. The 'Net is anonymous. All anyone has to go on, initially, is what they see. Crackpott, I think, is a good example of someone that fights this. I've seen his website, I've perused the FBBL message board, I've even discussed things with him via IM. He's smart, creative and mature for his years. The Laura Prepon thing turns off some of the older, more stable crowd. Well, maybe not "turn off", but turns away. Some might not look past the icon. Others might check the link, but not look past the image of her on the main page. Those that do not dig are missing out on what appears to be a very solid, very well-run league.

The same may be true for the USBL. One look and you see Nirvana and South Park. Neither are bad in themselves, but remember who your client is. As has been pointed out, anyone trying to recruit needs a link to the website in their signature.

Reputation means a lot, but when you are new to the boards, you go on what you see.

Thanks for your comments. Actually, although not the point of Laura on the page, it is a nice side effect, as I don't WANT the owners who won't take the time to look into the league. If you're going to be that shallow and not research the league, odds are there are going to be other situations when time is required that you're not willing to put in. And although you think I fight it, I do in one sense, and embrace it in another. I make my league in a way so people who really look into it would find it interesting, but the casual lookers will be turned away. It tries to ensure actual loyalty to the league, and high activity. I have a hidden message in my rules that people need to find before I let them join to ensure they've read the rules... all this to weed out bad seeds.

On the flip side, grammar, punctuation, etc. DO play a part in my selection process. Even your AIM name can affect things. People who use random capitals and have names that are spelt incorrectly, whether on purpose or not, are usually, not always but usually, at a lower level of intellect than many others. Do I weigh everything on this? No, of course I talk to the person. But there are always trends. I have a thorough application that not only tells me a lot about the owners, but it's pretty long, and tells me how much effort people put in. You wouldn't believe how many incomplete applications I essentially disregard. Individuals without a lengthy bio is one thing I look at as bad, and another, although people don't realize it, is when I say "list teams in order of preference" they site "any." There aren't usually more than 2 or 3 available, and this says to me that they were too lazy to look into the teams to see which they would actually want. There are many subtle points in a simple application which can tell a commissioner a lot about you, so my advice is when applying, one should fill them out thoroughly.

Total Nirvana · 01-31-2003, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crackpott
Thanks for your comments. Actually, although not the point of Laura on the page, it is a nice side effect, as I don't WANT the owners who won't take the time to look into the league. If you're going to be that shallow and not research the league, odds are there are going to be other situations when time is required that you're not willing to put in. And although you think I fight it, I do in one sense, and embrace it in another. I make my league in a way so people who really look into it would find it interesting, but the casual lookers will be turned away. It tries to ensure actual loyalty to the league, and high activity. I have a hidden message in my rules that people need to find before I let them join to ensure they've read the rules... all this to weed out bad seeds. On the flip side, grammar, punctuation, etc. DO play a part in my selection process. Even your AIM name can affect things. People who use random capitals and have names that are spelt incorrectly, whether on purpose or not, are usually, not always but usually, at a lower level of intellect than many others. Do I weigh everything on this? No, of course I talk to the person. But there are always trends. I have a thorough application that not only tells me a lot about the owners, but it's pretty long, and tells me how much effort people put in. You wouldn't believe how many incomplete applications I essentially disregard. Individuals without a lengthy bio is one thing I look at as bad, and another, although people don't realize it, is when I say "list teams in order of preference" they site "any." There aren't usually more than 2 or 3 available, and this says to me that they were too lazy to look into the teams to see which they would actually want. There are many subtle points in a simple application which can tell a commissioner a lot about you, so my advice is when applying, one should fill them out thoroughly.

Reminds me of a situating that recently happend to the league

http://usbl.rickherrera.net/board/ik...=ST;f=11;t=304

Just a childish act by some loser

Kurtis R. · 01-31-2003, 04:13 PM

The problems with most leagues out there:

TOO MANY RULES!!
K - Keep
I - It
S - Simple
S - Stupid

Lots of rules turn me off... so I'm guessing it turns lots of other potential owners off.
-Guys just want to build their team... and see the results... they don't want a commish breathing down their neck on their every move.
-Guys don't want to be FORCED to post on the message board.. or forced to make trades
-Guys don't want to be forced to send in their lineups.

In CUBL.. I let the guys do what they want.. when they want... if they don't send in lineups today.. oh well.. who cares.

I do a role call TWO times a year.. at the all-star break.. and in the offseason.... and I let the owners decide if they want to stay or not. I ask them to step aside if they do not want to be active anymore... and.. owners will step down.. trust me.

CUBL has very little turnover... and when an owner does leave... there are 4-5 guys waiting to get in. I DO NOT look for owners in this or any other message board.. I let them come to me.

All it takes is for YOU the commish to send a league wide email to your owners saying "Team XXX is opening up... we need an owner... make sure when 'Buddy' sends in his application he says who sent him"... Your owners are your best advertisers/recruiters....

Kurtis

crackpott · 01-31-2003, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Total Nirvana
Reminds me of a situating that recently happend to the league

http://usbl.rickherrera.net/board/ik...=ST;f=11;t=304

Just a childish act by some loser

grade A entertainment.

crackpott · 01-31-2003, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kurtis R.
The problems with most leagues out there:

TOO MANY RULES!!
K - Keep
I - It
S - Simple
S - Stupid

Lots of rules turn me off... so I'm guessing it turns lots of other potential owners off.
-Guys just want to build their team... and see the results... they don't want a commish breathing down their neck on their every move.
-Guys don't want to be FORCED to post on the message board.. or forced to make trades
-Guys don't want to be forced to send in their lineups.

In CUBL.. I let the guys do what they want.. when they want... if they don't send in lineups today.. oh well.. who cares.

I do a role call TWO times a year.. at the all-star break.. and in the offseason.... and I let the owners decide if they want to stay or not. I ask them to step aside if they do not want to be active anymore... and.. owners will step down.. trust me.

CUBL has very little turnover... and when an owner does leave... there are 4-5 guys waiting to get in. I DO NOT look for owners in this or any other message board.. I let them come to me.

All it takes is for YOU the commish to send a league wide email to your owners saying "Team XXX is opening up... we need an owner... make sure when 'Buddy' sends in his application he says who sent him"... Your owners are your best advertisers/recruiters....

Kurtis

With all due respect, I hardly think the problem is too many rules. If you don't like many rules, that's your own opinion, but I don't believe it's why leagues fail. Some may like additional rules providing greater realism, and that's what I'm counting on for my league. It all depends on the type of owner. That being said, it may be true that leagues with fewer rules have less turnover, but it's specious reasoning to assume that the league is better because of it. There will inevitably be fewer owners leaving because they're not required to do as much, so they can stay on longer. In leagues full of rules, owners are required to do more work, so it's harder to find as many owners to fill the spots, but who is to say which is better? It's all a matter of preference.

Kurtis R. · 01-31-2003, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crackpott
There will inevitably be fewer owners leaving because they're not required to do as much, so they can stay on longer.....

....In leagues full of rules, owners are required to do more work, so it's harder to find as many owners to fill the spots....

but who is to say which is better? It's all a matter of preference.

I sim 4 games a day.... 5 times a week... and I get about 75% of lineups per DAY. Is that not doing much?

Harder to fill the spots because owners have to do more work?

If an owner LIKES a league.. they will do the "work"... CUBL owners have 5 sims a week.. and they send in lineups just about everyday.... AND send in articles... power rankings... etc.... it all has to do with "if they enjoy the league and care for their team".. it has NOTHING to do with work load.

Who's to say which is better... I didn't say which was better... I said that lots of leagues have too many rules.. and that turns me off and probably lots of other owners too

Kurtis

PineTar · 01-31-2003, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Michael Xavier

Personally, I think that Subby runs the best OOTP league, simply from the amount of work that goes into the FOBL. Those guys are hyper active, and it is a fun, perhaps perverse environment. Yet, that is whole other clique. Hell, I don't even know if they qualify as a clique, seeing that I can't remember seeing any of those owners in other leagues. Maybe that is why their league impresses me so much.

To give credit where credit is due, it is Simms who is Commisioner-for-Life in the FOBL. The league presidents (Mali & Duke) provide ongoing support by way of running our thrice weekly online live sims, processing trades, so on and so forth.... Subby exists solely to provide us with freshly blended margaritas and hot oil massages.

Little Known Fobble Fact™: Subby is actually a chat bot.

crackpott · 01-31-2003, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kurtis R.
I sim 4 games a day.... 5 times a week... and I get about 75% of lineups per DAY. Is that not doing much?

Harder to fill the spots because owners have to do more work?
If an owner LIKES a league.. they will do the "work"... CUBL owners have 5 sims a week.. and they send in lineups just about everyday.... AND send in articles... power rankings... etc.... it all has to do with "if they enjoy the league and care for their team".. it has NOTHING to do with work load.

Who's to say which is better... I didn't say which was better... I said that lots of leagues have too many rules.. and that turns me off and probably lots of other owners too

Kurtis

There are always exceptions to the rule. It sounds like you've got a league full of great owners. My point is that it's likely those would be great owners whether the league had many rules or not, and it's the mediocre owners who could survive in a laid back league that couldn't in a league with many rules.

satchel · 01-31-2003, 04:57 PM

It’s great to have a post like this which discusses the theories behind different types of leagues and what makes them more or less successful. This forum is routinely filled with the activity of leagues forming and changing, but rarely have I seen posts that deal with the issues behind the rise and fall of leagues.

I would be neat to have a checklist of things that a commissioner needs to do when starting a league. Most people who are motivated to start a league are already familiar with what it takes. But something as a guideline (for beginners and veterans) to help commissioners remember all the details. Then again we wouldn’t want a list that made it look too easy to start a league and tempt people into doing it frivolously.

Total Nirvana · 01-31-2003, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crackpott
grade A entertainment.

I knew it would please you

Total Nirvana · 01-31-2003, 06:05 PM

I just wanna say thanks for everyone who contributed to the post, and to what I had to say, and the responces. Even though I didnt start this thread (and to holyroller, I don't know how I steal threads, but i'll just play along) I think I have learned alot. I'm not saying that I'm going to change the league dramatically, But I will make some changes on how I act and react to such things, and some things I wanna do.

I have noticed many people who clicked the link about the whacko who wanted to start some ****, also browsed around the board a little bit, which is todally fine for me. If you did though, you would of ran into a thread I recently started on some ideas I have given to the league. If you havent seen, I'll just supply them for you on this. Fell free to give your comments on this. Here is the link to the site if you wanna look at it first hand

http://usbl.rickherrera.net/board/ik...=ST;f=11;t=315

Here are a few things that I have thought about for a while, but have not yet placed on paper. So here we go.

I am thinking about having "vultures" for the league. For anyone who doesnt know about this, these are people who not really a GM of the league, but just people who hang out on the board, talk, and join in discussions, in hope that when a GM spot opens up, they can fill in.

I am thinking about enforcing a salary cap for the league. This will help teams like Tennessee or Portland with some much needed players. I'm thinking about having the dollar amound reasonably low, around the 70 million dollar mark. It will also spread out the talent, and give more teams a better shot at least a division title.

Expansion. This was talked about earier in the season, and I think this is a good time to discuss about it once again. I have decided to put off any expansion for the time being, but I'm looking into setting an expansion date to the end of the 2004 season. I'm only looking into expanding one league, and to decide that, the winner of the 2003 all star game will be the league where the two expansion teams will join with.

Amateur League. It has been a thought in my head since the "new" XBL days, but I really never came to it. I am thinking about adding a college type of a league, where amateur players from all around the world would compete in low profiile cities (Bismark, Whitehorse, Akron for starters) in hopes to be a part of the USBL. What I have been thinking about is because ootp4 will not allow me to import players into a amatrue draft, to let them go straight into free agency.

Winter Ball. I have wrote up a format for what would happend. What I wanna do is that Teams will be able to submit one pitcher and one positional player to winter ball. They will be imported into the game, and will sim and have box scores, ect... If the players has good stats, not only their talent would increse, but there is a small chance that their ratings may change as well. We would have 4 teams, play them in the cold wilderness of Canada, and let them freeze to death

Divisions. I talked to a commissioner of another league that runs a simular 20 team league, but has 3 divisions in both of the leagues. I'm thinking about doing the same.

note- this was copy - pasted directly from the message board. To further know about whats going on, here you go.

usbl.rickherrera.net

(p.s. the person who hosts the server, Rick Herrera has vanished without a trace, and i'm getting kinda worried. If you have some extra space to hosts one more league, send me a PM or e-mail me

BaseballFan · 01-31-2003, 06:21 PM

Well, as I am relatively new to the OOTP online message boards, I have first Impressions of everyone. My firs impression of you was actually a good one, you seemed like you knew you stuff, and a good person overall. This thread only solidifies my impression on you as I can see now that you are not only knowledgeable, but a very dedicated commish. If you ever allow vultures in your league, I would be there ASAP, as this league has most thing that I look for in a league(a dedicated commish, good league structure and simple enough rules to follow). About the spelling thing, not everyone has direct and immediate access to a spell checker, and just posts what they need to post right away. Also, many people just aren't natural spellers, and I myself fall into that category, so it doesnt necessarily turn me away.

All in all, it looks like you run a great league, and I will definitely be watching it in the future. By the way, please don't flame me for spelling, as none of us are perfect.

Total Nirvana · 01-31-2003, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BaseballFan
If you ever allow vultures in your league, I would be there ASAP, as this league has most thing that I look for in a league(a dedicated commish, good league structure and simple enough rules to follow).

Your the first to tell me that

Actually, if you wanna become a vulture, go ahead and knock yourself out

Aussie Mark · 01-31-2003, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BaseballFan
About the spelling thing, not everyone has direct and immediate access to a spell checker

True, access to my spell checker is relatively slow first thing in the morning, but it speeds up a little once I've had a shower and some breakfast.

wireman · 01-31-2003, 06:56 PM

Best wishes to you and your league, T.N. You've made a pretty decent impression on me, too.

I'll handle the spelling

kq76 · 02-01-2003, 04:46 AM

Some comments on impressions:

1) Incorrect Spelling (or Grammar) - Call me anal, but it annoys me immensely. Not only does it bother me that I have to take extra time to try to decipher the post, but it leads me to believe a number of negative things about the poster, be they true or not. If someone misspells the odd word or netspells (e.g. ppl, tho, abbreviations like that), I have no problem with that. I probably won't even notice it, and like someone said, everyone does it, including me. However, when someone misspells every tenth word or so, that is showing me that either they haven't gone past grade 7 and won't intellectually stimulate me, or they don't care much about how long I must take to read their post, so why should I do them the service of reading and replying?

2) Nicks - For the most part I could care less. Some offend me, like ones that seem to praise hate or violence, but those are rare. (Nirvana btw, was the first band that really got me into music and I still think they were amazing. I do wonder the age and knowledge of those who advertise Nirvana, but it takes time to know how genuine a person really is.)

3) Avatars - Some I find annoying like cartoons of questionable taste and models or scantilly clad women. Again, it leads me to believe or at least question things about the person, but I know I shouldn't prejudge and I try to keep that in mind. But hey, I'm anal and I know that.

4) Extensive Rules/TOS - Turns me off big time at first, but once I'm in the community, I love them (even though I might fight tooth and nail to change them).

5) Trying to get participation - You need to market and sell your league and by the looks of it, very few commissioners do a decent job of that. You certainly don't want to come off as begging people to join or otherwise make it look like no one else wants your product, so why should they.

Someone made a great point earlier, the best sellers of your league are probably other participants (owners, vultures, whoever). They already participate and if they are expending their energy praising your product (again, without coming off as begging others to join), then that's probably a good league to join. But to get owners to praise the league, you need to make it better for them. Don't know how to make your league better? Periodically ask for feedback.

Website appearance, though I'm loathe to say it, is very important too. If your website doesn't look very professional then that naturally leads people to believe that other characteristics of your league are not very professional either. I understand that this is prejudging, but I (and I'm sure most people) consider their time very valuable and that there are an infinite number of ways in which I can spend my finite time. So if something does not look promising to start off with, it's like a woman, she's most likely not worth your time, jump ship and move on to better prospects.

Actually, this precious value of time can be applied to appearance of everything, your nick, your avatar, what you say and how you say it in your posts, your league website, everything. And if you don't want to accept that you have to have a good appearance (ootp or whatever) to be successful, well then I bet you that you won't be as successful as you want to be (kudos to you if you are though). But that's just life.

P.S. I recently joined Cooley's start-up UBL and the things that sold me on it were: 1) the uniqueness of merging mlb, the negro leagues and pcl, 2) the response from others / Cooley's reputation, 3) the appearance of Cooley's other leagues, and 4) Cooley's appearance. The only other league I had really been interested in was the CBL, but I'm Canadian and it seemed to be the best Canadian league and it was always full when I looked.

bigphesta · 02-01-2003, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Total Nirvana
I wanna try to be honest for a minute.

What do people think of me as a commissioner. I don't wanna get personal, I just want to see what others think of me. I will not get offended, I would rather learn, and improve from there, then to not know, and feel misrable about myself. It would be awesome if I can get some USBL members that post here to comment as well.

You Suck. Your League Sucks. Only thing good there is the very cool Atlanta GM, other than that, it sucks.

bigphesta · 02-01-2003, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by darkhorse
So true, a proper avatar commands, nay compels, respect from your peers.

Hmmm, I don't mind you but can't stand your avitar. Maybe if you switched to someone with talent, you'd be my hero!

01-31-2003, 02:05 PM	#61
Fearbobafett Minors (Single A) Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Lake in the hills Il Posts: 74	I started out with a lazy POS commish who was all Mr. Active during the first season and then just vanished. It did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but I loved the game so much I took about a month searching for a league that I thought looked great, had a lot of participation and extremly low turnover. I did this not only by looking into league's who advertised they had opennings (only a couple I even made inquiries on though) but but looking into some of the league's that never had positings but users with a lot of post or who said something out of the norm on thier league. I must have looked at over a 100 of em. I feel that I lucked out in getting into the USBA so quick, as they had expansion right after I was poking my nose around. I am also in the MBBA which just started out and although we had some high turnover in the early going, I think it is better to get the dead weight out of there ASAP. The league has only been up for about a month but the remainning owners have more post than the majority of most league's do. The key at the start is for both sides to do thier homework up front. __________________ BBTF Home - Philadelphia Phillies 1902-1927 Chicago Cubs 1928-Present

01-31-2003, 02:39 PM	#62
satchel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Ft Smith AR Posts: 2,681	Reference The .400 Studios league database is a great resource, especially with the league finder that allows one to define what one is looking for, as far as financials, number of teams, etc. There should be a link to it at the top of this forum. But the information there is incomplete and inaccurate in many instances; I think lots of leagues submitted their info before they had actually started, for example several leagues in the database say that they use fiancials and actually don’t, and vice versa. This is what we need though. __________________ JL Commish NPBL Rhode Island Reds ’33 ’34 ’35 TCBA San Francisco Railbornes ’74 ’76 ’77 ’78 FL New Orleans Black Sox ’56 ’57 ’58 ’59

01-31-2003, 04:13 PM	#65
Kurtis R. All Star Starter Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,105	The problems with most leagues out there: TOO MANY RULES!! K - Keep I - It S - Simple S - Stupid Lots of rules turn me off... so I'm guessing it turns lots of other potential owners off. -Guys just want to build their team... and see the results... they don't want a commish breathing down their neck on their every move. -Guys don't want to be FORCED to post on the message board.. or forced to make trades -Guys don't want to be forced to send in their lineups. In CUBL.. I let the guys do what they want.. when they want... if they don't send in lineups today.. oh well.. who cares. I do a role call TWO times a year.. at the all-star break.. and in the offseason.... and I let the owners decide if they want to stay or not. I ask them to step aside if they do not want to be active anymore... and.. owners will step down.. trust me. CUBL has very little turnover... and when an owner does leave... there are 4-5 guys waiting to get in. I DO NOT look for owners in this or any other message board.. I let them come to me. All it takes is for YOU the commish to send a league wide email to your owners saying "Team XXX is opening up... we need an owner... make sure when 'Buddy' sends in his application he says who sent him"... Your owners are your best advertisers/recruiters.... Kurtis __________________ CUBL Commissioner

01-31-2003, 04:57 PM	#71
satchel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Ft Smith AR Posts: 2,681	post It’s great to have a post like this which discusses the theories behind different types of leagues and what makes them more or less successful. This forum is routinely filled with the activity of leagues forming and changing, but rarely have I seen posts that deal with the issues behind the rise and fall of leagues. I would be neat to have a checklist of things that a commissioner needs to do when starting a league. Most people who are motivated to start a league are already familiar with what it takes. But something as a guideline (for beginners and veterans) to help commissioners remember all the details. Then again we wouldn’t want a list that made it look too easy to start a league and tempt people into doing it frivolously. __________________ JL Commish NPBL Rhode Island Reds ’33 ’34 ’35 TCBA San Francisco Railbornes ’74 ’76 ’77 ’78 FL New Orleans Black Sox ’56 ’57 ’58 ’59

01-31-2003, 06:05 PM	#73
Total Nirvana All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Diego, California Posts: 750	I just wanna say thanks for everyone who contributed to the post, and to what I had to say, and the responces. Even though I didnt start this thread (and to holyroller, I don't know how I steal threads, but i'll just play along) I think I have learned alot. I'm not saying that I'm going to change the league dramatically, But I will make some changes on how I act and react to such things, and some things I wanna do. I have noticed many people who clicked the link about the whacko who wanted to start some ***, also browsed around the board a little bit, which is todally fine for me. If you did though, you would of ran into a thread I recently started on some ideas I have given to the league. If you havent seen, I'll just supply them for you on this. Fell free to give your comments on this. Here is the link to the site if you wanna look at it first hand http://usbl.rickherrera.net/board/ik...=ST;f=11;t=315 Here are a few things that I have thought about for a while, but have not yet placed on paper. So here we go. I am thinking about having "vultures" for the league. For anyone who doesnt know about this, these are people who not really a GM of the league, but just people who hang out on the board, talk, and join in discussions, in hope that when a GM spot opens up, they can fill in. I am thinking about enforcing a salary cap for the league. This will help teams like Tennessee or Portland with some much needed players. I'm thinking about having the dollar amound reasonably low, around the 70 million dollar mark. It will also spread out the talent, and give more teams a better shot at least a division title. Expansion. This was talked about earier in the season, and I think this is a good time to discuss about it once again. I have decided to put off any expansion for the time being, but I'm looking into setting an expansion date to the end of the 2004 season. I'm only looking into expanding one league, and to decide that, the winner of the 2003 all star game will be the league where the two expansion teams will join with. Amateur League. It has been a thought in my head since the "new" XBL days, but I really never came to it. I am thinking about adding a college type of a league, where amateur players from all around the world would compete in low profiile cities (Bismark, Whitehorse, Akron for starters) in hopes to be a part of the USBL. What I have been thinking about is because ootp4 will not allow me to import players into a amatrue draft, to let them go straight into free agency. Winter Ball. I have wrote up a format for what would happend. What I wanna do is that Teams will be able to submit one pitcher and one positional player to winter ball. They will be imported into the game, and will sim and have box scores, ect... If the players has good stats, not only their talent would increse, but there is a small chance that their ratings may change as well. We would have 4 teams, play them in the cold wilderness of Canada, and let them freeze to death Divisions. I talked to a commissioner of another league that runs a simular 20 team league, but has 3 divisions in both of the leagues. I'm thinking about doing the same. note- this was copy - pasted directly from the message board. To further know about whats going on, here you go. usbl.rickherrera.net (p.s. the person who hosts the server, Rick Herrera has vanished without a trace, and i'm getting kinda worried. If you have some extra space to hosts one more league, send me a PM or e-mail me __________________ Total Hockey Commissioner Your Off-Topic Nightmare. Free Agent OT Player - Plays 1B/3B/OF, hits for power on all fields, great fielder, can hit .330 a season! Last edited by Total Nirvana; 01-31-2003 at 06:12 PM.*

01-31-2003, 06:21 PM	#74
BaseballFan Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 53	Well, as I am relatively new to the OOTP online message boards, I have first Impressions of everyone. My firs impression of you was actually a good one, you seemed like you knew you stuff, and a good person overall. This thread only solidifies my impression on you as I can see now that you are not only knowledgeable, but a very dedicated commish. If you ever allow vultures in your league, I would be there ASAP, as this league has most thing that I look for in a league(a dedicated commish, good league structure and simple enough rules to follow). About the spelling thing, not everyone has direct and immediate access to a spell checker, and just posts what they need to post right away. Also, many people just aren't natural spellers, and I myself fall into that category, so it doesnt necessarily turn me away. All in all, it looks like you run a great league, and I will definitely be watching it in the future. By the way, please don't flame me for spelling, as none of us are perfect.

01-31-2003, 06:56 PM	#77
wireman All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Harrisonburg VA Posts: 765	Best wishes to you and your league, T.N. You've made a pretty decent impression on me, too. I'll handle the spelling __________________ "Sometimes the magic works and sometimes it doesn't."

02-01-2003, 04:46 AM	#78
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 10,697	Some comments on impressions: 1) Incorrect Spelling (or Grammar) - Call me anal, but it annoys me immensely. Not only does it bother me that I have to take extra time to try to decipher the post, but it leads me to believe a number of negative things about the poster, be they true or not. If someone misspells the odd word or netspells (e.g. ppl, tho, abbreviations like that), I have no problem with that. I probably won't even notice it, and like someone said, everyone does it, including me. However, when someone misspells every tenth word or so, that is showing me that either they haven't gone past grade 7 and won't intellectually stimulate me, or they don't care much about how long I must take to read their post, so why should I do them the service of reading and replying? 2) Nicks - For the most part I could care less. Some offend me, like ones that seem to praise hate or violence, but those are rare. (Nirvana btw, was the first band that really got me into music and I still think they were amazing. I do wonder the age and knowledge of those who advertise Nirvana, but it takes time to know how genuine a person really is.) 3) Avatars - Some I find annoying like cartoons of questionable taste and models or scantilly clad women. Again, it leads me to believe or at least question things about the person, but I know I shouldn't prejudge and I try to keep that in mind. But hey, I'm anal and I know that. 4) Extensive Rules/TOS - Turns me off big time at first, but once I'm in the community, I love them (even though I might fight tooth and nail to change them). 5) Trying to get participation - You need to market and sell your league and by the looks of it, very few commissioners do a decent job of that. You certainly don't want to come off as begging people to join or otherwise make it look like no one else wants your product, so why should they. Someone made a great point earlier, the best sellers of your league are probably other participants (owners, vultures, whoever). They already participate and if they are expending their energy praising your product (again, without coming off as begging others to join), then that's probably a good league to join. But to get owners to praise the league, you need to make it better for them. Don't know how to make your league better? Periodically ask for feedback. Website appearance, though I'm loathe to say it, is very important too. If your website doesn't look very professional then that naturally leads people to believe that other characteristics of your league are not very professional either. I understand that this is prejudging, but I (and I'm sure most people) consider their time very valuable and that there are an infinite number of ways in which I can spend my finite time. So if something does not look promising to start off with, it's like a woman, she's most likely not worth your time, jump ship and move on to better prospects. Actually, this precious value of time can be applied to appearance of everything, your nick, your avatar, what you say and how you say it in your posts, your league website, everything. And if you don't want to accept that you have to have a good appearance (ootp or whatever) to be successful, well then I bet you that you won't be as successful as you want to be (kudos to you if you are though). But that's just life. P.S. I recently joined Cooley's start-up UBL and the things that sold me on it were: 1) the uniqueness of merging mlb, the negro leagues and pcl, 2) the response from others / Cooley's reputation, 3) the appearance of Cooley's other leagues, and 4) Cooley's appearance. The only other league I had really been interested in was the CBL, but I'm Canadian and it seemed to be the best Canadian league and it was always full when I looked. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project)