Commissioners also running teams - your thoughts - Page 5

CommishJoe · 02-21-2003, 07:55 AM

That's why my league has 3 commishes and 2 league presidents. Any decision that might seem bias, or is important, gets put to vote. This way, we don't have to worry about cheating concerns.

As for simming, 3 of us handle simming duties (with 1 regular), so it would be fairly obvious if he was cheating. Also, if a commish is in the post-season, a different commish sims it.

BIG FAT LIAR · 02-21-2003, 09:44 AM

In the league I run, I cheat.

I make no secret of this, everyone knows I do, and I boast about it.

This helps keep things above board and nips any misunderstandings in the bud.

I win the championship most years, but occasionally I throw one to keep people interested.

I think it's best if the commissioner cheats and lets his people know. We have happy, but stupid, owners due to this fair policy of mine.

We have 24 owners in the league and I once suggested that I stop cheating in a poll. I was outvoted 72-4. The general feeling was that there would be too much suspicion if I didn't cheat. And as the Great Elvis once sang, "We can't get along together with suspicious minds". (Sometimes it helps to refer to Elvis for the truth).

As for not having the commissioner run a team, I would be very nervous about that. Why? The only people who would want to run a league and not have a team may be control freaks on a power trip. They may think they are superior to others because they don't "need" to have a team. That is my viewpoint. Then again, maybe not.

Driver 8 · 02-21-2003, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BIG FAT LIAR
As for not having the commissioner run a team, I would be very nervous about that. Why? The only people who would want to run a league and not have a team may be control freaks on a power trip. They may think they are superior to others because they don't "need" to have a team. That is my viewpoint. Then again, maybe not.

Hahaha, wow, you really think that, eh? It's funny, there was a post somewhere on the board recently in which the quesiton was raised; "What draws you to baseball?" (or something along those lines). As at least one person in that thread mentioned, it's all about the statistics. For me, that statistics and history behind a league is what I love most about baseball, followed closely by the thought processes that are involved on every level...From between the lines, to in the dugout, to upstairs in the front office.

Now, as far as your ignorant (and this adjective goes to describe the comment, not person commenting), blanket statement goes, I don't know how you could pretend to know the motivating factor for any commissioner you've never met, much less speak for every single of one of them, in one breath. I have run the TSTBL for a mere 6 months, but we are entering our 5th season as I type this. We had some turnover in the first season, season-and-a-half, but that's almost expected in a new league. Since then, we've had less than a handful of new owners during the past 3 seasons. I don't control anyone in the league I run, engage in powertrips, nor do I feel superior to anyone. As a matter of fact, we sim live three times a week, and it's a rare occasion that I don't ask my owners their opinion on league matters. The majority of my owners have consistently proven their knowledge of the game, and I would be remiss to consider myself smarter, wiser or superior to them. The others, well I haven't had exetensive dialogue with them, but I am more willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. We have smart, active owners who wouldn't spend 6+ months and 4+ seasons in this league if I were some heavy-handed control freak. I can't speak for them, but I would imagine that some of my owner's would take offense to the stereolization that they are being controlled by some puppetmaster.

In the week-and-a-half since we completed our last season, I have (and this is not an exaggeration) spent, on average, 10 hours a day working on this league; writing stories, updating team histories, and most of all updating the custom "record book" that the league employs (this requires scanning every box score several times). You may ask why I spend so much time on a league that I don't own a team in...I know my girlfriend must wonder the same thing as well. It all boils down to the fact that I love the statistics and history that our league is generating. In the spirit of full disclosure, I did own a team in this league. But when I started this league, I had more interest than teams, so I decided to give up my team well before the first game was simmed. Halfway through the first season I realized that the gratification I received from competing in other leagues was sufficient for me to concentrate solely on running the TSTBL, which I don't regret for a second. An argument has been offered that a commissioner that doesn't run a team would have less interest in the league, or at least a pattern of waning interest in their league. For some yes, that could be a true statement. For me, every season I find myself spending more time than the year before in this endeavor.

I don't run an elite league (and trust me, I firmly believe 99% of the high-profile leagues you see mentioned here with regular frequency are worthy of the praise they get internally and externally), but I do think that our league is among the best that most people haven't heard of, which is cool with me. I have no problem with people expressing their opinion, but when blanket statements are made regarding commissioners who don't compete in their leagues, or more importantly, the quality of those leagues, I have to take issue with that.

BIG FAT LIAR · 02-21-2003, 11:06 AM

But imagine if you used turned your efforts and time spent on your league towards world peace or some such thing, what a happier place this would be.

Driver 8 · 02-21-2003, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BIG FAT LIAR
But imagine if you used turned your efforts and time spent on your league towards world peace or some such thing, what a happier place this would be.

That's fine, deflect the real issue with sarcasm. I'll be sure to let you know the league-vote on world peace after the All-Star break.

treedom · 02-21-2003, 12:35 PM

lol...i agree with you driver...but considering the context of big fat liar's post (an his nick) i'd have to suspect he's just having a bit of fun, and isn't serious...

i don't know who he is, but i'm pretty sure it's one of the regulars under a pseudonym

Old Man · 02-21-2003, 12:47 PM

I believe I know who it is, but I did not think he was fat. Portly maybe.

treedom · 02-21-2003, 12:55 PM

actually..now that i think of it, i think i have it narrowed down to 19 people, with a strong lincoln...err...leaning towards one particular guy...

fhomess · 02-21-2003, 01:02 PM

Anyone who calls himself a BIG FAT LIAR is obviously not to be trusted. He MUST be telling the truth with all seriousness!

Driver 8 · 02-21-2003, 01:02 PM

Ahhhh, Nevermind [/Emily Litella]

Michael Xavier · 02-22-2003, 04:09 AM

Big Fat Liar is a real commish. I used to be in one of his leagues, and I had a blast. He controlled seven teams, which I thought was fair, because if you're going to put that much effort into a league, with the donation of time, etc., then I don't have a major problem with a commish owning seven teams.

MannyTrillo · 02-22-2003, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BIG FAT LIAR
In the league I run, I cheat.

I make no secret of this, everyone knows I do, and I boast about it.

This helps keep things above board and nips any misunderstandings in the bud.

I win the championship most years, but occasionally I throw one to keep people interested.

I think it's best if the commissioner cheats and lets his people know. We have happy, but stupid, owners due to this fair policy of mine.

I would like to join. I am interested in a pretty good team that has a few very good players, if available, so that I can all trade the good players away in stupid deals within a week, completely ruining the organization. Then I will totally ignore the league until you kick me out, at which point I will become angry and flame you. I'm sure you have encountered this type of owner before, but trust me- I am the best there is at it.

bigphesta · 02-22-2003, 04:42 AM

Yes, Manny, that is my FAVORITE type of owner. As much as you try and screen, there's always one who slips in every 5 seasons or so. Almost as good as the owner with the .350 team who tells everyone "I'm winning this season, we're going to the series, Player X is going to win the MVP, Cy Young, and RoY all in the same season" (not realizing that the MVP and Cy Young can't go to the same person).

bigphesta · 02-22-2003, 04:44 AM

What I want to do is start a league where I run every team but one and then have that team be ran by someone who doesn't know I'm running all the other teams then mess with the guy's head. See how long it takes him to figure it out. Boy, that'd be fun.

Michael Xavier · 02-22-2003, 04:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MannyTrillo
I would like to join. I am interested in a pretty good team that has a few very good players, if available, so that I can all trade the good players away in stupid deals within a week, completely ruining the organization. Then I will totally ignore the league until you kick me out, at which point I will become angry and flame you. I'm sure you have encountered this type of owner before, but trust me- I am the best there is at it.

Hey! There is nothing wrong with running your team in this fashion. I do it in every league I'm in, and I rarely complain about my lot in life.

ramincol · 02-22-2003, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DiversionX
Wow, someone who agrees with me?!?!?! If you find a league out there (other than my pathetic mogul league) that has a team-less commissioner, let me know!!

Hey X
Well I know the CDML league is ran by a commish that does not own a team in the league. The league is full at this time I believe, but the commish runs a good league and does not have a team if thats the type that you prefer.

http://www.sportplanet.com/sbb/iba/mexican.htm

I guess I have been lucky that the leagues that I have been in have had great commish's. IMO it takes a lot of work to be a commish and I am sure that they take pride in the league that they run. And running a team is a benifit for running the league IMO. Do they have a advantage over the owners since they are the ones that sim the leagues as you have stated. Maybe, but every owner has the choice to either look at his team or others if he chooses. The question you have to ask your self is why would someone go thru the trouble of running a great league then to have everything go to crap cause he cheats. I do know that some commishes cheat just like some owners feel like they have to cheat to get ahead of the game. But those are not the top leagues and will not remain open for long. Its a risk but most of the time you will be rewarded with good leagues. As with anything in life you can look for the negative in things or you can accept them for what they are.

But good luck

Michael Xavier · 02-22-2003, 06:44 AM

The So'49 is ran by an excellent commish, and he doesn't own any of the teams that participate.

I am not against a commissioner being an owner, but I've been in two leagues where the commish cheated, so I am a bit wary, like I think a few others are. Luckily, my current commishes that also own teams seem very high-class.

Ragin Cajun · 02-23-2003, 07:02 PM

I am a commissioner and a team owner...but it wasn't always that way. In our first season, we went through 2 commissioners. They did not own teams (theres a vote that non-owning commishes lose interest). The league presidents who started the league (and owned teams) scouted around for another commish that would not own a team... AND COULD NOT FIND ONE. I had a team that had a great nucleus plus this was my first league that I had ever joined. I volunteered for the job and was given it. That was 7 seasons ago. The question has come up...from new guys that joined the league or looked at the league; but never from guys within the league.

Is there reason to think I could cheat...sure.
Do they think I cheat?...No

I don't expect everyone to trust me when they join my league; but I have a good reputation in the OOTP community and I've worked hard for that. I will not risk it to win a championship in my league. Proof?

Division Titles: 7 straight...many of those decided in the final week of play.
NL Pennants: 1 (that means SIX losses)
World Series Wins: NONE

Strange that a commish run team could win 7 straight divisions? I must cheat right? Well, Colorado (in my league) isn't the commish...just a darn good owner. 7 straight division titles, 6 World Series appearance and 2 titles...plus a stellar 6-1 record against me in the postseason. Don't bet that I'd ever cheat to HELP him win.

What about Texas and Oakland. Also not run by league officers. They only won 100+ games every year of the leagues existence (until last season...but we also had owner changes for those clubs).

What about Cleveland (AL President by the way). 6 straight pennants until Detroit upended him last year. But the AL Central has been real weak until recently as rebuilding plans are finally coming around and we've put some solid owners in there.

Anyway, I don't cheat because (a) I don't have time...I run most of my sims live. I get the joking that all commissioner's must get but that's part of the gig and (b) I don't abide by cheaters. I've never (luckily) run into any of the problems that the original poster mentioned but I'm sure they do exist. What are the odds though? As good as getting struck by lightning?

I understand the concern...but find yourself a reputable league with well respected leaders. Then give it a shot...the worst that can happen is you will quit. The best is you may find a league you hope goes forever.

OCBLcommish · 02-23-2003, 08:27 PM

I currently run and commish the Oil Can Boyd League and do not run a team. I basically did this to be involved in a league with rules the way I like them and with the most up to date rosters out there (at the time it was established anyways).

It's very time consuming to run a league (plus maintain my activity in BMN) without having a team in it. Least with my work schedule anyways. However, I do miss running "my team" daily and all that. To be honest, I spent much of yesterday muttering to myself about handing the title of commish over to someone else. However, that's a bad thing (in my opinion) for a league to go through (assuming its not a cheating commish or just a god awful one) so I'm extremely hesitant to even consider the idea.

I have an excellent group of owners in my league and would hate to let them down like that. Quite simply, commishing without a team isn't as fun or rewarding as running a team in a good league. In my opinion.

Ragin Cajun · 02-23-2003, 08:31 PM

I fully agree...I can almost guarantee that I wouldn't have tied up almost 2 years of my (real) life in a league if I didn't own a team.

02-21-2003, 07:55 AM	#81
CommishJoe Global Moderator Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 5,238	That's why my league has 3 commishes and 2 league presidents. Any decision that might seem bias, or is important, gets put to vote. This way, we don't have to worry about cheating concerns. As for simming, 3 of us handle simming duties (with 1 regular), so it would be fairly obvious if he was cheating. Also, if a commish is in the post-season, a different commish sims it. __________________ Joe Success isn’t owned. It’s leased. And rent is due every day.

02-21-2003, 12:35 PM	#86
treedom Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Transylvania Posts: 2,900	lol...i agree with you driver...but considering the context of big fat liar's post (an his nick) i'd have to suspect he's just having a bit of fun, and isn't serious... i don't know who he is, but i'm pretty sure it's one of the regulars under a pseudonym __________________ A rake and a roustabout.

02-21-2003, 12:47 PM	#87
Old Man Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 464	I believe I know who it is, but I did not think he was fat. Portly maybe. __________________ Baseball statistics are like a girl in a bikini. They show a lot, but not everything. ~Toby Harrah, 1983 "All the fat guys watch me and say to their wives, 'See, there's a fat guy doing okay. Bring me another beer.'" -Mickey Lolich

02-21-2003, 12:55 PM	#88
treedom Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Transylvania Posts: 2,900	actually..now that i think of it, i think i have it narrowed down to 19 people, with a strong lincoln...err...leaning towards one particular guy... __________________ A rake and a roustabout.

02-21-2003, 01:02 PM	#89
fhomess Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 3,585	Anyone who calls himself a BIG FAT LIAR is obviously not to be trusted. He MUST be telling the truth with all seriousness! __________________ StatsLab- PHP/MySQL based utilities for Online Leagues Baseball Cards - Full list of known templates and documentation on card development.

02-21-2003, 09:44 AM	#82
BIG FAT LIAR Bat Boy Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 14	In the league I run, I cheat. I make no secret of this, everyone knows I do, and I boast about it. This helps keep things above board and nips any misunderstandings in the bud. I win the championship most years, but occasionally I throw one to keep people interested. I think it's best if the commissioner cheats and lets his people know. We have happy, but stupid, owners due to this fair policy of mine. We have 24 owners in the league and I once suggested that I stop cheating in a poll. I was outvoted 72-4. The general feeling was that there would be too much suspicion if I didn't cheat. And as the Great Elvis once sang, "We can't get along together with suspicious minds". (Sometimes it helps to refer to Elvis for the truth). As for not having the commissioner run a team, I would be very nervous about that. Why? The only people who would want to run a league and not have a team may be control freaks on a power trip. They may think they are superior to others because they don't "need" to have a team. That is my viewpoint. Then again, maybe not.

02-21-2003, 11:06 AM	#84
BIG FAT LIAR Bat Boy Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 14	But imagine if you used turned your efforts and time spent on your league towards world peace or some such thing, what a happier place this would be.

02-21-2003, 01:02 PM	#90
Driver 8 Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: gurnee, il Posts: 397	Ahhhh, Nevermind [/Emily Litella]

02-22-2003, 04:09 AM	#91
Michael Xavier Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Evansville, IN Posts: 454	Big Fat Liar is a real commish. I used to be in one of his leagues, and I had a blast. He controlled seven teams, which I thought was fair, because if you're going to put that much effort into a league, with the donation of time, etc., then I don't have a major problem with a commish owning seven teams.

02-22-2003, 04:42 AM	#93
bigphesta Banned Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 1,366	Yes, Manny, that is my FAVORITE type of owner. As much as you try and screen, there's always one who slips in every 5 seasons or so. Almost as good as the owner with the .350 team who tells everyone "I'm winning this season, we're going to the series, Player X is going to win the MVP, Cy Young, and RoY all in the same season" (not realizing that the MVP and Cy Young can't go to the same person).

02-22-2003, 04:44 AM	#94
bigphesta Banned Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 1,366	What I want to do is start a league where I run every team but one and then have that team be ran by someone who doesn't know I'm running all the other teams then mess with the guy's head. See how long it takes him to figure it out. Boy, that'd be fun.

02-22-2003, 06:44 AM	#97
Michael Xavier Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Evansville, IN Posts: 454	The So'49 is ran by an excellent commish, and he doesn't own any of the teams that participate. I am not against a commissioner being an owner, but I've been in two leagues where the commish cheated, so I am a bit wary, like I think a few others are. Luckily, my current commishes that also own teams seem very high-class.

02-23-2003, 07:02 PM	#98
Ragin Cajun All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Atascosita, TX Posts: 1,173	I am a commissioner and a team owner...but it wasn't always that way. In our first season, we went through 2 commissioners. They did not own teams (theres a vote that non-owning commishes lose interest). The league presidents who started the league (and owned teams) scouted around for another commish that would not own a team... AND COULD NOT FIND ONE. I had a team that had a great nucleus plus this was my first league that I had ever joined. I volunteered for the job and was given it. That was 7 seasons ago. The question has come up...from new guys that joined the league or looked at the league; but never from guys within the league. Is there reason to think I could cheat...sure. Do they think I cheat?...No I don't expect everyone to trust me when they join my league; but I have a good reputation in the OOTP community and I've worked hard for that. I will not risk it to win a championship in my league. Proof? Division Titles: 7 straight...many of those decided in the final week of play. NL Pennants: 1 (that means SIX losses) World Series Wins: NONE Strange that a commish run team could win 7 straight divisions? I must cheat right? Well, Colorado (in my league) isn't the commish...just a darn good owner. 7 straight division titles, 6 World Series appearance and 2 titles...plus a stellar 6-1 record against me in the postseason. Don't bet that I'd ever cheat to HELP him win. What about Texas and Oakland. Also not run by league officers. They only won 100+ games every year of the leagues existence (until last season...but we also had owner changes for those clubs). What about Cleveland (AL President by the way). 6 straight pennants until Detroit upended him last year. But the AL Central has been real weak until recently as rebuilding plans are finally coming around and we've put some solid owners in there. Anyway, I don't cheat because (a) I don't have time...I run most of my sims live. I get the joking that all commissioner's must get but that's part of the gig and (b) I don't abide by cheaters. I've never (luckily) run into any of the problems that the original poster mentioned but I'm sure they do exist. What are the odds though? As good as getting struck by lightning? I understand the concern...but find yourself a reputable league with well respected leaders. Then give it a shot...the worst that can happen is you will quit. The best is you may find a league you hope goes forever. __________________ Former NBSL Commissioner: 16 years Former Online League Owner; six time champion

02-23-2003, 08:27 PM	#99
OCBLcommish Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 193	I currently run and commish the Oil Can Boyd League and do not run a team. I basically did this to be involved in a league with rules the way I like them and with the most up to date rosters out there (at the time it was established anyways). It's very time consuming to run a league (plus maintain my activity in BMN) without having a team in it. Least with my work schedule anyways. However, I do miss running "my team" daily and all that. To be honest, I spent much of yesterday muttering to myself about handing the title of commish over to someone else. However, that's a bad thing (in my opinion) for a league to go through (assuming its not a cheating commish or just a god awful one) so I'm extremely hesitant to even consider the idea. I have an excellent group of owners in my league and would hate to let them down like that. Quite simply, commishing without a team isn't as fun or rewarding as running a team in a good league. In my opinion. __________________ EBM - Boston Red Sox

02-23-2003, 08:31 PM	#100
Ragin Cajun All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Atascosita, TX Posts: 1,173	I fully agree...I can almost guarantee that I wouldn't have tied up almost 2 years of my (real) life in a league if I didn't own a team. __________________ Former NBSL Commissioner: 16 years Former Online League Owner; six time champion