Any consideration for FHM1 Early Supporters?

[Lantz]

I have been watching the development of FHM and FHM2 since it was first announced, bought the beta on the day it came out and, like most, found myself very underwhelmed -- haven't really touched it in a very very long time.

That being said, I've always had high hopes that the effort that Sebastien and the team put into FHM2 would redeem the colossal failure that was FHM1 and vowed that I would give it a shot.

I wonder, however, why there's been no concession or special offer for the early adopters that backed FHM1 and was lead down this path of disappointment? I know that sounds hyperbolic, and I don't really mind, the $30 or $40 or whatever is nothing, but as a gesture to those that chose to put money behind a product that I think everyone, including the team, would consider a well-documented failure, I would think a consideration in the way of a discount or a compensatory copy of FHM2 would be in line, I'm surprised that there is no mention of this.

Does OOTP not expect to bring the original wave of interest along to FHM2? Do they think that they've lost that audience already?

I'm not trying to be quarrelsome or anything, I'm genuinely curious if had maybe missed something somewhere regarding FHM2 finally coming to fruition and the long-overdue delivery on the promise of FHM that we backed so many years ago.

Thanks.

[tward13]

Why would they think they lost that audience?

And the 25% discount for the first week or so is a pretty nice inducement.

I bought the original shortly after it was out. I'll buy this one on 9/28. Looking ahead, not backwards

[Lantz]

Originally Posted by tward13

Why would they think they lost that audience?

And the 25% discount for the first week or so is a pretty nice inducement.

I bought the original shortly after it was out. I'll buy this one on 9/28. Looking ahead, not backwards

Perhaps their lack of consideration for those they dicked around for a few years on FHM1 was an indicator that they don't think there is much juice there left to squeeze?

Regardless, 25% pre-order discount is nice, for sure, but it's available to all users regardless of their previous experience and that's not what I'm inquiring about.

[Penfold75]

Free memory washing software to forget FHM14 happened :-)

[gekkoguy82]

FHM laid the groundwork for FHM 2, whether people like it or not. Lessons learned there will be applied from FHM 2 on in to the future. I'm not at all unhappy that I spent money on it even if I didn't play it much after a while. I'm really looking forward to FHM 2 and the lessons it can contribute to FHM 3, 4, 5, etc. I didn't contribute money to a "failure" in FHM. I invested in the future of the game series. It's very exciting to see what Seb and co are doing with my investment, and it certainly seems from early indicators that this iteration will be a significant improvement on the previous one. 25% is fine for me and I will be purchasing it straight away. I don't need special recognition for buying the first game.

[BobC]

I have to say I agree with Lantz.

While I am cautiously optimistic about FHM2, I felt the same way about the first edition and bought the game early on. Unfortunately, I feel the FHM1 was very poor and I never got close to my money's worth. It was a bad enough experience that I'm not willing to buy the new version until FHM2 has been out for a while and there are a decent number of reviews to consider.

The problem of course is that by waiting for the reviews I'll miss out on the discounted rate. Perhaps the developers would consider extending the discount by an extra week or so for people who purchased the first edition.

[Cole]

A few thoughts and keep in mind I'm just the PR guy, not a developer...

First, I'm not even entirely sure we have the mechanisms in place to allow for such a thing as a discount based on someone previously having the game. Perhaps it's possible, but the company as far as I know has never done such a thing in the past, so perhaps even technically it's not possible (or easy) to do.. but I could be wrong on that.

Secondly, to go as far as to suggest people who bought FHM 2014 get FHM 2 for free is a bit much. After all, this is the livelihood for the developers, it is how they make a living and thus, giving away the product to a large number of people might restore a lot of goodwill, but won't put food on their table.

Also, for those who were truly unhappy at the time of release, refunds were offered for FHM 2014.

While I wasn't involved in FHM 2014 or OOTP Developments when the game released, I am well aware of the troubles that existed with that release. A lot of lessons were learned and we know for some customers it will be an uphill struggle to restore faith.

Some will likely never come back to try another hockey game from us, but we truly feel once the good word gets out, people will be willing to give the game a try. After all, that's what everyone wants in the end and wanted with FHM 2014 - a complete and solid hockey simulation.

I understand completely if some people are hesitant to buy the game on day 1.. But, I do know a lot of people will be willing to buy it and there will be lots and lots of feedback in the first week. There will also in the lead up to release be some previews posted by independant game sites. So, all that to say, there should be plenty of information out there for someone to make a decision on whether or not this is the game for them.

We certainly hope you will all give it a shot and we expect this release to be 100x smoother than FHM 2014. (although not perfect, as nothing ever is!)

[Lantz]

Originally Posted by Cole

A few thoughts and keep in mind I'm just the PR guy, not a developer...

First, I'm not even entirely sure we have the mechanisms in place to allow for such a thing as a discount based on someone previously having the game. Perhaps it's possible, but the company as far as I know has never done such a thing in the past, so perhaps even technically it's not possible (or easy) to do.. but I could be wrong on that.

Secondly, to go as far as to suggest people who bought FHM 2014 get FHM 2 for free is a bit much. After all, this is the livelihood for the developers, it is how they make a living and thus, giving away the product to a large number of people might restore a lot of goodwill, but won't put food on their table.

Also, for those who were truly unhappy at the time of release, refunds were offered for FHM 2014.

While I wasn't involved in FHM 2014 or OOTP Developments when the game released, I am well aware of the troubles that existed with that release. A lot of lessons were learned and we know for some customers it will be an uphill struggle to restore faith.

Some will likely never come back to try another hockey game from us, but we truly feel once the good word gets out, people will be willing to give the game a try. After all, that's what everyone wants in the end and wanted with FHM 2014 - a complete and solid hockey simulation.

I understand completely if some people are hesitant to buy the game on day 1.. But, I do know a lot of people will be willing to buy it and there will be lots and lots of feedback in the first week. There will also in the lead up to release be some previews posted by independant game sites. So, all that to say, there should be plenty of information out there for someone to make a decision on whether or not this is the game for them.

We certainly hope you will all give it a shot and we expect this release to be 100x smoother than FHM 2014. (although not perfect, as nothing ever is!)

Thanks for the reply.

As I stated in the first post, I intend to purchase the game, as I have hope and would like to see one of my favorite types of games have good, entertaining options.

In regards to the refunds for FM2014 -- I didn't ever see an email offering those refunds? I waited patiently, updated when new versions were out and tried not to complain -- eventually I lost interest in waiting for the game to get better, started playing Football Manager and that solved for my simulation needs.

Was I required to come on the forums and complain in order to receive the offer for a refund? I'm just not sure how I would have enacted that without coming here and seeking it out -- thusly I don't think it's fair to say you "offered them", rather "granted them when requested, aggressively."

That being said, I may completely wrong, as I wasn't aware that refunds were awarded, and I may have just completely missed a moment in FHM history.

Either way, I don't want my money back and I don't want FHM2 for free -- I'm more just attempting to open a dialogue about what I (as someone who works in mobile marketing and development, building goodwill with a burned audience is a premium) see as a missed opportunity for OOTP to give a little bit of something back to those who got burned the first time around and have little to no trust in the work that Sebastien and team are doing with FHM.

[Lantz]

Originally Posted by gekkoguy82

FHM laid the groundwork for FHM 2, whether people like it or not. Lessons learned there will be applied from FHM 2 on in to the future. I'm not at all unhappy that I spent money on it even if I didn't play it much after a while. I'm really looking forward to FHM 2 and the lessons it can contribute to FHM 3, 4, 5, etc. I didn't contribute money to a "failure" in FHM. I invested in the future of the game series. It's very exciting to see what Seb and co are doing with my investment, and it certainly seems from early indicators that this iteration will be a significant improvement on the previous one. 25% is fine for me and I will be purchasing it straight away. I don't need special recognition for buying the first game.

I certainly don't need special recognition either, but a token of gratitude considering everything would go a long way in building a bridge to the large audience that they burned with the previous release.

[tward13]

Why would a company search out an encourage people to get refunds? People who asked about a refund were able to get one.

The company sent out updates and fixes. That's their job. How well they did that job is open for interpretation.

Many will be willing to writ eit off as growing pains and move on.

[Penfold75]

I bought the first game at Beta stage, the second game I have done research on some of the leagues and done some testing. Should I expect the game for free or at a discount...NO.

As Cole said this is the wages of the developers and the future of the FHM game as well. If it is given away to loads of people for free or discounted then there will be less money to develop the future versions.

My plan is to wait until after the discount has lapsed and buy the game at full price and show my full support for OOTP and FHM.

[G-Nuke]

FHM1 is finally being patched, and includes the new game engine. I consider this as a final chance for the FHM team to convince me to take a chance on FHM2.


BTW Cole, as someone who has always been a VERY aggressive critic of historical play, I noticed some major features lost at the bottom of the email, that are almost worth blog posts on their own re: historical play:


"Historical changes: We've added new historical seasons to the game, so you can start even further in the past - all the way back to 1931. In addition, you can now continue your game when reaching the last historical year and turn your game into a fictional league. We've added historical dollar values and a season preview, so you always know the situation for every season you are just about to start."


That's 3 major enhancements right there imo. If the game engine behaves as expected and the research is half-decent (or we get a decent global editor) that's major, major news.

[moore4807]

Originally Posted by Lantz

I certainly don't need special recognition either, but a token of gratitude considering everything would go a long way in building a bridge to the large audience that they burned with the previous release.

I understand your frustration and having several times defended the FHM franchise from it's critics, I find the anticipation of the upgraded FHM2 more than offsets the "bad history" of the original release.

About the only thing I can disagree with your post is I was able to play the FHM14 game (warts and all) by modifying my playing style to simming games and even had a following on these forums under Dynasties. So imho FHM14 owes me nothing.

I was going to take the 25% discount until Penfold75's post "shamed" me to wait it out like he is!

[Cole]

Originally Posted by moore4807

I was going to take the 25% discount until Penfold75's post "shamed" me to wait it out like he is!

What's more, as a beta tester Penfold is entitled to a free copy of the game... So he's really supporting the cause I suppose

[Penfold75]

Originally Posted by Cole

What's more, as a beta tester Penfold is entitled to a free copy of the game... So he's really supporting the cause I suppose

I didn't actually know about the free copy but now I do when the game is released I will uninstall it and purchase through Steam after the discount period has lapsed.

[nichimanen]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Hey guys,

we have just announced FHM2 here:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...28-2015-a.html

Please head over there for discussions relating to the new version.

By the way, the final game engine patch for FHM 1 has entered final beta testing and will be released in a few days.

Cheers,
Markus

If you go to the original Franchise Hockey Manager threads you will find the above post. As promised, FHM14 will get the new game engine as a patch, which will allow owners of FHM14 a chance to see what is under the hood of the new version. I think that is a pretty good consideration for early FHM supporters. It may even sway some to purchase the new game.

[Penfold75]

Originally Posted by moore4807

I was going to take the 25% discount until Penfold75's post "shamed" me to wait it out like he is!

My intention was certainly not to shame anyone. Everyone is entitled to buy the game whenever and however they choose. I guess the point I was making was from my own stand point I didn't agree to test the game or to do research in order to get a free copy of the game. I didn't buy the previous version in the hope of getting the next version for free or for a discount.

I have actually felt pretty privileged to be involved in the testing and researching process. It's something I have never really done for a game before but I am a hockey nut and I think hockey fans have been crying out for a really good Hockey Management Game (and FHM2 is it).

I,in my own way, want to support FHM2 and the development of future versions. Over the years I have spent hundreds of dollars and pounds on games at full price that have been absolute rubbish. I have tested the new version of FHM and in my honest opinion it is well worth spending the full price on and that's what I intend to do.

Well done to the FHM Development team and thanks for involving me

[Bigdummie]

My 2 cents on this is, yes I purchased FHM 1, and was disappointed to say the least. It just wasn't fun to play, so I moved on. I will be purchasing FHM 2 at the discounted price as I think the developers are working their tails off to get this version playable for us hockey nuts. No one is getting rich, I doubt after all the figures are in, the developers are making minimum wage. I appreciate all their efforts and will continue to support them in their FHM endeavors. Thanks

[thirdsaint]

Originally Posted by Bigdummie

My 2 cents on this is, yes I purchased FHM 1, and was disappointed to say the least. It just wasn't fun to play, so I moved on. I will be purchasing FHM 2 at the discounted price as I think the developers are working their tails off to get this version playable for us hockey nuts. No one is getting rich, I doubt after all the figures are in, the developers are making minimum wage. I appreciate all their efforts and will continue to support them in their FHM endeavors. Thanks

I second this. The fact we have a discounted price for a week to me is almost like the devs are apologizing for how FHM1 went. As a bonus they are even allowing skeptics to wait up to a week to decide and hear feedback from critics and those who paid for it day 1 until they make a decision. What more can you ask for? Anything less you may as well be robbing the developers that have spent 2 years of their like making it.

[Methodz]

Originally Posted by Lantz

Thanks for the reply.

As I stated in the first post, I intend to purchase the game, as I have hope and would like to see one of my favorite types of games have good, entertaining options.

In regards to the refunds for FM2014 -- I didn't ever see an email offering those refunds? I waited patiently, updated when new versions were out and tried not to complain -- eventually I lost interest in waiting for the game to get better, started playing Football Manager and that solved for my simulation needs.

Was I required to come on the forums and complain in order to receive the offer for a refund? I'm just not sure how I would have enacted that without coming here and seeking it out -- thusly I don't think it's fair to say you "offered them", rather "granted them when requested, aggressively."

That being said, I may completely wrong, as I wasn't aware that refunds were awarded, and I may have just completely missed a moment in FHM history.

Either way, I don't want my money back and I don't want FHM2 for free -- I'm more just attempting to open a dialogue about what I (as someone who works in mobile marketing and development, building goodwill with a burned audience is a premium) see as a missed opportunity for OOTP to give a little bit of something back to those who got burned the first time around and have little to no trust in the work that Sebastien and team are doing with FHM.

Yes, they offered us refunds, I remember. I never took it even though I agree, the game was a train wreck. I never took that refund because I just wanted them to eventually nail it and come out with an OOTP quality product in regards to hockey.

Although I can see where you're coming from and a rebate perhaps for early backers of FHM would be quite the good move here. Either way I doubt I'll buy this before hearing what people have to see about the engine, player progression, scouting, drafting and AI.