sign and release strikes again :)

[ra7c7er]

Originally Posted by David Watts

I'm more worried about teams not having enough players. I want my expansion teams to stink for a certain amount of time. But the cool thing about OOTP is you can always pump up the draft size to deal with this.

Yeah that's an option.

---

I did learn something interesting I just tried another sim using only one round drafts. And after 5 years only 6 teams have over 15 in their reserve roster and none of the 1 year to FA leagues have over 15. Doesn't make sense though that a 2 round draft means so many players but a one round draft doesn't go crazy.

[David Watts]

Just curious, since I've never played using independent leagues, I have no idea how they work with the MLB quickstart. Do they have a amateur draft? I guess I always thought they would simply be formed by signing leftover players.

[ra7c7er]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Just curious, since I've never played using independent leagues, I have no idea how they work with the MLB quickstart. Do they have a amateur draft? I guess I always thought they would simply be formed by signing leftover players.

In the quick start they just sign leftovers.

In the fictional world I made I only have independent leagues so there they do have a draft. For some reason a bunch of people came on thinking I was talking about the quickstart indy leagues when I multiple times said my league was in a fictional world.

[frangipard]

Originally Posted by Painmantle

Ok so far in this thread You've acknowledged :

A) that this topic has been covered several times before in post,
B) You understand what causes this issue,
C) You know how to prevent it,
D)You now fully acknowledge the developers are aware of it and it will not be fixed and you don't expect it to be fixed.

You forgot "acknowledged it's a minor issue that doesn't affect gameplay.

[dward1]

Originally Posted by frangipard

You forgot "acknowledged it's a minor issue that doesn't affect gameplay.

it does affect gameplay as high draft picks get released

[The Wolf]

Not if you're doing it right.

[ra7c7er]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Not if you're doing it right.

Never mind it's not worth it anymore.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Not if you're doing it right.

Tell me what I did wrong? I set up a league the exact way I did a league using OOTP14. Set reserve roster limits to 30. The same limit I set for the the league using 14. Doing this with both 15 and 16 results in teams drafting very good players in the early rounds of the amateur draft, only to release them soon after. Meanwhile they keep players drafted later in the draft on the roster.

As I've said many times in this thread, I don't mind using unlimited reserve rosters. My beef now is that I'm being told I did something wrong. That's just not right.

[ra7c7er]

Just so you guys know sign and release is still happening in my new league. No draft unlimited reserve rosters. This still happens. Granted it does happen less.

[BusterKing]

We shouldn't have to find work arounds so this doesn't happened. This problem has been a continuous PITA for many versions. It's time for Markus to have a serious look at this and to kill this bug once and for all without the need for adjustments to prevent this from happening.

[SirMichaelJordan]

I've been thinking...

Does anyone see the sign & release with players on actual contracts? I've only noticed this with guys with "free" minor league contracts. So I can understand why Markus would say that the AI releasing players is working as intended as the AI may be trying to get the best players available to help the organization whether its depth or lack of talent (even though the AI would sometimes release a player that was a high draft pick if you set limits in the minors)

So the question is why are teams without a minor league system able to sign guys to "free" minor league contracts? I think things would be more efficient if the reserve roster was treated as a 40 man (or whatever number you set it to) roster rather than a minor league system that haven't been setup.

I am going to try and set reserve limits to 15 in one of my indy leagues and follow one team as I edit all of their reserve roster players giving them actual contracts and see what comes of it.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan

I've been thinking...

Does anyone see the sign & release with players on actual contracts? I've only noticed this with guys with "free" minor league contracts. So I can understand why Markus would say that the AI releasing players is working as intended as the AI may be trying to get the best players available to help the organization whether its depth or lack of talent (even though the AI would sometimes release a player that was a high draft pick if you set limits in the minors)

So the question is why are teams without a minor league system able to sign guys to "free" minor league contracts? I think things would be more efficient if the reserve roster was treated as a 40 man (or whatever number you set it to) roster rather than a minor league system that haven't been setup.

I am going to try and set reserve limits to 15 in one of my indy leagues and follow one team as I edit all of their reserve roster players giving them actual contracts and see what comes of it.

Thanks for doing this. Anxious to see your results.

[SirMichaelJordan]

So far it seem like they do not release players that are on contracts. I have to pay more attention because players are being purchased and traded leaving more space on the roster to sign a player to a minor league contract so these new players are definitely getting signed and cut but so far it looks like the AI does not cut players on a contract.

Edit- just seen a player on a contract released.

Was having a pretty bad season but still.

It could have been the fact that a team will fill its available roster spots once a player is placed on the DL and needs to open a spot back up to activate the recovered players.

I think giving reserve players contracts (ala players on the 40) will slow down the sign and release the next or even the same day but you'll probably still see releases during the season because of what I mentioned above.

[ra7c7er]

Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan

So far it seem like they do not release players that are on contracts. I have to pay more attention because players are being purchased and traded leaving more space on the roster to sign a player to a minor league contract so these new players are definitely getting signed and cut but so far it looks like the AI does not cut players on a contract.

Edit- just seen a player on a contract released.

Was having a pretty bad season but still.

It could have been the fact that a team will fill its available roster spots once a player is placed on the DL and needs to open a spot back up to activate the recovered players.

I think giving reserve players contracts (ala players on the 40) will slow down the sign and release the next or even the same day but you'll probably still see releases during the season because of what I mentioned above.

That is some of it. It's why I don't consider during season sign and release as much of an issue. Since the team is signing someone to fill a role then once the role is complete they get released.

You should see what happens when a team drafts players and fills the roster while better players are still available in FA. Do they release the newly drafted players?

[SirMichaelJordan]

Setting the active roster to unlimited and keeping the reserve roster to 15 could stop the AI from cutting guys to make room after a injury clears. In my experience, the AI usually keep about 25 guys on its active roster when set to unlimited. I may try it for my modern indy league. I've seen the AI cut one of its best players to make room but it didn't really bother me much since those type of things tend to happen in a Indy league IRL. (Players asking to leave team, etc)

[andjbock]

Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan

I've been thinking...

Does anyone see the sign & release with players on actual contracts? I've only noticed this with guys with "free" minor league contracts. So I can understand why Markus would say that the AI releasing players is working as intended as the AI may be trying to get the best players available to help the organization whether its depth or lack of talent (even though the AI would sometimes release a player that was a high draft pick if you set limits in the minors)

So the question is why are teams without a minor league system able to sign guys to "free" minor league contracts? I think things would be more efficient if the reserve roster was treated as a 40 man (or whatever number you set it to) roster rather than a minor league system that haven't been setup.

I am going to try and set reserve limits to 15 in one of my indy leagues and follow one team as I edit all of their reserve roster players giving them actual contracts and see what comes of it.

I had started a thread a month or two ago asking if it was possible to only have guaranteed contracts (no MLC's) nobody knew how.

That or 0 person reserve rosters would solve the issues.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by andjbock

I had started a thread a month or two ago asking if it was possible to only have guaranteed contracts (no MLC's) nobody knew how.



That or 0 person reserve rosters would solve the issues.

Yea a option to not have reserve rosters would be nice. Could just set the active roster to not be below 35 like minor league teams.

[Rain King]

It would also be nice if there was an option to not allow minor league contracts.

[Saul Goodman]

Originally Posted by Painmantle

What I'd like someone to do is, instead of just saying "It's unrealistic to set the reserve roster to unlimited" SHOW ME that using this setting produces unrealistic hoarding of players on a teams reserve rosters. I have a feeling that you won't see it happen. In my Ruth Dynasty that started in 1918 it is now the end of the 1923 season and teams have an average of 24 players on their reserve roster, High is 33, low is 18. These are hardly "unrealistic" numbers. It seems that most have an issue with this imaginary amount of players they feel it's possible to have on a reserve team being "infinity". When the realities of the setting are that it will most likley stay within a realistic number.

I've got a test sim going with all default leagues loaded and default out of the box game settings too. Lists below are the leagues that use unlimited reserve rosters. The year in the game is 2021.

Numbers listed next to city are the number of players on the reserve roster at the date I'm at in the test sim

ABL (22 active roster/unlimited reserve):
Adelaide: 120 players
Brisbane: 128 players
Canberra: 123 players
Melbourne: 112 players
Perth: 126 players
Sydney: 102 players

Cuba (32 active roster/unlimited reserve):
Artemisa: 59 players
Camaguey: 61 players
Ciego de Avila: 61 players
Cienfugos: 55 players
Granma: 53 players
Guantanamo: 61 players
Holguin: 68 players
Industriales: 75 players
Isla: 52 players
Las Tunas: 53 players
Matanzas: 66 players
Mayabeque: 57 players
Pinar: 44 players
Sancti: 55 players
Santiago: 69 players
Villa Clara: 55 players

Mexico (30 active roster/unlimited reserve roster):
Aguascalientes: 113 players
Campeche: 111 players
Carmen: 111 players
Laguna: 105 players
Monclova: 113 players
Mexico Diablos: 102 players
Monterrey: 106 players
Oaxaca: 95 players
Puebla: 106 players
Quintana: 112 players
Reynosa: 120 players
Saltillo: 107 players
Tabasco: 104 players
Tijuana: 90 players
Veracruz: 120 players
Yucatan: 106 players

Netherlands (24 active roster/unlimited reserve roster):
Corendon: 75 players
DOOR: 70 players
Honkbal: 76 players
Emmen: 61 players (expansion)
Amsterdam: 76 players
Mampaey: 65 players
Cocker: 73 players
Utrecht: 79 players
Vaessen: 69 players
Westland: 56 players (expansion)

Italy (25 active roster/unlimited reserve)
Nettuno: 80 players
De Angelis: 78 players
Lino's: 75 players
Nettuno 2: 79 players
San Marino: 90 players
Rimini: 106 players
Padova: 75 players
Bologna: 76 players

Atlantic (Indy - 25 active roster/unlimited reserve)
Bridgeport: 51 players
Camden: 21 players
Dallas: 52 players (expansion)
Lancaster: 32 players
Long Island: 29 players
San Antonio: 39 players (expansion)
Somerset: 48 players
Southern Maryland: 34 players
Sugar Land: 33 players
York: 42 players

Can-Am (Indy - 22 players/unlimited reserve)
Amarillo: 32 players
Fargo-Moorhead: 29 players
Gary Southshore: 45 players
Grand Prairie: 24 players
Joplin: 29 players
Kansas City: 58 players
Laredo: 41 players
Lincoln: 39 players
New Jersey: 35 players
Ottawa: 58 players
Quebec: 20 players
Rockland: 32 players
Sioux City: 43 players
Sioux Falls: 20 players
St Paul: 24 players
Sussex: 43 players
Trois-Rivieres: 54 players
Wichita: 29 players
Winnipeg: 35 players

Frontier (Indy - 24 active roster/unlimited reserve roster)
Evansville: 48 players
Florence: 58 players
Frontier: 45 players
Gateway: 53 players
Houston: 46 players (expansion)
Joliet: 69 players
Lake Erie: 44 players
New York: 62 players (expansion)
Normal: 57 players
River City: 42 players
Rockford: 46 players
Schaumberg: 44 players
Southern Illinois: 70 players
Traverse City: 61 players
Washington: 32 players
Windy City: 40 players

Pecos (Indy - 22 active roster/unlimited reserve roster)
Alpine: 84 players
Chicago: 57 players (expansion)
Garden City: 84 players
Las Cruces: 83 players
Las Vegas: 72 players
New York: 63 players (expansion)
Roswell: 70 players
Santa Fe: 89 players
Trinidad: 59 players
White Sands: 66 players

Baseball Challenge (Indy - 26 active roster/unlimited reserve roster)
Fukui: 76 players
Fukushima: 83 players
Gunma: 91 players
Ishikawa: 83 players
Musashi: 64 players
Niigata: 71 players
Shinano: 66 players
Toyama: 63 players

Shikoku Island (Indy - 25 active roster/unlimited reserve roster)
Ehime: 75 players
Kagawa: 100 players
Kochi: 72 players
Tokushima: 60 players

I will let people form their own opinion on the figures above, but to me I can certainly see the argument that reserve rosters can become very bloated if they are set to unlimited.

I will say though, I'm a bit shocked and disappointed by the reactions in this thread from some people - very overly aggressive and dismissive of someone raising what they think is an issue in OOTP. You may not agree with what they say, but they shouldn't have to deal with the reaction from some people here - that's not the way this place should be when anyone brings up what they view as a negative or flawed point of OOTP. End of the day we're all OOTP fans and want the game to be the absolute best it can be and getting people expressing different points of view and opinions of perceived issues on the game is how the game will continue to grow.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Not sure how this would work for historical but for modern day Indy (or any league without minors)...

Setting reserve roster limit to 15 and setting the active roster to unlimited will improve roster management. You won't see guys get cut to make room on the active roster but you will occasionally see guys on a minor league contract get signed and released but luckily 90% of the roster will have a major league contract since the AI will rotate guys in and out of the active lineup. They will keep around 25 men on the major league roster despite it being unlimited.