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Old 11-11-2019, 02:43 PM   #1
slugga27
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Pinch running after injury logic

Hopefully this can be improved upon in the future...

Third inning, catcherGary Sanchez gets injured (going into third base, no less). He gets run for by shortstop Troy Tulowitzki, then needless to say is replaced by Austin Romine in the field in the fourth inning. The AI just burned two bench players in the third inning! There is no way, under any circumstances, where this can be considered sound strategy.

Has anyone else noticed this?


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Old 11-11-2019, 02:57 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slugga27 View Post
Hopefully this can be improved upon in the future...

Third inning, catcherGary Sanchez gets injured (going into third base, no less). He gets run for by shortstop Troy Tulowitzki, then needless to say is replaced by Austin Romine in the field in the fourth inning. The AI just burned two bench players in the third inning! There is no way, under any circumstances, where this can be considered sound strategy.

Has anyone else noticed this?


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It only burned one player it didn't have to (Sanchez had to come out of the game due to the injury, and I take it Romme was the backup catcher).

And it was questionable strategy but within reason to pinch run the SS though it burned him. Catchers are usually slow, so there's a good chance Romme is. The SS the AI brought in was probably a faster runner, and he was pinch running after all, for a catcher who had to leave the game due to injury.
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Old 11-11-2019, 05:29 PM   #3
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I agree with the OP. MLB managers wouldn't burn a bench guy just to burn a bench guy. The AI is notoriously bad at this. Sometimes when pinch hitting they will have the choice of two lefties with one of the lefties being the platoon partner for the righty being hit for. The AI seems to have no problem pinch hitting with the other guy and then using that platoon partner as a defensive replacement when they go back out to the field. It is almost as if the AI decides whom to pinch hit or pinch run with in a bubble, with no concern about how your roster will be affected for the rest of the game.

Speaking of crazy pinch running strategies by the AI... Saw this happen a few days ago in a sim I watched play out. Strategy settings have pinch running at max FYI. Also Machado was not injured.
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Old 11-11-2019, 07:34 PM   #4
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I agree with the OP. MLB managers wouldn't burn a bench guy just to burn a bench guy. The AI is notoriously bad at this. Sometimes when pinch hitting they will have the choice of two lefties with one of the lefties being the platoon partner for the righty being hit for. The AI seems to have no problem pinch hitting with the other guy and then using that platoon partner as a defensive replacement when they go back out to the field. It is almost as if the AI decides whom to pinch hit or pinch run with in a bubble, with no concern about how your roster will be affected for the rest of the game.
The pinch hitting issue you describe is a different issue with the game, which is that it doesn't recognize strict platoon partners in general, that if you have a lefty and a righty platoon at 3B, a lefty started (so your righty started) and is replaced by a righty, it won't bring in the platoon partner to pinch hit. Regardless, it should bring in the platoon partner there, unless it's a very high leverage situation and the pinch hitter it uses is a lot better.

It might also decide in a bubble in general, that it had to pinch run so it picked the best pinch runner and saving players isn't in the calculus or too low in it: That may be what happened in the OP's spot. But I just don't think that particular move is that bad. I don't think I'd have done it if managing the game because the runner was on 3rd, so his speed was very unlikely to affect whether he scored or not. But with a runner on 1st and no outs, if I have to pinch run anyway I'll use the better runner and burn him, because even if he's not good enough to steal second with there are a lot of cases he'll advance extra bases and eventually score where the backup catcher wouldn't.

I wouldn't pinch run for the catcher at all of course if he wasn't injured; that would be burning two players, and the starting catcher was probably a better overall player than the backup. But a practice of, if you have to pinch run, using someone fast, isn't a bad idea in general.

I know I don't like managers who rarely go through almost all their position players in a game. Many real life managers avoid burning players to the point that they waste them.
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Old 11-11-2019, 09:53 PM   #5
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The pinch hitting issue you describe is a different issue with the game, which is that it doesn't recognize strict platoon partners in general, that if you have a lefty and a righty platoon at 3B, a lefty started (so your righty started) and is replaced by a righty, it won't bring in the platoon partner to pinch hit. Regardless, it should bring in the platoon partner there, unless it's a very high leverage situation and the pinch hitter it uses is a lot better.

It might also decide in a bubble in general, that it had to pinch run so it picked the best pinch runner and saving players isn't in the calculus or too low in it: That may be what happened in the OP's spot. But I just don't think that particular move is that bad. I don't think I'd have done it if managing the game because the runner was on 3rd, so his speed was very unlikely to affect whether he scored or not. But with a runner on 1st and no outs, if I have to pinch run anyway I'll use the better runner and burn him, because even if he's not good enough to steal second with there are a lot of cases he'll advance extra bases and eventually score where the backup catcher wouldn't.

I wouldn't pinch run for the catcher at all of course if he wasn't injured; that would be burning two players, and the starting catcher was probably a better overall player than the backup. But a practice of, if you have to pinch run, using someone fast, isn't a bad idea in general.

I know I don't like managers who rarely go through almost all their position players in a game. Many real life managers avoid burning players to the point that they waste them.
I wasn't talking about a "strict platoon". I was talking about an instance where you have two reasonably equal choices to pinch hit and the AI uses the guy that will cause you to then replace him with another sub in the field. Platoon situations aren't the only time this happens.

As for pinch hitting for a catcher on first base with no outs because of injury, for me it would depend on the situation. Early in a game then I probably just use the backup catcher. Later in a close game then I would be more willing to burn an extra guy for the advantage on the bases.
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Old 11-26-2019, 02:50 PM   #6
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It only burned one player it didn't have to (Sanchez had to come out of the game due to the injury, and I take it Romme was the backup catcher).



And it was questionable strategy but within reason to pinch run the SS though it burned him. Catchers are usually slow, so there's a good chance Romme is. The SS the AI brought in was probably a faster runner, and he was pinch running after all, for a catcher who had to leave the game due to injury.


I totally forgot about this thread, so apologies for the delayed response.

I guess I’ll just say that someone else already disputed your thoughts.

The bad strategy is (at least) two-fold. One, burning two players in the THIRD inning. Two, at THIRD BASE, no less. What’s he gonna do, steal home in the third inning? I suppose he might, if he knows he’s getting taken out anyways lol


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