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View Poll Results: So how much of a threat do you think OOTP Online will be to our beloved online leagues?
Online leagues as we know them will cease to exist within a few years 6 19.35%
They'll still exist, but they'll be struggling to find members even moreso than now 2 6.45%
They'll be no better, no worse 21 67.74%
They'll actually be better than they are now! 2 6.45%
I don't care; I'm joining an online monkey rodeo league 0 0%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-22-2008, 09:22 PM   #1
kq76
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How Much Of A Threat Will OOTP Online Be?

As soon as I first heard of this OOTP Online I was hoping it wouldn't get past even the planning stages. We don't need another ITP sucking development time away from the core game and I certainly don't think we need online leagues that require a monthly subscription fee. I guess one could argue that they could _maybe_ make bucketloads of money off of it and hire more staff to work on it and the core game, but I doubt we'd even see the former and even if we did there'd be very little, if any, incentive to improve the online league capabilities of the core game. And while it may attract a lot of people completely new to OOTP, I fear it will steal away a lot of online leaguers from existing leagues.

Now today Markus has said that not only is OOTP Online still going to happen, but that they even already have "design documents" for its 2nd version. A big "Ugg!" is all I can say to that.

What do you guys think, am I needlessly worrying over nothing (I'd probably pick B in the poll right now) or is this a genuine threat to our online leagues as we currently know them? Will most people pay 5 or 10 bucks a month to be in a league like that with some extra features yet maybe less control over things especially for the commish, or will most balk at the idea? Will many at least try it? Even if many at least try it, will it ultimately fail?
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Old 05-22-2008, 10:10 PM   #2
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I think if this is designed to replace the present way online leagues are run with a pay online league set up, it will kill off that portion of the fan base.................and with Shaun at Wolverine now with a new 'PureSim' in the works, a new 'free' online league option will be out there.

I'm not sure where Markus is going with this (I understand the 'money' portion of it), but I think it could alienate a large portion of the customer base if its done for the reasons I give above.
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Old 05-22-2008, 11:10 PM   #3
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I don't see Markus using OOTP online to replace online leagues as they are now. I think he is trying to tap in to the fantasy market that wouldn't necessarily play via a PC software game.

I was also a little bummed to see this was still a planned part of the release. I am not sure how much focus it takes away from game development since it will use the same engine. However, the market for this type of set-up is already flooded. Most notably Strat-o-Matic online who even has a partnership with Sporting News to get traffic to the game.
Others:
WhatIfSports
Sim Dynasty
SimYard
CSFBL
I researched this in the winter when Markus initially announced plans for OOTP online and came across many other sites like these. I figured he had scrapped the plans for the add on.

Last edited by blueturf; 05-22-2008 at 11:13 PM.
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Old 05-23-2008, 12:17 AM   #4
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As solid supporters of OOTP - I think it would be nice to offer these as features to the retail version.

I think that this will find a small market segment, Why would I pay to play in a league that either I can host or join for free
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:33 PM   #5
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I will go on record as saying that this will be a mistake. I have the same objection to Football Manager Live, which is probably where Markus got the idea. Anything that diverts ANY creative energy or programming away from the core product is a horrible idea. SI has tried to justify FM Live by saying that it has its own development team and that the potential revenue creates new possibilities for the core product. But the reality is that there is no way to take on a new project like that without involving at least some of the energy and resources from those who are not working on the new venture.

The core FM game has remained mostly the same for several years, and those resources would be better spent on enhancing that original product. Maybe the feeling is that applying additional resources will not lead to improved revenue, but if they truly put as much effort into the core product as they are doing with FM Live, they could produce huge advances that could easily justify an increase in selling price of at least 25% to 35%. So they could get the additional revenue from the core product.

The same could be said for OOTP. Strat-O-Matic sells for far more than OOTP, and its season disks require the gamer to spend a small fortune. Imagine if OOTP made huge leaps and bounds to finally deliver the best AI and overall experience in any baseball sim ever produced. I'd be willing to bet that many customers would be willing to pay $75 for a product like that, especially when there is no need for additional disk purchases.

So, rather than see Markus work on OOTP Online, I would like to see the energy poured completely into making OOTP 10 a product that blows away all other replay and career sims ever devised. I'll be the first in line to pay $75 for something like that.
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Old 05-23-2008, 09:45 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertoClemente View Post
I think that this will find a small market segment, Why would I pay to play in a league that either I can host or join for free
Exactly. I'll continue playing my free online leagues as I have done for the past six years.
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Old 05-24-2008, 04:32 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Hough View Post
I will go on record as saying that this will be a mistake. I have the same objection to Football Manager Live, which is probably where Markus got the idea. Anything that diverts ANY creative energy or programming away from the core product is a horrible idea. SI has tried to justify FM Live by saying that it has its own development team and that the potential revenue creates new possibilities for the core product. But the reality is that there is no way to take on a new project like that without involving at least some of the energy and resources from those who are not working on the new venture.

The core FM game has remained mostly the same for several years, and those resources would be better spent on enhancing that original product. Maybe the feeling is that applying additional resources will not lead to improved revenue, but if they truly put as much effort into the core product as they are doing with FM Live, they could produce huge advances that could easily justify an increase in selling price of at least 25% to 35%. So they could get the additional revenue from the core product.

The same could be said for OOTP. Strat-O-Matic sells for far more than OOTP, and its season disks require the gamer to spend a small fortune. Imagine if OOTP made huge leaps and bounds to finally deliver the best AI and overall experience in any baseball sim ever produced. I'd be willing to bet that many customers would be willing to pay $75 for a product like that, especially when there is no need for additional disk purchases.

So, rather than see Markus work on OOTP Online, I would like to see the energy poured completely into making OOTP 10 a product that blows away all other replay and career sims ever devised. I'll be the first in line to pay $75 for something like that.
OOTP already delivers the best AI and overall experience in any baseball sim ever, hands down. No one else is even close to the experience OOTP delivers.

As for the $75, no, I wouldn't pay that much every year for a computer game, not a chance.
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Old 05-26-2008, 10:04 PM   #8
Charlie Hough
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Quote:
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OOTP already delivers the best AI and overall experience in any baseball sim ever, hands down. No one else is even close to the experience OOTP delivers.
Not when it comes to historical replays and hardcore statistical accuracy. Strat-O-Matic is still the gold standard when it comes to that.
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Old 06-23-2008, 02:35 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceM View Post
...
As for the $75, no, I wouldn't pay that much every year for a computer game, not a chance.
I think the $75 price was tossed out as the FINAL price for the ultime baseball sim. I've already got more than that invested in this franchise, so yeah, I'd pay $75 for OOTP ULTIMATE. But AI is really hard and doesn't sell games. Ball flight sells games! Sound sells games! How do you advertise killer AI? An AI that never makes a mistake is wouldn't be much fun to play against.
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Old 08-12-2008, 09:50 AM   #10
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Baseball Mogul Online is now free to existing users, and are not accepting any new users right now...the game needs an update and fix billing...well see what happens after 90 days...I have heard reports that BMO is being sold at the moment..
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