Stat Help

[AirmenSmith]

So I'm looking for a new way to evaluate players. I am extremely old school with stats.


Pitchers I use era/w/L/Saves


Hitters I use BA/HR/RBI


So here is what I am looking for. For pitchers I have eased off the W/L stat. What I want is a stat that shows how good a pitcher has pitched despite his teams defense.


For hitters I am trying to get away from RBI's because it isn't the players fault if no one gets on base before him. Although I do think it comes into play for being clutch. HR and BA I still believe in.


What I want for a hitter is the best stat that isn't affected by other teammates getting on base.


Any help is welcomed. If you offer a suggestion please explain how the stat is calculated.




--------------------------------------No WAR suggestions please--------------------------------------

[DFyvie]

For pitchers I look at FIP exclusively these days. With batters I look at ISO and OPS.. RC/27 is another I look at sometimes but usually just during the draft to help me decide between a few different guys...

With pitchers I often gauge the defense behind him (BABIP) as a context when looking at his ERA as it lets you know if he's had some bad luck/good luck. FIP is perfect as it practically ignores the defense.

Wikipedia does a decent job explaining all of these stats, btw.

[The Wolf]

Go here:

Sabermetrics 101: Wrap-Up (And Announcement!) - Lookout Landing

Read all 24 linked Sabermetrics 101 posts in order.

Done.

[Questdog]

A quick and easy way to evaluate either pitchers or hitters is OPS+, which is OPS, but one better. Add SLG and OBP and then add OBP again. Better than just OPS.

For hitters, the best in-game metric is probably wOBA.

[MMastro92]

I'm not a big proponent of FIP. I think it rewards ground all pitchers above fly ball pitchers by design. Additionally, you can have a pretty bad pitcher with a low FIP simply because he gave up a lot of groundball and line drive singles. For example, I had a pitcher on my team who I knew was very poor based on managing every game. Yet his FIP was low because he never gave up fly balls. I personally like WHIP the most, then I'll look at things like ERA and BB/9. I do look at FIP, but just not exclusively, you need to look at it in conjunction with a few other stats.

For hitters I like OPS the most. After that, I look at the breakdown of OPS (between OBP and SLG), then things like WAR, RC/27, etc...

Completely forgot about wOBA, definitely the best quick snapshot of a hitter you can utilize.

[Avindian]

Originally Posted by Questdog

A quick and easy way to evaluate either pitchers or hitters is OPS+, which is OPS, but one better. Add SLG and OBP and then add OBP again. Better than just OPS.

For hitters, the best in-game metric is probably wOBA.

Unless OOTP uses a drastically different version of OPS+, OPS+ is OPS adjusted to remove park effects and league effects, so that an OPS+ of 125 means that a player was 25% better than a league average player (who would be 100).

[The Wolf]

OPS+ = 100 x (OBP/lgOBP*+SLG/lgSLG*- 1)

[Mike45]

I like OPS for hitters (all the OPS +/w etc confuses me) and seperately (OBP for top of the lineup hitters.SLG for my middle of the lineup type guys).

And for pitchers, always have been a big fan of WHIP and K/BB ratio. Guy could be putting people on every inning and getting out of it so ERA low, but his WHIP is huge.

[Questdog]

Originally Posted by Avindian

Unless OOTP uses a drastically different version of OPS+, OPS+ is OPS adjusted to remove park effects and league effects, so that an OPS+ of 125 means that a player was 25% better than a league average player (who would be 100).

Well, Whatever you call SLG+OBP+OBP is better than just SLG+OBP, park adjusted or not.

[The Wolf]

FanGraphs:

"On-base Plus Slugging Plus (OPS+) has not gained as much widespread acceptance, but is a more informative metric than OPS. This statistic normalizes a player’s OPS — it adjusts for small variables that might affect OPS scores (e.g. park effects) and puts the statistic on an easy-to-understand scale. A 100 OPS+ is league average, and each point up or down is one percentage point above or below league average. In other words, if a player had a 90 OPS+ last season, that means their OPS was 10% below league average.

Since OPS+ adjusts for league and park effects, it’s possible to use OPS+ to compare players from different years and on different teams."

[snepp]

Is OPS+ park adjusted in OOTP yet, or is it still just compared to the league?

[Questdog]

Originally Posted by snepp

Is OPS+ park adjusted in OOTP yet, or is it still just compared to the league?

It is Park Adjusted.

[Tyler87898]

Originally Posted by Questdog

It is Park Adjusted.

I thought it wasn't in OOTP. Has it always been like this or was it fixed recently?

[Avindian]

Originally Posted by Questdog

Well, Whatever you call SLG+OBP+OBP is better than just SLG+OBP, park adjusted or not.

That's true -- I think you're talking about wOBA, which is weighted (if memory serves) as well, and yes, it's an excellent stat for judging offensive contributions.

[Questdog]

Originally Posted by Avindian

That's true -- I think you're talking about wOBA, which is weighted (if memory serves) as well, and yes, it's an excellent stat for judging offensive contributions.

no...wOBA is more like Linear Weights....

[The Wolf]

wOBA is a rating stat that consists of the summed values of the linear weights of a player's offensive events, scaled to on-base percentage. It has nothing to do with OPS or OPS+.

[Avindian]

Originally Posted by Questdog

no...wOBA is more like Linear Weights....

Originally Posted by The Wolf

wOBA is a rating stat that consists of the summed values of the linear weights of a player's offensive events, scaled to on-base percentage. It has nothing to do with OPS or OPS+.

I know how it's calculated -- my reference was to part of The Book (by Tom Tango) which states that "OBP x 2 + SLG/3 is a close approximation of wOBA." I'd never heard of simply doubling OBP and making OPS, so I was trying to figure out where I'd heard what Questdog said before.