Too Many Promotions

Marleigh · 04-07-2020, 03:36 PM

I'm in a 24 team silver league 16 teams will be promoted 4 relegated. There are currently 11 teams with sub 500 records, 4 will get relegated, 4 will stay put and 4 will move up to an even tougher league, seems a bit unfair on those 3, there is also a 22 team league which has 12 teams with sub 500 records

Surely the amount of promotions needs to scale with the size of the league otherwise you are condemning people to play at a level which their team can't handle

Orion · 04-07-2020, 03:36 PM

It'll even out.

Ty Cobb · 04-08-2020, 11:42 AM

No, Orion. It will not. The mad dash is on to shoehorn folks into the upper levels. It's a strategy that will result in a large number of unhappy customers.

mcdog512 · 04-08-2020, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ty Cobb

No, Orion. It will not. The mad dash is on to shoehorn folks into the upper levels. It's a strategy that will result in a large number of unhappy customers.

Once everything is populated there should be more relegations should even out as Orion said.

Dogberry99 · 04-08-2020, 12:01 PM

So is everyone in agreement that it is not a problem, or is everyone in agreement that it is a problem that solves itself over a short amount of time?

Those are not the same thing...

Ty Cobb · 04-08-2020, 12:17 PM

My only point was to offer an observation—that short term unhappiness will be created. Judging the effect on the community and the game are beyond my pay grade. My strictly personal observation is that I don't see the rush to promote. Fewer folk at the top is not a bad thing...it makes getting there that much more of an accomplishment.

mcdog512 · 04-08-2020, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ty Cobb

My only point was to offer an observation—that short term unhappiness will be created. Judging the effect on the community and the game are beyond my pay grade. My strictly personal observation is that I don't see the rush to promote. Fewer folk at the top is not a bad thing...it makes getting there that much more of an accomplishment.

A sub section of people will be unhappy no matter whey do to be honest.

eldur00 · 04-08-2020, 01:09 PM

It remains to be seen if the added amount of relagations will be sufficient. Nobody can argue the aggressive promotions in the past did cause some headaches for some customers who felt like they were stuck in a level they had no chance of realistically compete in, but sucked just a little less than others and were stuck in limbo. Some for weeks.

It wouldn't even surprise me if that was the first cause for the tanking we had been seeing, too.

Rain King · 04-08-2020, 01:10 PM

This is a much better solution than how things started out last year IMO (as are the levels in general).

Ty Cobb · 04-08-2020, 01:58 PM

Quite true. No rollout is without growing pains, and on the whole I think it's an extremely good process. I'm a bit of a perfectionist (actually probably closer to OCD) about some things, and it colors my judgement sometimes. That's why I'm trying to just make observations rather than blanket bombs. We're off to an extremely good start.

HelpDodgers · 04-08-2020, 02:43 PM

Methinks everyone who isn't playing .500 ball should be regulated.

mcdog512 · 04-08-2020, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HelpDodgers

Methinks everyone who isn't playing .500 ball should be regulated.

Regulated is fine, but if you relegate them you need to balance that with promotions. How will you make that dynamic?

Westheim · 04-08-2020, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdog512

Regulated is fine, but if you relegate them you need to balance that with promotions. How will you make that dynamic?

How does one make the mathematically impossible dynamic? I would like to know that too... Some people's ideas.......

Marleigh · 04-09-2020, 09:14 AM

There are currently 9 silver leagues, that will result in 144 teams in gold, presumably 4 full leagues and a 24, which will result in 80 teams in diamond if it stays at 16 up 4 down, which seems an awful number, 2 30s and a 20? maybe two smaller leagues and a 30, they could easily cut the number being promoted to bring it to just 60 teams in the first diamond league to make two fairly balanced leagues

HelpDodgers · 04-09-2020, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim

How does one make the mathematically impossible dynamic? I would like to know that too... Some people's ideas.......

My education isn't into statistics (as you can tell by my teams) but for conversation purposes... something like

In most levels .600 ball or playoffs get you promoted. .400 ball gets you demoted

In the singular perfect league, playoff teams stay, then World Series champions from diamond get promoted ranked by season win %

then some pyramid type flow bases on win %

--

Just an idea.

I do think there should be only 1 perfect league, and 20 diamond leagues... and everything else can be moved around based on need. At long as top 2 levels are absolute limits, everything else should fall in place.

Now how to do this, that is for smarter animals.

One Great Matrix · 04-09-2020, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orion

It'll even out.

It may or may not even out. There's a chance it will even out, though.

One Great Matrix · 04-09-2020, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eldur00

It remains to be seen if the added amount of relagations will be sufficient. Nobody can argue the aggressive promotions in the past did cause some headaches for some customers who felt like they were stuck in a level they had no chance of realistically compete in, but sucked just a little less than others and were stuck in limbo. Some for weeks.

It wouldn't even surprise me if that was the first cause for the tanking we had been seeing, too.

Yeah, there are some funny responses to the promotions and relegations...We're all free to respond strategically to 3-20 promotions & 3-20 relegations. Remember your team is going to compete in a particular league every week...if it gets to the point where there's 6 or 7 weeks and it seems your team just isn't in the right league, then you may want to post something, but otherwise adjustments can be made on either side so to speak.

MrPibb · 04-09-2020, 04:53 PM

Halfway through the week, I'm 51-42 and I'm a whopping 28 games behind my division leader. Even though I'm in line for a wild card, I'm seriously considering tanking because I'm tired of blown out by guys with a full compliment of 99's and 100's.

People keep saying it'll even out, but how am I even in the same league, let alone division with someone who's obviously light years ahead of me.

This is my first time playing a OOTB game, and it's really a buzzkill.

mcdog512 · 04-09-2020, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrPibb

Halfway through the week, I'm 51-42 and I'm a whopping 28 games behind my division leader. Even though I'm in line for a wild card, I'm seriously considering tanking because I'm tired of blown out by guys with a full compliment of 99's and 100's.

People keep saying it'll even out, but how am I even in the same league, let alone division with someone who's obviously light years ahead of me.

This is my first time playing a OOTB game, and it's really a buzzkill.

Because all the levels haven't been filled out yet. Once they are, there will be more relegations to keep people in league that makes sense. At the start there are big teams moving up.

MrPibb · 04-09-2020, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcdog512

Because all the levels haven't been filled out yet. Once they are, there will be more relegations to keep people in league that makes sense. At the start there are big teams moving up.

But i'm moving right up with them. That seems to be my issue. I had a winning record each year, never sniffing the division leads and I'm moving up right along with the whales.

It seems like team composition should be a factor vs pure win-loss. I'm mostly all gold at this point, the guy ahead of me is all diamond and perfects, and some poor guy in the basement is still mostly all silver.

Things might eventually even out, but us three teams have no business playing in the same league, let alone division.

So far, I am not at all impressed with this games matchmaking.

04-07-2020, 03:36 PM	#1
Marleigh All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: UK Posts: 541	Too Many Promotions I'm in a 24 team silver league 16 teams will be promoted 4 relegated. There are currently 11 teams with sub 500 records, 4 will get relegated, 4 will stay put and 4 will move up to an even tougher league, seems a bit unfair on those 3, there is also a 22 team league which has 12 teams with sub 500 records Surely the amount of promotions needs to scale with the size of the league otherwise you are condemning people to play at a level which their team can't handle __________________

04-07-2020, 03:36 PM	#2
Orion Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2019 Posts: 300	It'll even out. __________________

04-08-2020, 11:42 AM	#3
Ty Cobb Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Grayling, MI Posts: 3,940 Blog Entries: 66	No, Orion. It will not. The mad dash is on to shoehorn folks into the upper levels. It's a strategy that will result in a large number of unhappy customers. __________________ “What’s the most you ever lost on a coin toss?” “Everyone is an atheist until Templars begin marching in the rain.” Absinthe makes the heart grow fonder. It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance.—Thomas Sowell "Alinsky works for me now."

04-08-2020, 12:01 PM	#5
Dogberry99 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2018 Location: Wichita Falls, TX Posts: 1,328	So is everyone in agreement that it is not a problem, or is everyone in agreement that it is a problem that solves itself over a short amount of time? Those are not the same thing... __________________ "And, Masters, do not forget to specify, when time and place shall serve, that I am an [censored]." (Much Ado About Nothing 5.1.255-256) Primary Team Collection Rewards (Cards & Packs) F2P Theme Team Movers F2P Theme and Adam Schlesinger Memorial Team

04-08-2020, 12:17 PM	#6
Ty Cobb Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Grayling, MI Posts: 3,940 Blog Entries: 66	My only point was to offer an observation—that short term unhappiness will be created. Judging the effect on the community and the game are beyond my pay grade. My strictly personal observation is that I don't see the rush to promote. Fewer folk at the top is not a bad thing...it makes getting there that much more of an accomplishment. __________________ “What’s the most you ever lost on a coin toss?” “Everyone is an atheist until Templars begin marching in the rain.” Absinthe makes the heart grow fonder. It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance.—Thomas Sowell "Alinsky works for me now."

04-08-2020, 01:09 PM	#8
eldur00 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 506	It remains to be seen if the added amount of relagations will be sufficient. Nobody can argue the aggressive promotions in the past did cause some headaches for some customers who felt like they were stuck in a level they had no chance of realistically compete in, but sucked just a little less than others and were stuck in limbo. Some for weeks. It wouldn't even surprise me if that was the first cause for the tanking we had been seeing, too.

04-08-2020, 01:10 PM	#9
Rain King Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,108	This is a much better solution than how things started out last year IMO (as are the levels in general).

04-08-2020, 01:58 PM	#10
Ty Cobb Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Grayling, MI Posts: 3,940 Blog Entries: 66	Quite true. No rollout is without growing pains, and on the whole I think it's an extremely good process. I'm a bit of a perfectionist (actually probably closer to OCD) about some things, and it colors my judgement sometimes. That's why I'm trying to just make observations rather than blanket bombs. We're off to an extremely good start. __________________ “What’s the most you ever lost on a coin toss?” “Everyone is an atheist until Templars begin marching in the rain.” Absinthe makes the heart grow fonder. It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance.—Thomas Sowell "Alinsky works for me now."

04-08-2020, 02:43 PM	#11
HelpDodgers Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 307	Methinks everyone who isn't playing .500 ball should be regulated. __________________

04-09-2020, 09:14 AM	#14
Marleigh All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: UK Posts: 541	There are currently 9 silver leagues, that will result in 144 teams in gold, presumably 4 full leagues and a 24, which will result in 80 teams in diamond if it stays at 16 up 4 down, which seems an awful number, 2 30s and a 20? maybe two smaller leagues and a 30, they could easily cut the number being promoted to bring it to just 60 teams in the first diamond league to make two fairly balanced leagues __________________

04-09-2020, 04:53 PM	#18
MrPibb Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 28	Halfway through the week, I'm 51-42 and I'm a whopping 28 games behind my division leader. Even though I'm in line for a wild card, I'm seriously considering tanking because I'm tired of blown out by guys with a full compliment of 99's and 100's. People keep saying it'll even out, but how am I even in the same league, let alone division with someone who's obviously light years ahead of me. This is my first time playing a OOTB game, and it's really a buzzkill.