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Old 04-02-2020, 10:29 PM   #1
Orion
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What's Going On Here, I Smell...

A big wad of chewing tobacco.

Part of the fun of not running a pay to win team is you have to find guys wherever you can and so after I completed the Royals mission I trot out Saberhagen as my new Black Sox SP. He starts out on fire and I'm looking at his stats and scratching my head. He has the weirdest stats of any SP I've seen...NO ONE has 98 Stamina and he has 6! Hold Runners. From what I would normally think his triple stats are a bunch of MEH, yet he's gone 8-0. Does anyone know of another pitcher with 98 Stamina?
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Old 04-02-2020, 11:50 PM   #2
halfbutt
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Despite his stamina, Saberhagen has been rocked and not got out of the second or third inning for me multiple times. 1.2, 2.1, 2.2... and then he'll go 8.1.

Just when I'm about to give up on him, he'll have a stellar outing.
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Old 04-03-2020, 04:08 AM   #3
Lemandria
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He's a control pitcher that needs an outstanding defense to thrive.

Think Maddux, if Maddux had a pre-CY card that wasn't fan service.

Mussina's a decent comp, too.
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Old 04-04-2020, 02:52 PM   #4
eldur00
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That card is pure trash. You must have an incredible defense playing behind it to be 8-0 with it. Sample size is small, but both of those cards in my league right now project to be 20 losses players, and my league has only one whale in it so they are just not able to pull their weight against similar competition.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:41 PM   #5
halfbutt
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That card is pure trash. You must have an incredible defense playing behind it to be 8-0 with it. Sample size is small, but both of those cards in my league right now project to be 20 losses players, and my league has only one whale in it so they are just not able to pull their weight against similar competition.
Before I pulled the plug on him and sent him down, he was 3-13 with an ERA of 5.97 and a WHIP of 1.55. Now true, my team is not good defensively, but we (used to at least) score a lot of runs.

On three occasions, he was shelled early and gave up 6 or 7 runs in 1.2 IP or 2.1 IP.
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Old 04-05-2020, 10:05 AM   #6
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That card is pure trash. You must have an incredible defense playing behind it to be 8-0 with it. Sample size is small, but both of those cards in my league right now project to be 20 losses players, and my league has only one whale in it so they are just not able to pull their weight against similar competition.
Picked him up down the stretch run and in six starts he went 3-0 with a 1.02 WHIP, 1.74 ERA and 224 ERA+

On the downside, cause for concern over a whole season was a 2.4 K/BB ratio and a FIP that was north of 4.5

Still, like you said, small sample size. We'll see what happens next year in Iron. Missed the playoffs by one game but it wasn't Sabes's fault.
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Old 04-05-2020, 04:21 PM   #7
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11-2 with a 1.34 ERA. Yep, Saberhagen is simply awful. That last game was a Maddux, by the way.

Now I'll grant you—the LPPirates are a fully defensive team, and it is absolutely a pitcher's park. We're built to make pitchers look good.

But even a full season of innings is often not enough to judge a pitcher on, let alone a partial one. Don't be hasty to cut someone before you explain fully why he's stanking like dead fish.

Now, next season I may be joining the rousing chorus of complaints, or maybe he'll be gone by then (he is my #5). That card's not without flaws, for sure. The guy pitched in Kauffman Stadium!
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Old 04-06-2020, 01:32 PM   #8
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Yeah, I'm convinced that a lot of the misery I've been experiencing with Saberhagen, and in fact the rest of my pitching staff, is more due to the ten teams in my league that won over 100 games in my league.

I'm going to give Saberhagen and Terry Mulholland some more innings this year now that those whales have moved up, and hopefully will get some more objective data.
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Old 04-06-2020, 01:33 PM   #9
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It's almost like, it pays to actually have a strategy and use cards that fit well together! You gotta get outs one way or another - if you can't strike 'em out, you get the outs on the field. So low-STUFF pitchers are naturally complemented by an elite defense. This is just basic baseball 101 stuff...c'mon y'all
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Old 04-06-2020, 05:59 PM   #10
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One thing everyone seems to be overlooking is that, despite being a collection reward, he is still only an 80.
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Old 04-07-2020, 04:28 PM   #11
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He has struggled this year vs good hitters but yeah, expected. I am still thinking this could be a great card for gold/cap tourneys.
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Old 04-08-2020, 07:56 AM   #12
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Now I'll grant you—the LPPirates are a fully defensive team...

Steve Goodman, IIRC?

https://youtu.be/dF3q7o8Yjrg
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Old 04-08-2020, 11:09 AM   #13
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yup
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Old 04-09-2020, 11:17 AM   #14
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And on the subject, Saberhagen is 9-4, 3.46 ERA, 3.61 FIP, and 2.7 WAR in 18 starts for me this season.
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Old 04-10-2020, 08:29 AM   #15
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Saberhagen update: 11-7, 4.49 ERA. 4.59 FIP. 1.4 WAR. Has been my 4th starter for most of the year but moved him down to #5.
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Old 04-10-2020, 10:23 AM   #16
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My Saberhagen is my 5th starter. Currently 8-1, 4.16 ERA , 4.45 FIP, 1.4 WAR. My IF defense is very good. My OF defense is crap.
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Old 04-14-2020, 10:10 PM   #17
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Saberhagen update - this season, his W-L record (2-5) belies his stats, which are actually better than last season when he went 16-11. His ERA is 3.71, ERA+ is 114 and his K/BB is 3.1 (usually hovers around 2.5).

Oh yeah - he threw the first no-hitter in Secret Harbour Pirates history in his last start!
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Old 04-15-2020, 06:01 AM   #18
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Does anyone know of another pitcher with 98 Stamina?
Here you go!

Caldwell, 100 stamina
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