RBI awarded on error

[joefromchicago]

Situation: bases loaded, two outs. Eddie Collins hits a grounder to the shortstop who throws to the second baseman for the forceout. Second baseman drops the throw for an error and the runner on third scores the game-winning run. Here's the game recap:



As it says, Collins is credited with "driving in 1 run." I double-checked the box score and it's clear: Collins received an RBI for that error.

There are a few unusual circumstances in which a batter can get an RBI even though the fielder commits an error. This isn't one of them. This seems like a pretty easy scoring decision to make, but OOTP got it wrong. Is this something that other people have encountered? Could it be that the problem here is that the error came on the last play of the game, which made it difficult for the AI to recreate the inning without the error?

[One Great Matrix]

I know I didn't know about all the rules, so didn't say anything... I know that a double play cannot be assumed but I wasn't sure about 2 outs and an error on a potential fielder's choice. Lou Gehrig tapped one torward the 2nd baseman, the 2nd baseman mishandled the throw and over threw the first base bag (could have went to 2nd to end the inning) but overthrew 1st which allowed 2 runs to score (from 2nd and 3rd). Gehrig received credit for 2 RBI and ended up with a 6 RBI game. The play was in the game recap that Gehrig drove in 2 runs when the 2nd baseman committed an error, much like what you posted.

I know there are disparities between total runs on a team and total RBI so they must have some of it accounted for. I wasn't sure if I was unaware of a rule in that particular instance but I don't think the game is crediting a player with an RBI on every reached on error. Could be a glitch?

[BIG17EASY]

Definitely shouldn't be an RBI. It's actually very easy to determine if an RBI should be credited on an error. All you have to do is ask, if the error hadn't occurred, would the run have scored? If the answer is yes, then the batter gets an RBI. If the answer is no, there's no RBI. In this instance, if there's no error, the inning ends and the run doesn't score.

[joefromchicago]

Originally Posted by BIG17EASY

Definitely shouldn't be an RBI. It's actually very easy to determine if an RBI should be credited on an error. All you have to do is ask, if the error hadn't occurred, would the run have scored? If the answer is yes, then the batter gets an RBI. If the answer is no, there's no RBI. In this instance, if there's no error, the inning ends and the run doesn't score.

That's why this situation is so mystifying. OOTP usually scores RBIs correctly, even in complicated cases, but this one is so easy and yet the game totally boots it. As I mentioned above, I can only guess that the problem lies in the fact that the error ended the inning, so the AI couldn't reconstruct a full three-out inning to determine if the run was earned or not.

[Matt Arnold]

Checking the game logic, there shouldn't be an RBI here. If you want to post the full boxscore and game log, maybe can trace through a little more to see what might have happened.

If you have the PBP, that would be even better to maybe figure out exactly what "type" of error happened on the play. We do go through some different logic if it's a throwing error or a catching error, so possibly could be missing a case somewhere.

[joefromchicago]

Thanks for looking into this, Matt. Here's the game log:



The Sox scored six runs in the game and the team had six RBIs. Eddie Collins had a two-run double in the seventh. The only other time he reached base was in the bottom of the thirteenth when he hit into the error that scored Shano Collins. Here's the Sox box:



Curiously, the box score says that Collins had two two-out RBIs. Those were probably the RBIs he got in the seventh inning, which came with two outs. So on one hand, the game gives Collins an RBI for a two-out error in the thirteenth, but doesn't acknowledge it as a two-out RBI in the game summary. Curiouser and curiouser.

Oh, and I think I found another mistake that occurred in the same game. In the fourth inning, with one out, Felsch gets on base due to an error. The next batter, Jackson, strikes out but the catcher drops the ball and the out is recorded as a 2-3 putout at first. I presume Felsch was on first at the time (it's not clear from the game log), but if that was the case then the dropped-third strike rule shouldn't have been in effect, as first base was occupied with less than two outs. Here's the game log for that inning:

[Matt Arnold]

Awesome, exactly what I needed. Found it