NFL 2019 Thread

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

It’s impossible to say who the best was in any sport, the NFL as changed in the last 5 years let alone from when Jim Brown played. Players who played say 20 years ago specially on the defensive side of the ball would have to reinvent themselves. It’s like I watched a quiz show the other day, 2 ex football (soccer) players were on who played in the late 80s early 90s they’d never had made it now infact they’d have been amateurs at best.

You could just as easily say its impossible to make power rankings for right now because there's no way to predict what will happen in future games. The point is it's fun to try, just like for GOAT lists.

[thehef]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

The problem is what is the standard for clear and blatant? That changes from person to person. That's why you don't go down that slope. If you are going to use replay, then you have to go by the letter of the law IMO. That's why replay shouldn't be used on judgement calls.

1. If the league is going to include pass interference as a reviewable call on the basis of the example in last year's NFC championship game - that it, arguably, was blatant and changed the outcome of the game - why not also include anything else that changes the outcome of the game? Last night's two calls were unquestionably incorrect, and very likely changed the outcome of the game...

That said...

2. The current PI review rule is administered extremely poorly. The standard seems to be some sort of nebulous "blatant and obvious" standard. With most decisions as to whether to throw the red flag or not, a coach typically uses the logic of meeting one of the three criteria: a) it's an obvious overturn, b) it's not clear but it is crucial, or c) it's a longshot but we are in a position where we have nothing to lose by trying. With the way PI is administered, however, "a" - the main reason for reply in the first place - is out the window because there is no real standard...

[ukhotstove]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

You could just as easily say its impossible to make power rankings for right now because there's no way to predict what will happen in future games. The point is it's fun to try, just like for GOAT lists.

I think the power rankings are a bit different, I agree it's fun to discuss who is the greatest but we mostly go off what others tell us. Apart from videos I bet most of us never saw Sweetness play, I can give good odds that 90% if not more never saw Jim Brown play. I always go of who made the hairs on my neck stand up, Brady as great as he is bores me, the ones that did were Marino, Taylor, Payton and most of all Barry Sanders.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Hrycaj

As a Lion's fan it is easy to blame the officiating. The problem is, even though I agree with LOW in his assessment of the officiating, the Lions just do not do enough to close out games. They are just not there. They are that organization that is playing against themselves and always have an excuse as to why they were close but not there.

With that said this officiating fiasco is the leagues fault. They for some reason have made officials part of the game in a bad way. Gene Staratore??? Index card guy? He is going to break down officials for me? I liked it better when they did their job and we didn't know who they were. Maybe it started with Ed Hochuli all those years ago. Perhaps the league should have sent him a memo going "Ed, wear a shirt that fits. Nobody is paying to see you officiate." ��

Agreed just about 100%. But I just wanted to point out one thing. He's not the first to use that method of seeing a first down. The exact same thing was used in an Eagles game I believe 20-25 years ago. I remember it clearly as I think they didn't make it and all the talk was about it being a game of inches. I'm surprised it was never brought up.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Boomcoach

Sanders reminded me of Eric Dickerson (in effect, not in style). He was a joy to watch, especially since I wasn't going to care a lot if the Lions lost. But he was almost like a passing game. You had to put up with the in-completions (1 or 2 yard gains in his case) hoping to get some big yardage occasionally. I want a running back that I know will almost always give me 3 or 4 yards, I have a passing game for the nothing or big gain part of the game!

Eric Dickerson was amazing to watch. All the great running backs were. That's why I don't put much stock in who's the best. They were great backs and all had mitigating circumstances that either helped or hindered them.

I only say Emmitt because he holds the rushing title. Lets put it this way. I consider Sanders and Emmitt one and two. Don't care what order. Sanders had that one flaw, and Emmitt had the way better team and offensive line. Barry also retired early. Had he kept playing no one would ever touch his total yards gained.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

Joe Montana - I know people will freak seeing I don't have him in my top 10. But QB's get too much credit for a team's SB wins. Montana was good. His name itself was cool. But he also had Jerry Rice. And go back and look at the staffs that Bill Walsh had. I don't deny his ability. But I think his legendary status is a product of fortunate timing and not as much due to his ability.

Same with Terry Bradshaw. Don't get me wrong, they were top of the line players. But Terry was throwing to two hall of fame WRs and handing off to a hall of fame RB. While Joe was throwing to Rice and John Taylor? He was probably top 3 WR in the league. Montana had the pieces around him.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Same with Terry Bradshaw. Don't get me wrong, they were top of the line players. But Terry was throwing to two hall of fame WRs and handing off to a hall of fame RB. While Joe was throwing to Rice and John Taylor? He was probably top 3 WR in the league. Montana had the pieces around him.

Yeah, the Steel Curtain players IDK how to rank them. On one side you have Bradshaw, Harris, Blier, Swann, Stallworth, Webster. On the other side, Greene, Greenwood, Lambert, Ham, Blount and Shell. How can you gauge where the individual skill begins and the team talent ends?

[Cobra Mgr]

Jalen Ramsey sent to the Rams for 2 1st rounders a 4th.

[monkeyman576]

Rams probably get better because of this, but I'm not sure it gets them past the Seahawks or 49ers. They would have been better off keeping their picks.

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Same with Terry Bradshaw. Don't get me wrong, they were top of the line players. But Terry was throwing to two hall of fame WRs and handing off to a hall of fame RB. While Joe was throwing to Rice and John Taylor? He was probably top 3 WR in the league. Montana had the pieces around him.

Top 20 WRs in yards for 1988, doesn't look like he had the top 3 WRs in the league to me.

courtesy https://www.pro-football-reference.c...iving::rec_yds


Rk Player Tm Age Pos G GS Rec Yds
▼ Y/R TD Lng Y/Tgt R/G Y/G Fmb
1 Henry Ellard*+ RAM 27 WR 16 15 86 1414 16.4 10 68 5.4 88.4 3
2 Jerry Rice*+ SFO 26 WR 16 16 64 1306 20.4 9 96 4.0 81.6 2
3 Eddie Brown* CIN 26 WR 16 16 53 1273 24.0 9 86 3.3 79.6 1
4 Anthony Carter* MIN 28 WR 16 16 72 1225 17.0 6 67 4.5 76.6 1
5 Ricky Sanders WAS 28 wr 16 4 73 1148 15.7 12 55 4.6 71.8 0
6 Drew Hill* HOU 32 WR 16 16 72 1141 15.8 10 57 4.5 71.3 0
7 Mark Clayton* MIA 27 WR 16 16 86 1129 13.1 14 45 5.4 70.6 0
8 Roy Green PHO 31 WR 16 16 68 1097 16.1 7 52 4.3 68.6 0
9 Eric Martin* NOR 27 WR 16 16 85 1083 12.7 7 40 5.3 67.7 2
10 Al Toon* NYJ 25 WR 15 15 93 1067 11.5 5 42 6.2 71.1 2
11 Bruce Hill TAM 24 WR 14 14 58 1040 17.9 9 42 4.1 74.3 2
12 Lionel Manuel NYG 26 WR 16 16 65 1029 15.8 4 46 4.1 64.3 1
13 J.T. Smith* PHO 33 WR 16 16 83 986 11.9 5 29 5.2 61.6 4
14 Ernest Givins HOU 24 WR 16 16 60 976 16.3 5 46 3.8 61.0 1
15 Louis Lipps PIT 26 WR 16 16 50 973 19.5 5 89 3.1 60.8 2
16 Mark Carrier TAM 23 WR 16 16 57 970 17.0 5 59 3.6 60.6 2
17 Andre Reed* BUF 24 WR 15 14 71 968 13.6 6 65 4.7 64.5 1
18 Art Monk WAS 31 WR 16 13 72 946 13.1 5 46 4.5 59.1 0
19 Stephone Paige KAN 27 WR 16 16 61 902 14.8 7 49 3.8 56.4 2
20 Vance Johnson DEN 25 WR 16 13 68 896 13.2 5 86 4.3 56.0 0

[Cobra Mgr]

The DeAndre Hopkins background story.

It's so sad parents force their children to grow up in such a manner. Much respect for the man he appears to have become.

[monkeyman576]

Week 1: 6-7 Week 2: 7-9 Week 3: 11-4 Week 4: 8-7 Week 5: 7-8 Week 6: 8-6 Total: 47-41

Week 6

NYG @ NE(-16.5) Pick: NE won

CAR(-2) @ TB Pick: TB loss

CIN @ BAL(-11) Pick: BAL loss

SEA(-1) @ CLE Pick: SEA won

NO @ JAX(-1.5) Pick: NO won

HOU @ KC(-5) Pick: KC loss

WAS(-3.5) @ MIA - Pick: MIA won

PHI @ MIN(-3) - Pick: MIN won

ATL(-2.5) @ ARI - PICK: ATL loss

SF @ LAR(-3.5) Pick: SF won

TEN @ DEN(-2.5) Pick: DEN won

DAL(-7) @ NYJ Pick: DAL loss

PIT @ LAC(-6.5) Pick: PIT won

DET @ GB(-4.5) PICK: GB loss

Week 7
KC(-3) @ DEN Pick: KC
LAR(-3) @ ATL Pick: LAR
MIA@BUF(-17) Pick: MIA
JAX(-4)@CIN Pick: JAX
MIN(-1)@DET Pick: MIN
OAK@GB(-4.5) Pick: GB
HOU@IND(-1) Pick: HOU
ARI@NYG(-3) Pick: ARI
SF(-10)@WAS Pick: SF
LAC@TEN(-2) Pick: LAC
NO@CHI(-3.5) Pick: NO
BAL@SEA(-3.5) Pick: SEA
PHI@DAL(-3) Pick: PHI
NE(-10)@NYJ Pick: NE

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

Yeah, the Steel Curtain players IDK how to rank them. On one side you have Bradshaw, Harris, Blier, Swann, Stallworth, Webster. On the other side, Greene, Greenwood, Lambert, Ham, Blount and Shell. How can you gauge where the individual skill begins and the team talent ends?

You can't. I used to run a 4.3 40 so I loved to play football, obviously. There were games where I scored 8 TDs!!! and other games where I was completely shut down. It all had to do with the talent around me. Football is the ultimate team sport.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

Top 20 WRs in yards for 1988, doesn't look like he had the top 3 WRs in the league to me.

That's because he was a #2 WR. He's not going to show up in stats. That doesn't mean he isn't better than WRs with better stats on teams that didn't have Jerry Rice. That's common sense. Of the three biggest lies, what's one of them? Statistics. If you watched the 49ers back in the day you can see how good John Taylor was. He was a slant away from a 90+ yard TD at any given moment. Did so twice one game against the Rams.

[Cobra Mgr]

Next stop, Canton?

[Cobra Mgr]

Next time someone complains about players keeping their word.....

[thehef]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

Next time someone complains about players keeping their word.....

Nah. Players routinely go back on their word by not honoring their contract (i.e., "hold out"). Players have the option, no matter how unethical it may seem to some, to say, "I'm worth more than my contract so I'm not playing until you pay me more." Owners, however, have no such option when the players is under-performing in regards to their contract.

As far as this specific case, Demaryius Thomas, what's the big deal? He was formerly a star-level receiver and now seems to have declined to somewhere in the "average" range. No real history with New England, and got traded to the Jets. While I can understand the frustration of going from the Patriots (Super Bowl favorite) to the Jets ('nuff said), it's a business and NE did nothing wrong, specifically ethically, from my perspective. And it appears he's still a starting wide receiver in the NFL.

"It was disrespectful to me," he told the newspaper. "Like, you know, you could trust me and I could trust you. You told me when you cut me at the [final] cut, sit around, you'll bring me back. And I stayed. I could have easily become a Jet once I got cut. ... I could have been here the next day after I got released. But I chose to stay."

And then circumstances changed. Seems like little more than an inconvenience to me...

Different sport, but Al Horford had every intention of staying with the Celtics, and the C's were counting on him coming back. But circumstances changed (namely, Big Al realized the Sixers and other teams were offering more money), so out the door he went...

At any rate, I find that there are few things more odious than the professional athlete who feels "disrespected" and decides to let us know about it.

[Cobra Mgr]

With Mahomes out with a dislocated knee, do you think there is any way there is a team in the AFC who will prevent New England from reaching the SB?

[ukhotstove]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

With Mahomes out with a dislocated knee, do you think there is any way there is a team in the AFC who will prevent New England from reaching the SB?

I wasn't sold on the Chiefs beforehand, their D clicked into gear last night have to see if that continues. The play offs can be weird though, anything can happen. Not seen Houston to see if their any good but of the teams I have in one off games maybe Buffalo, Kansas City and Baltimore however unless the wheels fall off New England will have home field advantage. Short answer no

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

I wasn't sold on the Chiefs beforehand, their D clicked into gear last night have to see if that continues. The play offs can be weird though, anything can happen. Not seen Houston to see if their any good but of the teams I have in one off games maybe Buffalo, Kansas City and Baltimore however unless the wheels fall off New England will have home field advantage. Short answer no

Mahomes should be back for the playoffs, but I'm not sure they were a serious contender anyways. I think the Vikings Saints 49ers and Seahawks have a shot at being competitive in the NFC.