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Old 03-23-2019, 10:24 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by acclaim99 View Post
Sorry guys, I didn't mean to post that here. I didn't want to ruin the mood, my mind gets a little out of it right now.

But thank you for those who did make a comment, and for the one that private msgd me. Means a lot.

Sorry. Really bad spot to post that. I feel like an ass.
Fixed.
Nothing to be sorry for. Get well my friend
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Old 03-23-2019, 10:46 AM   #62
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I will mention this for every version until proper time is spent on getting it:

I want to see the opposition team's bullpen in action when playing out my games. Lets get this very important realistic MLB feature in the game please. Tired of hearing that it's complicated, get it done already.

It is still the best game on the market!
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Old 03-23-2019, 10:47 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acclaim99 View Post
Sorry guys, I didn't mean to post that here. I didn't want to ruin the mood, my mind gets a little out of it right now.

But thank you for those who did make a comment, and for the one that private msgd me. Means a lot.

Sorry. Really bad spot to post that. I feel like an ass.
Fixed.
No need to be sorry, you made an excellent point. Sending you well-wishes and hope you get better soon.

Charlie
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Old 03-23-2019, 11:19 AM   #64
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This is from a post I made on another board and also in the first impression thread.



This isn't posted to directly counter the OP, he did make many valid points. However, each of his valid points, if fixed, would come at a cost in programming time. IE which AI fixes that did get in would you or he want left out to fix his issues? Do people here really think these AI changes were just tiny tweaks and easy to do?

How is it different than any year? That is, my pet peeve\issue didn't get in. I'm disappointed. I give the OP a lot of credit as he didn't whine and say "I'll never buy OOTP again it sucks". Instead he noted he still loved the game. Well written critique from his perspective.

What tires me is the "lets blame PT". How many ways do they have to say it is a separate coding team that doesn't impact vXX? Markus has said he does very little coding but instead supervises the whole of OOTP Dev. Is there a reason we shouldn't believe him? Maybe it's because I've been here for 17 years that I trust what he says until he gives me reason not too.

As for me, every year I am slightly disappointed that something I want didn't get in the game. Those go in the suggestion forum for next year, I explore the new game and enjoy finding the little unmentioned things that got in, and am happy for those that got their pet feature included though it
has no impact on how I play.

Same thing, different year.
The "Blame PT" crowd is really tiring. It's just people throwing things around without actually knowing how things work. It's a good promotional tool for the game, because really, making this type of game appealing to the masses is always going to be a tough challenge, PT is a good way to get more exposure. I highly doubt I will ever touch it, but if it gets more people playing OOTP that's a positive. But blaming PT for everything is a really lazy argument when those people do not know how OOTPD allocates development resources. PT's success is good for all OOTP players, as far as i'm concerned.

And for those crying about "lack of features", it's already been confirmed that there will be a big "back of the box feature" in the future with a ballpark creator, they just couldnt get it into this edition.

Even if the game doesnt get a flashy update, as long as i am a baseball fan I will keep buying because this game provides me days upon days of entertainment each year for only 35 bucks. I'm a happy customer.
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Old 03-23-2019, 11:32 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn View Post
Sorry guys, closing this thread was bad judgement on my part I have re-opened it and merged the other one here.

The initial idea was to close it because I did not want it to become a fight between people who may be a bit disappointed and other who see the exact opposite. But I guess I could have waited longer. I apologize
And this^^^ is why Markus and OOTP are the best game developers out there bar none. They truly care about the OOTP users/customers. With many game developers, it's all about the bottom line $$$$$ over customers.

I was fortunate to attend a OOTP networking event in NYC years ago where I got the chance to meet the OOTP crew. Some of the nicest people ever!!!

OOTP is managing both without compromising their core values. Keep up the good work Markus!!!

OOTP20 has been awesome so far for me!
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Old 03-23-2019, 11:54 AM   #66
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He is likely right though...there is a high percentage that it's only a matter of time before the thread must get locked. Hopefully not and everyone remains civil. I was up until 2am playing OOTP and now i'm quite tired.
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:16 PM   #67
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My only minor criticism about 20 is I wish there had been a few more cosmetic changes.

Don't get me wrong - 19 was probably the best looking interface to date. It's just that I want to FEEL like I'm playing a new game if that makes sense. When I open 20, it feels a lot like 19.

Also - re: Perfect Team. I like PT and I enjoy playing it. However, it's a perfectly valid criticism to say that PT development has taken away from time developing the core game. We know OOTP has a small dev team, so any time devoted to PT takes away from other things. That's just common sense.

All that said - OOTP 20 is great. It's always great. I will play it a stupid amount for the next year until 21 comes out, which I will play a stupid amount until 22 comes out, etc, etc, etc...
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:17 PM   #68
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Hopefully the money I spent on this years game will go towards the development of a pro basketball game.

I still think this(OOTP20) is the best sports game available but not everyone play's the game the same way.
Football Manager is the best sports game available year in and year out. I first purchased it about 5 years ago when I hated soccer but wanted a good sports sim. The game itself made me fall in love with the sport. Even if you don't like soccer, you need to purchase that game so that you can see what a real sports sim should be like. Don't get me wrong, OOTP is great and I love baseball. However, I wish developers modeled the game around FM.

With that said, looking forward to playing OOTP 20
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:25 PM   #69
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Football Manager is the best sports game available year in and year out. I first purchased it about 5 years ago when I hated soccer but wanted a good sports sim. The game itself made me fall in love with the sport. Even if you don't like soccer, you need to purchase that game so that you can see what a real sports sim should be like. Don't get me wrong, OOTP is great and I love baseball. However, I wish developers modeled the game around FM.

With that said, looking forward to playing OOTP 20
Give me SI's budget and we can talk FM outsells OOTP 20:1, so there is no way we can ever compete with that. Yet, comparing the games with one another makes the gap look much smaller, and we're proud of that...
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:36 PM   #70
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Give me SI's budget and we can talk FM outsells OOTP 20:1, so there is no way we can ever compete with that. Yet, comparing the games with one another makes the gap look much smaller, and we're proud of that...
Oh no doubt! I agree with everything you said and completely aware. Not trying to compare them like that. I purchase both OOTP and FM every year for the past 6 or so years. Love and enjoy both. The only thing I wish OOTP baseball had that FM had was the scouting system, the way FM develops their players, their ratings (current ability and potential), not a fan of the "dynamic" rating in OOTP. In FM a players potential is set. It doesn't change, but it doesn't mean he reaches that point - theres a lot of variables at play. With OOTP baseball, I've followed player progressions from the commission mode and it is just all over the place day by day. Potential doesn't and shouldn't change - perceived potential (scouting) changes though, but under the hood it shouldn't. It is all about how close you get to your potential. FM's and OOTP's rating and development system are both great but I love FM's so much more and as a bigger baseball fan and soccer, I just wish OOTPs rating and scouting system followed FM's.
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Old 03-23-2019, 01:52 PM   #71
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Will OOTP ever attempt to make a soccer game because there is already a good one out there already?
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Old 03-23-2019, 03:03 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by CorinthiansIII View Post
My only minor criticism about 20 is I wish there had been a few more cosmetic changes.

Don't get me wrong - 19 was probably the best looking interface to date. It's just that I want to FEEL like I'm playing a new game if that makes sense. When I open 20, it feels a lot like 19.

Also - re: Perfect Team. I like PT and I enjoy playing it. However, it's a perfectly valid criticism to say that PT development has taken away from time developing the core game. We know OOTP has a small dev team, so any time devoted to PT takes away from other things. That's just common sense.

All that said - OOTP 20 is great. It's always great. I will play it a stupid amount for the next year until 21 comes out, which I will play a stupid amount until 22 comes out, etc, etc, etc...
Agreed about PT. Look what has happened to the Show. So much work on Diamond Dynasty and Franchise players hardly see any improvement year after year. Same with FIFA.

I mean they go where the money is and its in F2P modes. I don't begrudge them for wanting to make money, its just not something i'm interested in. It's not what i'm looking for in OOTP. I tried PT but i couldn't spend $$ on it and didn't want to wait forever to get enough points to get a good player.
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Old 03-23-2019, 03:20 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by Qrusher14242 View Post
Agreed about PT. Look what has happened to the Show. So much work on Diamond Dynasty and Franchise players hardly see any improvement year after year. Same with FIFA.

I mean they go where the money is and its in F2P modes. I don't begrudge them for wanting to make money, its just not something i'm interested in. It's not what i'm looking for in OOTP. I tried PT but i couldn't spend $$ on it and didn't want to wait forever to get enough points to get a good player.
As one of the disenchanted MLB The Show franchise mode players you speak of--who will probably not purchase that game for a 2nd straight year after being a hardcore roster editor for quite some time--I feel this comparison isn't necessarily applicable.

In direct contrast to Sony's game that I feel stopped producing any features geared toward me about 2.5 years ago, I feel that OOTP is still churning out features and details that speak to my interests. Despite PT being the 800-pound gorilla in the room, I am quite happy with the feature set we got for the main game this year.

Even though PT is a thing now and will be a thing in the future, I don't think each development studio can be expected to react in exactly the same way. In other words, even though $$$ is a powerful motivator, just because The Show has approached things one way doesn't mean OOTP will follow the exact same footsteps.

As for PT itself, I had been dead set against ultimate team modes for exactly the reasons/superstitions you described. But, I tried PT in the past few weeks to bridge the gap between 19 and 20, and I have to say it's a lot of fun. I haven't spent a dime on it and don't plan to, but it can be fun to have going on in the background while you play/work on your main save. I don't feel like my level of fun with PT is directly tied to whether I can dominate at the highest levels of competition or not so I don't feel compelled to spend or left out when I don't.
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Old 03-23-2019, 03:34 PM   #74
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I see why Markus did it, but these guys listen. At the end of the day. You make the game your universe anyways, so just live in it and trust this team will listen to things that make game better
Exactly. I've been playing this game almost since the beginning--version 2 or 3 if I remember right--and Markus didn't know me from Adam, but when I suggested that he add individual player strategies instead of just having one team strategy, he did exactly that. I doubt I was the only one who made the suggestion, but I was pleasantly surprised when it was included in a future version. Since then we've become friends and colleagues, and I'm amazed how far the game has come over the years.

And talk about first impressions, the first thing I did out of the gate was replay the 1967 season and the American League race came down to the last game of the year, which Boston won to claim the pennant. I was floored and hooked immediately.

That said, I haven't played 20 yet but will soon and will reserve judgment until then.
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Old 03-23-2019, 04:08 PM   #75
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Pros and cons

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Originally Posted by CorinthiansIII View Post
My only minor criticism about 20 is I wish there had been a few more cosmetic changes.

Don't get me wrong - 19 was probably the best looking interface to date. It's just that I want to FEEL like I'm playing a new game if that makes sense. When I open 20, it feels a lot like 19.

Also - re: Perfect Team. I like PT and I enjoy playing it. However, it's a perfectly valid criticism to say that PT development has taken away from time developing the core game. We know OOTP has a small dev team, so any time devoted to PT takes away from other things. That's just common sense.

All that said - OOTP 20 is great. It's always great. I will play it a stupid amount for the next year until 21 comes out, which I will play a stupid amount until 22 comes out, etc, etc, etc...
I agree on the overall look and interface of OOTP20. It does look and feel a lot like 19, and that was a tiny disappointment. But then I ask myself, what more can OOTP do at this point? After 20 years of design and interface improvements, they've nailed it.

Instead of giving us the illusion of more, OOTP actually delivered more over versions 19 and 20.

Perfect Team is brilliant. It's a game-changer for OOTP, both literally and figuratively. I would not be surprised if OOTP earns more money PER WEEK (on average) from PT than it did from annual launches before PT. Also, PT is truly something new. It's not an incremental change; it's a whole new game inside OOTP.

I still love regular OOTP, but I can't blame Markus and the team for their excitement and focus (for now) on making PT the best it can be. It's not just because of the extra revenue it brings in, but the gust of creative fresh air it must have brought to OOTP when it was conceived and went into development.

I have my wishlist for things I'd like to see. I'd be delighted to see actual historical stadiums rendered in 3D for the eras games are played in, instead of that generic stadium I usually get outside of Yankee Stadium, Fenway Park, Chavez Ravine and Wrigley Field.

And the "no way ... NO WAY ... nooo way!" shouter needs to go, I think, or at least be replaced by something new.

But these are minor things. I can't believe a game this complex and complete exists and this is all I can complain about.
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Old 03-23-2019, 04:17 PM   #76
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I bought the damned game because I do support OOTP and love it. But don't confuse that for being happy with this version. It's underwhelming and a lot of people feel that way when you step outside of this forum bubble.

That's okay. OOTP has built up some customer loyalty from me. If we get a similar upgrade next year you will start to hear more grumbling.
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Old 03-23-2019, 06:06 PM   #77
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Also - re: Perfect Team. I like PT and I enjoy playing it. However, it's a perfectly valid criticism to say that PT development has taken away from time developing the core game. We know OOTP has a small dev team, so any time devoted to PT takes away from other things. That's just common sense.
The following is quoted, as you can see, from Markus. Bold added by me. Seems either you are wrong or Markus is a liar. I'll ask again, is there a reason we shouldn't believe Markus?

Quote:
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The team developing PT does not work on the core OOTP game, the only shared resource is basically myself and Daniel (our lead graphic designer), and I do not do much coding nowadays anyway (it's 70% project management and other CEO duties, which kind of sucks, lol).
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Old 03-23-2019, 06:56 PM   #78
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The following is quoted, as you can see, from Markus. Bold added by me. Seems either you are wrong or Markus is a liar. I'll ask again, is there a reason we shouldn't believe Markus?
I don't think I'm wrong. I don't think Markus is a liar.

The Markus quote you referenced was in response to a question about if Perfect Team would replace the core OOTP game. He said no and that the team working on PT and team working on OOTP were separate.

My point is this: Markus has 'X' amount of money and resources to put toward the things he sees fit as a business owner. He's chosen to put a portion toward developing PT. He's chosen to put a portion toward OOTP.

I totally understand that. In fact, I'm hopeful that PT will open revenue streams, Markus and his team get filthy rich and that the extra money will make the core OOTP game even better!
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Old 03-23-2019, 07:00 PM   #79
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If they're spending resources on PT, that's resources not spent on OOTP itself. It's good for the company in terms of bringing growth, but to those of us with little or no interest in Perfect Team that's not terribly meaningful.

Saying things like "Seems either you are wrong or Markus is a liar" isn't very constructive, regardless.
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Old 03-23-2019, 07:36 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn View Post
Give me SI's budget and we can talk FM outsells OOTP 20:1, so there is no way we can ever compete with that. Yet, comparing the games with one another makes the gap look much smaller, and we're proud of that...
I highly doubt Football Manager is as in depth as OOTP. Do they have real historic players all the way down to the minor leagues? And every stat and rating in relation to that particular player? Never played it so inform me if they do.
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