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Old 12-29-2019, 01:42 PM   #81
Cobra Mgr
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Yes, but CBeisbol made a good point, here or someplace else, that the deal can be viewed as initial success, hopefully years of it, being amortized over the life of the contract.

In other words, say Cole helps them win a championship or two, or at least get close to it, in the next few years. The Yankees are paying for that not only in those years but in the remaining years of Cole's decline.

Thus you cannot just look at the final couple of years of the contract and say "what a waste." The Yankees themselves may be viewing it in this manner.
Isn't that the bot again?
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Old 12-29-2019, 01:44 PM   #82
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Isn't that the bot again?
Yes, and it's sneaking phony links into quotes. I have just sent a report.
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Old 12-29-2019, 08:00 PM   #83
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Yes, but CBeisbol made a good point, here or someplace else, that the deal can be viewed as initial success, hopefully years of it, being amortized over the life of the contract.

In other words, say Cole helps them win a championship or two, or at least get close to it, in the next few years. The Yankees are paying for that not only in those years but in the remaining years of Cole's decline.

Thus you cannot just look at the final couple of years of the contract and say "what a waste." The Yankees themselves may be viewing it in this manner.
The Yankees, almost certainly, are.

The best contact structure for the Yankees would be to pay Cole the minimum over the first 8 years of the contact and then $320ish million in the final season.

Obviously, he wouldn't "earn" the $320 million that year but because money now is better than money later, it'd be advantageous for the Yankees to pay it that way. And unknowledgeable fans would complain about it.

This is why you see teams defer money. Not because the team thinks he's going to earn that money after he's retired or playing somewhere else, of course, but because it's better for teams to give players more money as late as possible. Players, of course, would prefer the opposite - give me $325 million today and I'll play "for free" the next 8 seasons.

So, if a team wants Cole's 5,6 or 7 WAR seasons in the early 2020's, but don't want a nearly $100 million a year competitive balance tax figure, they give them a longer deal and spread out the payments. Of course, you don't have fans taking about how underpaid the player is in the early seasons.

This is all, or largely, because our media is mostly pro owner and anti-labor. There are a lot more stories about "overpaid" athletes in their late 30's than there are about underpaid athletes in their twenties. And those few stories are framed as "which teams are getting the most bang for the buck".

Last edited by CBeisbol; 12-29-2019 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 12-30-2019, 11:23 AM   #84
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Last year they said MLB owners/teams were in league to lower salaries by not signing players early, this season big contracts have been signed early just wondering what peoples takes on it was. Personally I think it was rubbish about owners trying to get players on the cheap.
I didn't think much into it either. With the move toward more analytics I felt teams seen a lot of flaws in the players on the market. Also maybe some were playing it safe for this offseason. For example with Cole becoming a free agent maybe the Yanks thought it was better to play safe till this year. That could be why they didn't go the distance for Corbin.
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Old 02-03-2020, 02:04 PM   #85
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Eugh, Jeremy Jeffress to the Cubs

(Might be more a personal thing )
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Old 02-04-2020, 04:40 PM   #86
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Exclamation Servais must go!!

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I don't mind players getting paid, but that doesn't mean it's best for the team. For me I am happy with the big contracts it will make it easier for the Seattle Mariners to make playoff runs when their prospects mature because it is the more cost effective route.
You forgot to add "and when they get a real big league manager"...Servais must go!!
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Old 02-04-2020, 10:59 PM   #87
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Mookie Betts & David Price to the Dodgers.
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Old 02-04-2020, 11:29 PM   #88
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SS Jose Iglesias to the Orioles, in an effort to add some solid veteran infield D, to assist a struggling rotation on a team in rebuild mode.

Ok, not a blockbuster and happened a few weeks ago, but it is one of those times when OOTP mirrors real life. Or should I say, when real life mirrors my OOTP franchise.

In my 2019 MLB Start last year, I was managing the Orioles as always, and I picked up....SS Jose Iglesias.
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Old 02-04-2020, 11:50 PM   #89
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SS Jose Iglesias to the Orioles, in an effort to add some solid veteran infield D, to assist a struggling rotation on a team in rebuild mode.

.
Here's a silly question: When was the last time the O's weren't in rebuild mode? I honestly can't remember.

EDIT: Wow, just looked it up. They won the division just 6 seasons ago. Seems like a decade since they were good.
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Old 02-05-2020, 12:01 AM   #90
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Best part of this is seeing the Twins moving on from collecting pieces that might help 2-3 years down the line and actually saying let's try and win now
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Old 02-05-2020, 08:44 AM   #91
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Here's a silly question: When was the last time the O's weren't in rebuild mode? I honestly can't remember.

EDIT: Wow, just looked it up. They won the division just 6 seasons ago. Seems like a decade since they were good.
Yeah, that was in the middle of a 5-year stretch where they were mildly competitive. Before that stretch, they hadn't done anything since 1997. So, your recollection is not that far off.
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Old 02-05-2020, 09:56 AM   #92
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Trading a Mookie Betts. Hard to get my head around that one
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Old 02-05-2020, 11:28 AM   #93
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Trading a Mookie Betts. Hard to get my head around that one
I agree. Typically, it is the small and medium market teams that have to deal these guys to the whales. In this one it is a whale in Boston (although they are acting like a minnow it seems) dealing to another whale in LA.

What this did make me think about this morning was about the trade logic in OOTP itself. The games trade logic is probably the most scrutinized part of the game. I am typing this out without having tested it myself (which could torpedo my whole point ) but I don’t think this deal goes through in the game. I also understand we can’t do 3 team deals so that is a part of it, but on its face, I don’t think the “In game” Boston GM is moving Betts and Price for anything close to the real life return. In real life, the non-statistical factors (ownership creating their own cap max, the reality that extending Betts will not happen) are the fuel behind this deal. The Dodgers knowing this, were able to crush this deal. Who did they really give up? Guys they would have to deal to make space for anyway. I’m not sure the games logic is there to replicate such a thing. That isn’t a knock however. What I’m actually trying to say is that the games trade logic may be much better than it gets credit for.
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Old 02-05-2020, 11:55 AM   #94
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I agree. Typically, it is the small and medium market teams that have to deal these guys to the whales. In this one it is a whale in Boston (although they are acting like a minnow it seems) dealing to another whale in LA.

What this did make me think about this morning was about the trade logic in OOTP itself. The games trade logic is probably the most scrutinized part of the game. I am typing this out without having tested it myself (which could torpedo my whole point ) but I don’t think this deal goes through in the game. I also understand we can’t do 3 team deals so that is a part of it, but on its face, I don’t think the “In game” Boston GM is moving Betts and Price for anything close to the real life return. In real life, the non-statistical factors (ownership creating their own cap max, the reality that extending Betts will not happen) are the fuel behind this deal. The Dodgers knowing this, were able to crush this deal. Who did they really give up? Guys they would have to deal to make space for anyway. I’m not sure the games logic is there to replicate such a thing. That isn’t a knock however. What I’m actually trying to say is that the games trade logic may be much better than it gets credit for.
I think that's a really good point, yeah.
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Old 02-05-2020, 01:11 PM   #95
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The cost to move Joc's contract was Hayes & Stripling? Seems a bit of a stretch, but love that move from LAA's end

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Old 02-05-2020, 01:16 PM   #96
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SS Jose Iglesias to the Orioles, in an effort to add some solid veteran infield D, to assist a struggling rotation on a team in rebuild mode.

Ok, not a blockbuster and happened a few weeks ago, but it is one of those times when OOTP mirrors real life. Or should I say, when real life mirrors my OOTP franchise.

In my 2019 MLB Start last year, I was managing the Orioles as always, and I picked up....SS Jose Iglesias.
I like the move. Good veteran asset and a possible trade chip come the deadline.
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Old 02-05-2020, 01:36 PM   #97
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Trading a Mookie Betts. Hard to get my head around that one
It is basically unprecented. An excellent list of comparable deals is here:

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2020/2...s-historic-war

My take is that John Henry is trying to become the most ignorant and inept owner in Boston history by making Massholes think the Babe Ruth deal wasn't so bad after all.
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Old 02-06-2020, 01:39 AM   #98
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Trading a Mookie Betts. Hard to get my head around that one
What's hard to understand? Betts has repeatedly told management he was going to become a Fa. It would have been retarded to allow a player of his caliber to walk for a draft pick
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Old 02-06-2020, 01:42 AM   #99
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It is basically unprecented. An excellent list of comparable deals is here:

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2020/2...s-historic-war

My take is that John Henry is trying to become the most ignorant and inept owner in Boston history by making Massholes think the Babe Ruth deal wasn't so bad after all.
Totally disagree... Bloom came out of this on the winning end. Betts wasn't resigning and Price is a shell of himself at this point. Adding two stud prospects and adding financial flexibility is better than having a draft pick compensation for Betts and a 4th starter being paid like an ace.
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Old 02-06-2020, 03:05 AM   #100
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Totally disagree... Bloom came out of this on the winning end. Betts wasn't resigning and Price is a shell of himself at this point. Adding two stud prospects and adding financial flexibility is better than having a draft pick compensation for Betts and a 4th starter being paid like an ace.
People forget to look at this two ways.

Henry, the owner, who has, literally, billions of dollars, and owns two major sports franchises that basically print money for him, didn't give Betts (one of MLB's best players) what Betts wanted to stay (we don't know what Betts wanted, the reported 10 year, $30 million offer was not enough for a player of Betts' caliber). Given the info we have, and some reasonable assumptions, this looks bad for Henry.


Bloom has to operate under Henry's demands. Assuming Henry told Bloom to get under the CBT threshold, Bloom did what he could. The Red Sox lost their best player. That's never good. But they still have a reasonable shot at the playoffs. If they'd tried to cut the same amount of money and keep Betts, they'd probably be in worse shape.

tl;dr: Henry put Bloom in a tough spot
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