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Old 02-03-2020, 09:13 PM   #261
Brad K
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That's an original story. First appearance is here. So no, you did not hear it so long ago you laughed hard enough to fall off your dinosaur.
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Old 02-03-2020, 09:37 PM   #262
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Although it would never happen, I think it would be fascinating if Boston did not hire a manager this season. I feel the current, popular sentiment has been that managers have been essentially neutered in terms of importance. It would be interesting if a club actually put that theory to the test.
Perhaps have the players run the game? The runner on first deciding if he wants to steal and the SP deciding when he needs to come out of the game.
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:00 PM   #263
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Perhaps have the players run the game? The runner on first deciding if he wants to steal and the SP deciding when he needs to come out of the game.

Precedent has already been set.

https://www.mlb.com/cut4/in-1951-bil...dstand-manager
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:02 PM   #264
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Baseball Under Attack

Feb 3 2020
Faux News

Baseball is under attack, an attack more dangerous than the Black Sox Scandal, the Yankees forty year dominance of the AL, Curt Flood's challenge of the reserve clause, juiced baseballs, and the cheating of the Astros and Red Sox. Most fans remain anaware of the insidious creeping attack of the Sabermetric Cult.

It first established itself by sneaking the bogus OPS statistic into the stat tables at Baseball Reference. Then it got broadcasters talking about WAR. However since baseball has not granted official recognition to some of its statistics, the Cult is now acting to influence fans directly.

That knock on your door? That's a couple members of the Sabermetric Cult wanting to talk to you. At first it may seem logical to fans that getting on base matters the most. But this obscures the effect on the offense of bases clogged with runners. Its like having a giant grease hairball in the pipe between third and home that even Super Duper Draino can't clear.

What a team really wants not players who walk but players who hit singles and doubles. These should come alternately to avoid clogging the bases since each hit after the first scores a run. And no home runs except with no one on. Home runs kill rallies.

The members of the Sabermetric Cult knocking on doors isn't easy to spot. They've disguised themselves as canvasing Jehovah's Witnesses. But beware. The baseball mind you save will be your own.
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:05 PM   #265
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Well, letting the fans do it, if it doesn't work they have no one to blame but themselves!!!
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Old 02-05-2020, 01:33 PM   #266
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Pete Rose asks MLB for reinstatement in wake of Astros' cheating scandal punishment
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Old 02-06-2020, 02:14 AM   #267
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Here's an interesting article explaining why its still bad even if Rose only bet on the Reds.

https://thegruelingtruth.com/basebal...reds-let-show/
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Old 02-06-2020, 02:21 AM   #268
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PEDs... well, it wasn't like anything was hidden. It was obvious the guys were in exceptional physical condition and were formidable opponents.

Astros/Bosox cheating... this was hidden. Occasional spectacular events could be attributed to luck.

Rose betting... hidden and unlike the other two presented an opportunity and incentive to lower the teams performance.
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Old 02-06-2020, 05:42 PM   #269
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Here's an interesting article explaining why its still bad even if Rose only bet on the Reds.

https://thegruelingtruth.com/basebal...reds-let-show/
I think the writer is seeing what he wants to see. The Reds finished 6 games out so its not like they were out of the race and Rose could concentrate on his betting. I highly doubt Rose was thinking about which players to keep fresh for games he bet on. A manager has enough to worry about trying to win each game.
Plus Bill Scherrer came in the game against the Braves when the Reds were down 8-4. So why would you put your best relievers in then? Rose probably figured there wasn't much chance of winning that game so he held back for the next game or for an unexpected rally.

I just think the argument is weak. I dont doubt Rose bet on games but i just dont see him adding more strategy to deal with when it doesn't guarantee that those rested players won't have a bad game.
Besides it seems like there would be more than 4 games that he didn't bet on if he was managing the roster according to games he bet on.
I'm not sure about allowing Rose in the hall but that article's arguement just seemed a bit weak to me.
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Old 02-06-2020, 08:57 PM   #270
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If Rose didn't use his position of manager of the Reds to increase his probability of winning bets he's really really stupid.
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Old 02-07-2020, 07:12 PM   #271
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If Rose didn't use his position of manager of the Reds to increase his probability of winning bets he's really really stupid.
You think he's more concerned with winning a few bets than winning a championship or keeping his job?
Sure some strategy might work with the team strategy and he could have benefited from knowing how good his sp stuff was going into a game but you cant let it interfer with the team strategy. I see no indication that he did. You dont finish only 6 games out by making roster moves for your personal needs.
Wouldn't players have suspected he was making moves for himself?
Sorry I just dont see it.
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Old 02-08-2020, 12:24 AM   #272
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https://www.wsj.com/articles/houston...er-11581112994

free summary if you cant read the wsj article:
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/explosi...000636683.html

Last edited by ezpkns34; 02-08-2020 at 12:25 AM.
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Old 02-08-2020, 01:03 AM   #273
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You think he's more concerned with winning a few bets than winning a championship or keeping his job?...
The attitude of the addictive personality is he can have his cake and eat it too.
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Old 02-08-2020, 06:34 AM   #274
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The problem with gambling is it brings the whole game’s integrity into question. One could argue the same for steroids, though that’s more visible cheating from the players to gain a competitive advantage (imo)
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Old 02-08-2020, 07:25 AM   #275
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Hinch on sign-stealing: 'I tolerated too much’

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Old 02-08-2020, 09:18 AM   #276
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The problem with gambling is it brings the whole game’s integrity into question. One could argue the same for steroids, though that’s more visible cheating from the players to gain a competitive advantage (imo)
The best "drop the mic" point I've heard to show why Rose's gambling was 100x's worse for baseball was from a commentator about 10 yrs ago. He said imagine if the Mitchell report was about gambling and not baseball. That every team in the league had someone who bet on the game, not juiced up. What would that mean for MLB? It would have killed the sport. Period.
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Old 02-08-2020, 04:41 PM   #277
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The best "drop the mic" point I've heard to show why Rose's gambling was 100x's worse for baseball was from a commentator about 10 yrs ago. He said imagine if the Mitchell report was about gambling and not baseball. That every team in the league had someone who bet on the game, not juiced up. What would that mean for MLB? It would have killed the sport. Period.
How do we know they don't. How many players come and go each year? Is
reasonable to think Rose was the only player betting on baseball? Seems like thinking the players on the Mitchell report were the only players using steroids.
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Old 02-08-2020, 04:54 PM   #278
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The attitude of the addictive personality is he can have his cake and eat it too.
I dont doubt he would have used some of the information he knew but i dont think it affected his decisions as a manager. Rose wasn't managing based on his bets. He was betting based on his abilities as a manager.
If he started making decisions according to what his betting needs were it may or may not have worked but i just see it as more of a benefit of his baseball ability.
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Old 02-08-2020, 05:21 PM   #279
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How do we know they don't. How many players come and go each year? Is
reasonable to think Rose was the only player betting on baseball? Seems like thinking the players on the Mitchell report were the only players using steroids.
We don't know. However, the point isn't what we don't know. The point is what we do know. 50 known steroid users still doesn't equal one known gambler in the league. Betting on your own team is to the sports world the equivalent to first degree murder in everyday society. In can't be tolerated one iota and must be met with the severest penalty possible.
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Old 02-09-2020, 05:22 PM   #280
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We don't know. However, the point isn't what we don't know. The point is what we do know. 50 known steroid users still doesn't equal one known gambler in the league. Betting on your own team is to the sports world the equivalent to first degree murder in everyday society. In can't be tolerated one iota and must be met with the severest penalty possible.
According to the hall of fame vote it seems both are equal.
My problem with Rose is not that he bet on his own team as i dont doubt that he played to win but another player may be too lazy to win and go for throwing the game. So i dont know if Rose can be forgiven. It could be said that Joe Jackson served his punishment as he was banned for life and is no longer living. But Judge Landis also said none of the eight would ever play professional baseball again. Did that mean he could not be reinstated during his lifetime or forever?
I'm not sure that betting on your team to win is worse than cheating to win. Betting on your team to lose is obviously worse but im not sure on the other two.
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