Junior Age Bug

MXD · 11-05-2018, 07:54 AM

I don't know if it's the right place, but there's something wrong with this player.

Here's Matthew Bareto :

As you see on the picture, he's born in January '04 : in other words, he just played his "19 years old" season. But as you can you can also see, he's considered a 20 year old in his "career" table.

He didn't have the OA tag in the lineup (which is right, as he isn't an overager), but I can't actually offer him a deal for next season, so it appears he's as good as gone, despite being eligible for an OA season.

Where it also gets interesting is :

- He's in Bantam leagues in 18-19 : he should've been too old (by the way the game works...) and in Midget leagues.

- He's in Midget leagues at his "16 years old" season, in 19-20. Which isn't wrong or anything : in the game, you see some players remain in Midget if not signed by the team that drafted them.

- Only... of course, Mr. Baretto wasn't drafted in 18-19, but in 19-20 : no biggie, he isn't a world class talent and you see players that were missed by junior scouts, like, every year. But was Baretto even eligible in 18-19, when he really should't have been eligible? I can't exactly prove it, but I have strong reservations.

- ... Is it possible that he was generated TOO old as a bantam player, which had a ripple effect on everything else?

JeffR · 11-05-2018, 01:32 PM

Can you upload the save? I'd like to have a look at his full history to see what exactly happened there. Even if he'd been somehow created as an 18-year-old bantam, the age restrictions on the midget leagues should've prevented him from going there after his first season. It sounds like there's some kind of issue with his birth year or age being recognized properly.

MXD · 11-05-2018, 07:34 PM

Transferring at the moment. Should be done in 15 minutes. Name's BARETO.

MXD · 11-06-2018, 06:50 AM

.... Okay, I really have to post this...

I noticed my third netminder was born same year and same month, which is january... Was also considered to be on his "20 Years Old" season. I edited his DOB to February, and his age (in career tab) now shows him as a 19 year old. And I can offer him a contract.

I don't really care about my netminders, but it appears players born in January are deemed to be older than they actually are by the game.

JeffR · 11-06-2018, 04:41 PM

Looks like the world.dat file is missing from the zip - among other things the current calendar year is stored in there, so I can't just drop in a placeholder to make it work. Can you zip that file and attach it to a post here? As long as it has the .zip extension, the forum should let you attach it.

MXD · 11-06-2018, 11:30 PM

Done.

JeffR · 11-07-2018, 02:36 AM

Looks like there are a few things going on here:

-for some reason, when you signed Bareto after Niagara released him, it didn't give him the normal junior contract that runs through the end of his overage season; instead, it ends after this year. It most likely won't let you re-sign him because your season is over and you can't add another contract for a 2004-born player for next year, since you already have more overage contracts than you're allowed for next season. So that part is intended, but he shouldn't have wound up in that situation in the first place because his contract should've run to the end of next season, not this one. We'll have to figure out what went wrong there.

-Jory has the same problem, but you can offer him a contract (even without editing his birthdate). I suspect it may have something to do with the timing of the contract you signed with him - he was signed in February, Bareto in September. I'm not sure exactly why that is, though; we'll have to dig into that and see what exactly is going on.

-the age in the Career Stats is being displayed wrong for players with birthdays before July 1, but only in the period between their birthday and the end of the season. That's a separate display bug and should be easy enough to fix.

The simplest workaround is just to manually edit in another contract year for Bareto right now, while we try to figure out what happened and how to fix it.

MXD · 11-07-2018, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffR

Looks like there are a few things going on here:

-for some reason, when you signed Bareto after Niagara released him, it didn't give him the normal junior contract that runs through the end of his overage season; instead, it ends after this year. It most likely won't let you re-sign him because your season is over and you can't add another contract for a 2004-born player for next year, since you already have more overage contracts than you're allowed for next season. So that part is intended, but he shouldn't have wound up in that situation in the first place because his contract should've run to the end of next season, not this one. We'll have to figure out what went wrong there.

-Jory has the same problem, but you can offer him a contract (even without editing his birthdate). I suspect it may have something to do with the timing of the contract you signed with him - he was signed in February, Bareto in September. I'm not sure exactly why that is, though; we'll have to dig into that and see what exactly is going on.

-the age in the Career Stats is being displayed wrong for players with birthdays before July 1, but only in the period between their birthday and the end of the season. That's a separate display bug and should be easy enough to fix.

The simplest workaround is just to manually edit in another contract year for Bareto right now, while we try to figure out what happened and how to fix it.

The problem with this is that I didn't sign any of Bareto or Jory... It's something the AI did.

JeffR · 11-08-2018, 12:01 PM

Didn't sign them, in the sense that you didn't negotiate because the contract was set automatically, or didn't sign them meaning the AI did the whole transaction (with the AI team control Transactions setting on)?

MXD · 11-08-2018, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffR

Didn't sign them, in the sense that you didn't negotiate because the contract was set automatically, or didn't sign them meaning the AI did the whole transaction (with the AI team control Transactions setting on)?

The latter. I wasn't controlling that team when they were both signed : in fact, I wasn't controlling any team. I just forwarded 5 years.

Edit : I have another serious issue, this time with AI behavior in junior, but it doesn'T have much to do with this one. Do you want me to start another thread?

JeffR · 11-09-2018, 01:05 AM

You can post it here.

Re: the AI doing the signing, it may be related to the way that specific type of transaction works, we're checking it.

MXD · 11-09-2018, 08:19 AM

EDIT : Image doesn't show?

The issue is CHL teams releasing their draft picks (and high draft picks). File in on FTP, name is Junior_FA

This is the page of "Signable" players aged between 15 and 18, sorted by ability and by potential.

You'll see, on the Ability picture, the rather high amount of still young players who can step in and make an immediate impact. Not necessarily stars, but serviceable players already, with plenty of room to grow. All these players have Junior preference. D'Agata, Boone and Speck are all guys who really shouldn't be there, since just about every team probably dresses a guy who is both older AND worse. Speck is pretty egregious, considering he played his 16 years old season (and did actualy pretty well).

But it's worse then you sort by potential. Okay, those guys aren't all perfectly scouted, but you'll quickly see the issue. A few obvious problems :

- Reed Grieve's rights were lapsed just 6 weeks after the draft, He might not have been good enough to make his team on the first year, but the team would keep the rights for two seasons (and with his potential -- 744-664) he would probably have easily made the squad. Besides, you rarely see junior teams release their first rounders just weeks after drafting them...

- Thorsteinson is older, but his one is probably even more egregious. Picked 4th overall, signed, and released a month later. Not picked up since, playing in the BCHL for some reason. Potential is 671-732.

I mean, I get that the whole Claude Giroux thing probably should happen. But that's just WAY too many solid contributors, first rounders or just plain future NHL'ers that are completely free in November because they were bought out or released.

JeffR · 11-09-2018, 12:12 PM

Yeah, I've noticed that. It's likely something in the way the AI is evaluating future talent, but I haven't been able to figure out exactly what (although I suspect it might be partly related to a change we made in the talent calculations this year.) Another part of it is the way junior teams can unrealistically stockpile import rights, which is eating up protected list spots because those players tend to be good. Once we've got that fixed, I'm going to try a few adjustments to the junior roster AI.

11-05-2018, 07:54 AM	#1
MXD Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 113	Junior Age Bug I don't know if it's the right place, but there's something wrong with this player. Here's Matthew Bareto : As you see on the picture, he's born in January '04 : in other words, he just played his "19 years old" season. But as you can you can also see, he's considered a 20 year old in his "career" table. He didn't have the OA tag in the lineup (which is right, as he isn't an overager), but I can't actually offer him a deal for next season, so it appears he's as good as gone, despite being eligible for an OA season. Where it also gets interesting is : - He's in Bantam leagues in 18-19 : he should've been too old (by the way the game works...) and in Midget leagues. - He's in Midget leagues at his "16 years old" season, in 19-20. Which isn't wrong or anything : in the game, you see some players remain in Midget if not signed by the team that drafted them. - Only... of course, Mr. Baretto wasn't drafted in 18-19, but in 19-20 : no biggie, he isn't a world class talent and you see players that were missed by junior scouts, like, every year. But was Baretto even eligible in 18-19, when he really should't have been eligible? I can't exactly prove it, but I have strong reservations. - ... Is it possible that he was generated TOO old as a bantam player, which had a ripple effect on everything else?

11-09-2018, 08:19 AM	#12
MXD Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 113	EDIT : Image doesn't show? The issue is CHL teams releasing their draft picks (and high draft picks). File in on FTP, name is Junior_FA This is the page of "Signable" players aged between 15 and 18, sorted by ability and by potential. You'll see, on the Ability picture, the rather high amount of still young players who can step in and make an immediate impact. Not necessarily stars, but serviceable players already, with plenty of room to grow. All these players have Junior preference. D'Agata, Boone and Speck are all guys who really shouldn't be there, since just about every team probably dresses a guy who is both older AND worse. Speck is pretty egregious, considering he played his 16 years old season (and did actualy pretty well). But it's worse then you sort by potential. Okay, those guys aren't all perfectly scouted, but you'll quickly see the issue. A few obvious problems : - Reed Grieve's rights were lapsed just 6 weeks after the draft, He might not have been good enough to make his team on the first year, but the team would keep the rights for two seasons (and with his potential -- 744-664) he would probably have easily made the squad. Besides, you rarely see junior teams release their first rounders just weeks after drafting them... - Thorsteinson is older, but his one is probably even more egregious. Picked 4th overall, signed, and released a month later. Not picked up since, playing in the BCHL for some reason. Potential is 671-732. I mean, I get that the whole Claude Giroux thing probably should happen. But that's just WAY too many solid contributors, first rounders or just plain future NHL'ers that are completely free in November because they were bought out or released. Last edited by MXD; 11-09-2018 at 08:20 AM.

11-05-2018, 01:32 PM	#2
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	Can you upload the save? I'd like to have a look at his full history to see what exactly happened there. Even if he'd been somehow created as an 18-year-old bantam, the age restrictions on the midget leagues should've prevented him from going there after his first season. It sounds like there's some kind of issue with his birth year or age being recognized properly.

11-05-2018, 07:34 PM	#3
MXD Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 113	Transferring at the moment. Should be done in 15 minutes. Name's BARETO.

11-06-2018, 06:50 AM	#4
MXD Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 113	.... Okay, I really have to post this... I noticed my third netminder was born same year and same month, which is january... Was also considered to be on his "20 Years Old" season. I edited his DOB to February, and his age (in career tab) now shows him as a 19 year old. And I can offer him a contract. I don't really care about my netminders, but it appears players born in January are deemed to be older than they actually are by the game.

11-06-2018, 04:41 PM	#5
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	Looks like the world.dat file is missing from the zip - among other things the current calendar year is stored in there, so I can't just drop in a placeholder to make it work. Can you zip that file and attach it to a post here? As long as it has the .zip extension, the forum should let you attach it.

11-07-2018, 02:36 AM	#7
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	Looks like there are a few things going on here: -for some reason, when you signed Bareto after Niagara released him, it didn't give him the normal junior contract that runs through the end of his overage season; instead, it ends after this year. It most likely won't let you re-sign him because your season is over and you can't add another contract for a 2004-born player for next year, since you already have more overage contracts than you're allowed for next season. So that part is intended, but he shouldn't have wound up in that situation in the first place because his contract should've run to the end of next season, not this one. We'll have to figure out what went wrong there. -Jory has the same problem, but you can offer him a contract (even without editing his birthdate). I suspect it may have something to do with the timing of the contract you signed with him - he was signed in February, Bareto in September. I'm not sure exactly why that is, though; we'll have to dig into that and see what exactly is going on. -the age in the Career Stats is being displayed wrong for players with birthdays before July 1, but only in the period between their birthday and the end of the season. That's a separate display bug and should be easy enough to fix. The simplest workaround is just to manually edit in another contract year for Bareto right now, while we try to figure out what happened and how to fix it.

11-08-2018, 12:01 PM	#9
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	Didn't sign them, in the sense that you didn't negotiate because the contract was set automatically, or didn't sign them meaning the AI did the whole transaction (with the AI team control Transactions setting on)?

11-09-2018, 01:05 AM	#11
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	You can post it here. Re: the AI doing the signing, it may be related to the way that specific type of transaction works, we're checking it.

11-09-2018, 12:12 PM	#13
JeffR FHM Producer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Kelowna, BC Posts: 16,623	Yeah, I've noticed that. It's likely something in the way the AI is evaluating future talent, but I haven't been able to figure out exactly what (although I suspect it might be partly related to a change we made in the talent calculations this year.) Another part of it is the way junior teams can unrealistically stockpile import rights, which is eating up protected list spots because those players tend to be good. Once we've got that fixed, I'm going to try a few adjustments to the junior roster AI.