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Old 01-19-2020, 12:45 PM   #181
BaseballMan
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Altuve is still denying it and has the gall to act like he is a victim and predicts the Astros will be back in the series.
We'll see.
Other players are starting to call them on it which i think is good.
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:09 PM   #182
ezpkns34
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Altuve is still denying it and has the gall to act like he is a victim
that bothers me at least as much as the cheating itself


you got caught and didnt even have to get punished for it ... jesus
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:16 PM   #183
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I get that the MLBPA is obligated to protect players being investigated and make sure it's done by the book, but shouldn't they also be trying to protect the 99% of players who didn't cheat? What about their interests?
I agree. The problem arises though if the number of non-cheaters is much less than 90%.Then you start to see a real breakdown in the league. For instance, how many of these guys knew and took advantage of it? Surely not just Altuve. How many of these guys knew but decided to say nothing?

My wife was reading that MLB knew about this for years and decided not to do anything unless the story broke, so here we now are. Leadership means setting the tone at the top, including what's proper behavior. If this is true, it wouldn't be surprising if many of the teams/players began to do it. For sure it would be wrong but again, highly competitive players in a win at all costs society with tons of money at stake and a league that is essentially complicit ... this is a recipe for disaster.
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:27 PM   #184
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that bothers me at least as much as the cheating itself


you got caught and didnt even have to get punished for it ... jesus
You're bothered that cheaters aren't honest? If they were honest people then I wager they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. I hate it too, but I doubt we're going to see many confessions.
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:44 PM   #185
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You're bothered that cheaters aren't honest? If they were honest people then I wager they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. I hate it too, but I doubt we're going to see many confessions.
I didn't expect any to come out and apologize, but to have a pity parade as some kinda victim for being caught is just the opposite end of the spectrum


Honestly, I assume the "victim mentality" is more of a sign that he's upset that more teams haven't been found out .... yet
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Old 01-19-2020, 02:36 PM   #186
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that bothers me at least as much as the cheating itself


you got caught and didnt even have to get punished for it ... jesus
Did he though? An accusation does not equal guilt. I've haven't read anywhere that he has been caught. But I have read the MLB say that no body worn devices were discovered.
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Old 01-19-2020, 04:14 PM   #187
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Did he though? An accusation does not equal guilt. I've haven't read anywhere that he has been caught. But I have read the MLB say that no body worn devices were discovered.
Think it's safe to say that at a minimum he was an accomplice in the sign stealing unless the assertion is that he simply had no clue any of it was going on


Haven't paid much attention to the body device accusation since that seemed a bridge too far to me after trash can banging, so if the "victim mentality" was from those accusations then he'll have to deal with those types of questions for awhile now as it's part of his (and his teammates') reputation now ... which is the risk of cheating
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Old 01-19-2020, 04:54 PM   #188
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Did he though? An accusation does not equal guilt. I've haven't read anywhere that he has been caught. But I have read the MLB say that no body worn devices were discovered.
Were they looking for buzzers? I dont think buzzers came up till after the investigation.
It may be the truth but it's a big reach to buy Altuve's execuse that his wife would be upset with him taking off his shirt in a moment of a lifetime.
If Altuve had just said something like that's just not my style it might be more believable.

The way he hit that Chapman pitch, running home,
hanging on to his shirt, going to the dugout asap and then the way he answered the interviewer's questions makes his claim of innocence hard to believe.
Could it be the MLB not wanting to take on the players association?
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Old 01-19-2020, 06:02 PM   #189
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Altuve is still denying it and has the gall to act like he is a victim and predicts the Astros will be back in the series.
We'll see.
Other players are starting to call them on it which i think is good.
He's denying the ridiculous twitter rumor of players being buzzed on the pitches not the original scandal of the banging trash can. A claim that the MLB investigation found no evidence of. Now if this turns out to be true then I'll eat crow but at least get your denials correct.
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Old 01-19-2020, 06:04 PM   #190
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Were they looking for buzzers? I dont think buzzers came up till after the investigation.
It may be the truth but it's a big reach to buy Altuve's execuse that his wife would be upset with him taking off his shirt in a moment of a lifetime.
If Altuve had just said something like that's just not my style it might be more believable.

The way he hit that Chapman pitch, running home,
hanging on to his shirt, going to the dugout asap and then the way he answered the interviewer's questions makes his claim of innocence hard to believe.
Could it be the MLB not wanting to take on the players association?
so your "proof" is how he acted? I hope your not a DA in real life. Where is the actual, real evidence?
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Old 01-19-2020, 08:39 PM   #191
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You are correct.
I wasnt talking about how smart they were in life but
how great of a baseball mind they are when compared to the managers they beat.
Easy to be a great mind in baseball when
your biggest decision is to buzz or not to buzz.
Maybe they were good enough to win anyway. Cheating when he was gong to win anyway is what got Nixon in trouble.
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Old 01-19-2020, 08:46 PM   #192
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He's denying the ridiculous twitter rumor of players being buzzed on the pitches not the original scandal of the banging trash can. A claim that the MLB investigation found no evidence of. Now if this turns out to be true then I'll eat crow but at least get your denials correct.
The video of Altuve is a clear instance of probable cause, previously unknown to the investigators. However, your view is that despite this, since the didn't find buzzers before when they weren't looking for them, they don't need to look now.
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Old 01-19-2020, 08:50 PM   #193
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so your "proof" is how he acted? I hope your not a DA in real life. Where is the actual, real evidence?
A guy walks down the street carried a huge knife. Later we find someone was stabbed with a huge knife. But no need to investigate the guy with the knife because acting suspiciously isn't evidence. That's where you are on this.

The video of Altuve isn't reason to charge him with a stabbing. But its reason to investigate him on the possibility. But your view that presently having insufficient evidence to convict means no investigation.

Last edited by Brad K; 01-19-2020 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 01-19-2020, 09:18 PM   #194
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I don't think MLB wants any of the publicity to begin with. If the Astros cheated in 2019 MLB doesn't want to find new evidence it just makes the league look bad. If you an outside independent investigators I am confident more would come up if this was done completely outside.

The Astros are going to be roundly greeted at every stadium they go to on the road. It will be interesting to watch. I am a Yankees fan so it will nice not to be the main villian.
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Old 01-19-2020, 10:50 PM   #195
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He's denying the ridiculous twitter rumor of players being buzzed on the pitches not the original scandal of the banging trash can. A claim that the MLB investigation found no evidence of. Now if this turns out to be true then I'll eat crow but at least get your denials correct.
So he is not denying what the investigation was about but he is denying the accusation of buzzers? You do realize that the buzzers are still part of cheating and was in the news the day before he made his denial. So yeah my interpretation of denials are right on track.
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Old 01-19-2020, 11:04 PM   #196
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so your "proof" is how he acted? I hope your not a DA in real life. Where is the actual, real evidence?
I dont have to be a DA. It is a court of public opinion.
Not a court of law.
I said he may be telling the truth but I dont believe him.
I dont need evidence to not believe him.
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Old 01-19-2020, 11:19 PM   #197
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I dont have to be a DA. It is a court of public opinion.
Not a court of law.
I said he may be telling the truth but I dont believe him.
I dont need evidence to not believe him.
I don't know quite how to respond to this. Just about everything you posted is at least partially wrong.

You are saying you don't have evidence AND don't need it.

You DO have evidence. Not enough for proof. But you do have evidence.

Not enough to say you don't believe. But enough to be skeptical.

But then to say to don't need evidence for an opinion... yes you do despite the apparent increase in the numbers of people in the court of public opinion who think otherwise.

Last edited by Brad K; 01-19-2020 at 11:22 PM.
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Old 01-19-2020, 11:27 PM   #198
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It is most evident in the home run video Altuve has something to hide. Could be anything.

For example, say he got a new tatoo and wants to surprise his wife with in private, not having her see it in public first.

Maybe despite her nagging he was wearing a dirty undershirt.

Maybe he has some wounds from the professional dominatrix he visited the day before.

Or maybe he's wearing a communication device that tells him what pitch is coming.

While I don't consider the video proof, I challenge someone to come up with a more reasonable explanation than hiding a communication device.
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Old 01-20-2020, 12:53 AM   #199
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The commissioner needs to go. He's a failure. The owners love him, though, so that probably won't happen. Attendance keeps falling. He says he didn't know about the juice. The baseball juiced up. I don't believe him. He saw what steroids did for the sport. With everyone interested and following the chases of Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, etc. He thought the more livelier ball would do the same as balls sailed out of sight at a pace never before seen. Yet, attendance drops. He needs to go. His ideas for speeding up the game aren't working. He took his eye off the ball. He should have been more focused on cheating and the attendance. How did this cheating sandal go on so long? Didn't anybody think it was kind of weird people banging on garbage cans? Commissioner should resign.
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Old 01-20-2020, 01:01 AM   #200
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I don't know quite how to respond to this. Just about everything you posted is at least partially wrong.

You are saying you don't have evidence AND don't need it.

You DO have evidence. Not enough for proof. But you do have evidence.

Not enough to say you don't believe. But enough to be skeptical.

But then to say to don't need evidence for an opinion... yes you do despite the apparent increase in the numbers of people in the court of public opinion who think otherwise.
No i dont need evidence for an opinion.
Evidence may help give it more weight but it is not mandatory in all cases.
I do need evidence if i state that my opinion is true.

You do not need evidence to suspect a spouse is cheating.
It may help your case but you are still entitled to your own opinion.
Now whether you dont mind sleeping on the couch is where the evidence is needed. Even then i dont think it would help in that case.
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