A Partial Eclipse of the Sonny

[professordp]

The British Boxing Bulletin
April 10, 1957


Cooper's Cut Gives Erskine Technical Decision-Title Declared Vacant!

Richardson Pounds Out Decision Over Bates

By Wally Wilkens

In a fight card that stressed ethnic honor, Welshmen enjoyed the upper hand last night at Arsenal Stadium. Welsh heavyweights Joe Erskine and Dick Richardson returned to Cardiff with wins over Brits Henry Cooper and Peter Bates respectively.

Erskine, a slick boxer, was matched against Commonwealth champion Cooper and picked up a bittersweet victory. An unintential head clash in the second round opened a gash over Cooper's right eye. By the eigth round, the cut deepened and the fight was stopped with Erskine getting the slight edge on the judges' cards.

Unfortunately for Erskine, Commonwealth rules do not permit the exchange of a title via a technical decision. When one takes place, the title is declared vacant. Thus, Cooper and Erskine will have another go at it in June.

Until the contest was halted, both men gave a good accounting of their talents. For the first three rounds, Erskine pretty much took the fight to Cooper. Using his feet and a precise jab, Erskine set up his combination and prevented his foe from mounting an effective attack.

Early on Cooper did land some hard hooks which appeared to hurt Erskine. Nevertheless, he was unable to follow through and seemed slightly sluggish in the early going, looking to land one big shot with a counterpunch.

As the fight progressed, Henry, despite the constant bleeding over his right eye, started to come on. Cutting off the ring, he was able to minimize Erskine's movement and work him into the ropes where he delivered some crippling hooks to the Welsman's body.

Thirty seconds into round six, however, Cooper's momentum was halted as Erskine sent him to the mat for an eight count. Cooper was up quickly when referee Jack Donaldson reached four and didn't appear hurt.

In the following round, Erskine started to slow down, and Henry was landing numerous hooks to the head and body. But by this time the cut was getting worse. One minute into round eight, Donalson signaled a halt to the match.

Despite the knockdown that Cooper suffered, the judges saw the match as being rather close. Paul Samson and Rick McReynolds gave it to Erskine 76-75. Peter Horace dissented seeing it 76-75 in Cooper's favor.

After the match, Cooper's camp complained that Donaldson was premature in stopping the contest. From the looks of Henry's wound, that position has few takers.

In a preliminary match tough Dick Richardson scored a mauling ten round decision over rugged Peter Bates. From a scientific perspective, it was not a pretty match, but there was enough action throughout to please the crowd.

For ten rounds, both men tore at each other in what could be seen as a primative survival of the fittest contest. The bullish Richardson lived up to his sobriquet, "Dirty Dick, and was admonished for a variety of infractions by referee Mort Silver. For his part, Bates was not above bending the rules and also received several warnings from Silver.

Although there were no knockdowns, the fighters pounded each other for ten straight rounds. In the end, Richardson was too strong and too skilled for Bates. While the rounds were pretty much back and forth affairs, Richardson was awarded a clear victory by all three judges by a tally of 97-93.

Richardson is rough but does appear to have some raw talent. He'll be facing the winner of next month's match between Brian London and former Commonwealth champ Joe Bygraves. An impressive victory could earn him a Commonwealth title crack once Cooper and Erskine finally settle their differences.

[professordp]

Now that I've launched this uni, I thought it would be a good time to give you a little more detail about the Universal Boxing Organization and its president, Hans Reuter. In an upcomig issue of World Boxing Review, Skip Bailey will conduct an in-depth interview with Reuter.

Like the Universal Boxing Organization, Hans Reuter is fictional and strictly the product of my imagination.


Universal Boxing Organization

The UBO was formed in 1956 and became the official ranking and title sanctioning body for professional boxing on January 1, 1957.

As a result of wars between boxing promoters, the lack of official world rankings, championships placed on "ice" for long periods of time, and worthy contenders not getting a crack at their respective division's crown, the various forces which make up the boxing community met in Chicago and the UBO is born.

Presently, the scope of the UBO is limited to providing official world rankings each month and sanctioning title bouts. It is ruled by a twelve member governing body which represents the views of the different interests in professional boxing.

Representatives are elected by their respective constituencies. At this time, managers, promoters, boxers, and boxing writers each have three representatives on the governing body.

Outside of world ranking and title sanctioning, the UBO can only make recommendations. It has no authority over national and American state championship matches and rankings. Nor does it regulate referees, set standards for ring safety, discipline of boxers, or determine the distribution of purses.

The governing body selects the UBO president to serve a three year term. To be selected president, a nominee must recieve two-thirds (eight votes) of the votes of the governing body. The UBO's first president, Hans Reuter, was selected by a unanimous vote this past September.

Hans Reuter

Born into an upper middle class Rotterdam, Netherlands family in 1898, Reuter attended the University of Amsterdam and earned his law degree in 1925.

During the Nazi occupation of the Netherlands, he was active in the resistance effort and helped organize the LO which protected Dutch Jews in hiding from Nazi persecution and extermination.

Following the conclusion of World War Two, Reuter headed the national repatriation program and adminstered relief funds from the U.S. Marshall Plan.

When the Dutch civilian government was reestablished in 1948, he served as the National Economic Recovery Director until he resigned at the end of 1955.

[professordp]

WORLD BOXING REVIEW

April 1957

A Skip Bailey Exclusive Interview:

Hans Reuter Speaks Out

Skip Bailey: Many were surprised when you were selected by the Universal Boxing Organization to serve as the new boxing czar. You have an impressive resume, but there's no prior experience in the sports world.

Hans Reuter: Before I deal with the substance of your question, I must state that I strongly object to your use of the term "czar." It suggests that I'm some sort of a despot or tyrant. That the furtherst thing from reality. I am accountable to the governing body of the UBO which appointed me. They, not I, make policy for the organization. My responsibilities are to execute their rules, manage the organization, and offer my recommendations. This is far from being a dicatorship.

SB: I stand corrected.

HR: Now to your question. I was approached by UBO representatives this past November and asked if I would be interested in serving as president. I did not solicit this position. In terms of my qualifications, while I've never held any position in professional sports, I am an avid fan of all sports, including boxing.

I think that by virtue of my relative success in reconstructing post-World War Two Netherlands, I have a proven record of accomplishment. If I do possess any talents, it is establishing order in a chaotic environment. And certainly, professional boxing has been in a state of extreme chaos in recent years.

Finally, it was expressed to me that the governing body wanted someone who was outside of the professional boxing world to manage the organization. I suppose they wished to avoid division and political infighting.

SB: Without reopening the czar issue, your critics have claimed that you demand unanimous support for your actions by the UBO governing body.

HR: Once again this is a total distortion of reality. The only time I asked for a unanimous vote by the governing body was when I was appointed. When I was asked to take the position, I indicated that I would only do so if all members supported my selection. This condition was not based upon any satisfaction of my ego but rather to ensure that I did not become party to any possible factional wars within the body.

SB: If I can, I'd like to return to your critics for a moment. First, Cus D'Amato. Boxing writers and the grapevine suggest that D'Amato is at odds with you over the selection of challengers to the Patterson heavyweight crown, and that ultimately, he wants to undermine your authority.

HR: Let me begin by saying that the differences between Mr. D'Amato and me have been greatly distorted by the boxing media. In most respects we share a common interest in having the UBO as a viable ranking and title sanctioning body. Remember, that prior to the establishment of our organization, Floyd Patterson and Mr. D'Amato were pretty much frozen out by the promoters affiliated with the International Boxing Club. As a result, Patterson was denied matches with many top heavyweights and prevented from boxing in a number of major venues. Of course with the creation of the UBO, Mr. D'Amato no longer has these problems.

SB: What is your response to D'Amato's recent petition to the UBO to permanently ban Sonny Liston from future championship bouts?

HR: I have no response. The matter is now pending before the UBO governing body which first must determine if it has authority to take any action of this kind before dealing with the merits of Mr. D'Amato's petition. My only comment is that Mr. D'Amato has every right to present a petition to our organization.

SB: A more vocal critic has been Archie Moore, who has publicly called for you to be removed from your position and has charged that you are a dictator who is ruining the sport.

HR: Archie is one of the all-time greats in this sport and one of its most colorful personalities. Throughout his career he has worked the media to sell tickets to his fights, and that's what he's doing here.

Still we do have a serious area of difference. One of the major purposes of the UBO is to ensure that rankings and title shots are handled in a fair and equitable manner. That said, champions must defend their title on a regular basis. In this regard, Archie has been delinquent. We refuse to allow any fighter to let his title sit on the sidelines while he campaigns for a crown in another division. This is counter to the founding principles of the UBO. Archie must make a choice between the title he holds and the title he desires.

SB: Before we move on to more positive topics, both you and the UBO have been strongly criticized concerning your position on a possible title fight between Patterson and former champ Rocky Marciano. This is a match that fans are calling for and you have been accused of blocking it.

HR: First I want to say that as a boxing fan, I also want to see a Marciano-Patterson title match. I personally feel that it would be great for our sport. But it must take place under the right circumstances.

The UBO has set rules that only top ranked boxers can have a sanctioned title match. Marciano is not ranked. He's not fought in two years. It's grossly unfair to allow an inactive former champion to leapfrog over contenders who have had to fight to retain their rankings while he sat idle. All we ask is that Marciano prove that he is worthy of a title shot.

I agree that in an immediate sense, a Marciano-Patterson contest would be wonderful, but if you ignore the rules that we've established to set it up it would have a negative effect on boxing over the long term.

Once again, the UBO was created to establish some sense of order and eliminate favoritism in boxing. Once you start suspending the rules for specific fighters, you destroy order and return to chaos.

SB: I want to put some of this together and give you a hypothetical set of situations. Patterson and D'Amato ignore the UBO and meet Marciano in a title match. To add to the mix, Archie Moore disregards the UBO's order to defend his light heavyweight title in the next few months and starts fighting contenders ranked by your organization and defeats them. How does the UBO respond?

HR: If Marciano is not ranked in the top five by the UBO, we would not sanction the fight as a title match. Moreover, there would be s strong possibility that we'd strip Patterson of his title.

In the case of Moore, if he doesn't defend his light heavyweight title within the time frame that has been set, we would declare the title vacant and set up an elimination series among top contenders to find a new champion. As far as victories over heavyweight contenders, we would continue to refuse ranking Archie as a heavyweight until he made a formal declaration of his intent to renounce his leight heavyweight crown and campaign strictly in the heavyweight division.

SB: Marciano and Moore are already considered gods by the boxing public. And Patterson's the heavyweight champion. Even if you did apply these sanctions, what's to prevent some other organization from forming for the purposes of recognizing their status and championship claims.

HR: There's nothing the UBO could do to prevent the emergence of a rival organization. But in the end, this would be a serious blow to boxing and would wind up hurting everyone, including Marciano, Moore, and Patterson.

What makes a divisional championship so important is that there's only one person wearing the crown. If there ever comes a time when we have several organizations existing and each having its own champion, I think you will see a great decline in the general public's interest in our sport.

SB: One final question. The UBO has been in existence for roughly six months. How would you assess its progress to date and where would you like to see it go in the future?

HR: We of course are in our infancy. As it is often said before you run you must be able to walk and before you can walk you must have the ability to crawl.

Our intial objective was to establish a universally accepted rankings organization and a title match sanctioning body. So far we've been very successful in attaining these two primary goals.

Beyond that there are numerous areas where the UBO could improve professional boxing. But you must remember that the sport has been in a condition of total chaos and without any sense of direction for nearly a century so there's much to be done.

Out founding philosophy has been that we must first do what can be done. What we accomplish down the road largely depends upon the level of support that we receive from the members of the boxing community.


Below: Hans Reuter, President of the Universal Boxing Organization

[Beno999]

I liked that interview, gave a good insight into the mind of Hans Reuter. Sod him and his choice not to allow Marciano to fight Patterson though.

[professordp]

Thanks for your comments! I'm glad you enjoyed the interview.

Now concerning Marciano, let's look at it from Reuter's perspective. Cus D'Amato is a pretty tricky guy when he's unleashed. Remember he passed up all of the contenders to have Patterson fight Pete Rademacher. When you think about it, Marciano might have a better chance getting a crack at his old title with Reuter and the UBO around than he would if Cus were allowed to do things as he sees fit.

BTW, hopefully. within the next twenty-four hours, I'll be posting the April edition of Bailey's Beat. Wait until you see what Skip has to say about D'Amato and a possible Patterson-Marciano title match.

Please, keep commenting! I enjoy your constructive comments---they give me some good ideas for subplots and possible directions I can take this uni.

[professordp]

WORLD BOXING REVIEW

April 1957


Bailey's Beat

By Skip Bailey

That Wily Old Cus

It seems like just about everyone is calling for a Rocky Marciano-Floyd Patterson title bout these days. But strangely silent is Floyd's manager, Cus D'Amato. Seems like Cus is on the same page as Hans Reuter of the Universal Boxing Organization on this one.

Reuter has argued that Marciano must gain status as a contender before he gets a crack at his old title (see my exlusive interview with Reuter on page 22). Cus appears to quietly support Reuter's position but for different reasons.

Earlier this year Patterson defeated then number one contneder, Tommy "Hurricane" Jackson and is scheduled to put the title on the line against current top contender Hal Carter. So Patterson and D'Amato have already satisfied the UBO mandate and they can pretty much cherry pick Patterson's next two opponents from the top five ranked fighters, assuming Floyd can get past Carter.

If Marciano does come back, he'll have to work his way into the division's inner circle. This gives Cus the advantage of time. By most estimates, Rocky would have to win three fights before he'd qualify for a title shot. D'Amato could get a better sense of what Rocky has left before agreeing to put his man in the ring against the former champ. All of this will take at least nine months, and Rocky's not getting any younger. See what Cus is thinking?

Don't get the impression that D'Amato and Reuter has patched up their differences. Recently Cus filed a petition with the UBO to bar Charles "Sonny" Liston from fighting for the title. Liston is currently serving five years in jail after being convicted for assaulting a police officer. Before his recent problem with the law, Sonny was seen as the toughest fighter in the division, and Cus would love to take him out of the picture.

D'Amato's petition also represents a challenge to Reuter's authority and the vialbility of the UBO. It could very well divide the UBO's governing body which up until now has been unanimous in it's policies. If Reuter winds up on the wrong side of a split within the organization he could be seeking employment elsewhere by the end of the year.


Heavyweight Roundup

McMurtry Massacres Holman

In what has to be seen as a major upset in the heavyweight division Washington's Pat McMurtry did a total demolition job on number two ranked contender John Holman via a third round TKO.

Irish Pat dominated the contest from the opening bell. Getting right to work, McMurtry nailed Holman with a series of combinations to the head and body. As the first round was drawing to a close, Pat scored a hard right to the temple that slammed Holman into the ropes.

Thirty seconds into the next round, a McMurtry uppercut sent Holman to the canvas for an eight count. Holman, who offered little offense in the match, somehow survived Pat's blistering attack, but ultimately took a beating in the process.

When the fighters came out for the third, Holman appeared to be in rough shape. His right eye was starting to swell up and there was no bounce in his step. Halfway through the round, McMurtry caught him flush with a powerful hook and John was on the floor for a second time. After the eight count, Holman was pretty much defenseless and referee Johnny Caruso stopped the contest at the 2:19 mark.

When the UBO ratings are issued at the end of the month, you can expect Holman to drop sharply in the rankings. McMurtry is an impressive young slugger who has decent boxing skills. He's someone to watch!


DeJohn Stiffs Pastrano in Three

In another upset, tough Mike DeJohn overpowered classy Willie Pastrano in the third round to score a knockout over the tenth ranked New Orleans native.

Pastrano, who was the favorite among the large contingent of Italian-Americans who attended the match at Boston Gardens, looked impressive in the first round. Quick feet and a snapping jab kept DeJohn off balance and set up some effective crosses to the head.

When the round concluded, it appeared that Willie was going to give the Syracuse slugger a boxing lesson. But in the second, DeJohn effectively cut off the ring an neutralized Pastrano's speed. For much of the round, Mike clinched and scored a few telling body shots.

DeJohn continued his mauling tactics in the third and bulled Pastrano into the corner. A cross followed by an uppercut hurt Willie, and DeJohn unleashed a barrage of punches which sent Pastrano down for a ten count.

This was Pastrano's second loss in a row. He lost a ten round decision to John Holman earlier in the year and will be dropped from the rankings as a result of this defeat.

Taking nothing away from the powerful DeJohn, Pastrano gave away too much in size to his opponent. DeJohn had a height advantage of three inches and scaled in twenty pounds heavier than Willie. As a result, he was able to out-muscle Pastrano.

It's a shame. Patrano is a young, talented boxer. He's just not big enough to compete in the heavyweight ranks.


Moore Crowns "Emperor" in Three

With the issues he's facing from Hans Reuter and the UBO, Archie Moore is finding it more difficult to match up against quality heavyweights. Since the UBO refuses to give Archie a ranking, most of the division's talent see no advantage of fighting him.

Thus, enter Cordell "Emperor" Jones who brought a less than impressive record of 13-28-6 into the ring with him in a scheduled ten rounder with Moore at Pittsburgh's Civic Center.

Jones really didn't belong in the same arena let alone the same ring with a boxing legend like Archie. Moore put him down twice in the third and once more in the following round. After the last knockdown, Jones had nothing left and the contest was halted at 2:44.

Watching the fight, you got a sense that the Old Mongoose was somewhat frustrated. He half-heartedly punched Jones around the ring for three rounds and then out of boredom put him away in the fourth.

It's obvious that Moore's not going to win his battle with Hans Reuter who insists that Archie make a choice between continuing as the light heavy champ or giving up his title belt to campaign in the heavyweight ranks. Look for Archie's hand to be forced within the next month.


Rademacher Decisions Whitehurst for Second Pro Win

Olympic Gold medalist Pete Rademacher scored an eight round win over veteran Bert Whitehurst at Sunnyside Gardens in a less than inspiring performance.

Whitehurst, who has decent boxing skills, used his hand speed to pop his jabs and nail Pete with a number of left hooks. Unfortunately, Bert has less punching power than a flyweight. Neverthless, he did hurt Rademacher a few times, but the former Olympian was never in any real trouble in the match.

For his part, Rademacher had Whitehurst in dire straights several times in the course of the contest but was unable to put together a finishing attack.

Watching this fight, several things came to mind. First, Pete's performance underscores the fact that there's a big difference between amateur boxing and the pros. Second, Pete would have been demolished by Floyd Patterson. He ate a load of Whitehurst's jabs and displayed a weakness defending against the left hook. Need I say more?


The Grapevine

Rocky Marciano will be meeting with Hans Reuter soon, and they won't be talking about the weather. Look for a major annoucement concerning Rocky's comeback plans before the month ends.

There's a lot of excitement accross the pond when it comes to British heavyweight boxing. Joe Erskine's recent technical decision over Henry Cooper resulted in a vacant Commonwealth crown. Lurking in the backgound is rough Dick Richardson who meets former British champ Joe Bygraves in late May. And don't discountthe Blackpool Bomber Brian London who will be facing Italian champ Franco Cavicchi next month. One of the above will be facing Euro champ Ingo Johansson before the end of the year.

See you next month!

[professordp]

UNIVERSAL BOXING ORGANIZATION

Heavyweight Division Rankings

April 1957

Floyd Patterson, Champion

1-Harold Carter

2-Zora Folley

3-Ingemar Johansson

4-Eddie Machen

5-Tommy "Hurricane" Jackson

6-John Holman

7-Joe Erskine

8-Pat McMurtry

9-Henry Cooper

10-Bob Baker

[professordp]

The New York Examiner
April 29, 1957

Marciano Returns to the Ring

By Jack Davis

Former heavyweight champion Rocky Marciano today ended months of speculation and announced that he is coming out of retirement. He will attempt ot regain his title which is currently held by Floyd Patterson.

Marciano will first face fourth ranked contender Tommy "Hurricane" Jackson on June 15th at Yankee Stadium as part of the boxing card for Patterson's championship bout with top ranked Hal Carter. Jackson was stopped last month by Patterson in their title match at Madison Square Garden.

The only heavyweight titleholder to retire undefeated, Marciano holds a record of 49-0. His last fight was eighteen months ago against current light heavyweight champion Archie Moore whom he stopped in nine rounds. Patterson defeated Moore last year to win the title which was vacant after Marciano announced his retirement.

Should Marciano and Patterson both win their respective matches, the two could meet later this year in a title fight. A victory over Jackson would most likely give Marciano a ranking among the top five heavyweights which would meet the standards of the Universal Boxing Orgnaization (UBO) for sanctioning championship contests.

Nevertheless, a victory by Marciano would not totally ensure him a title match with Patterson. The champion would have some discretion in selecting an opponent among the division's top contenders, but boxing insiders believe that Marciano would be the most logical choice and would have the greatest gate attraction, something that's always a major consideration in matching boxers.

Earlier this week the thirty-three year old Marciano met with Hans Reuter who heads the UBO. Neither Marciano or Reuter would discuss the substance of their meeting with the press. Reuter has been the subject of harsh criticism for insisting that Marciano first obtain a top five ranking before challenging Patterson for the title.

Commenting on his return to the ring Marciano said, "After being away from the fight game for the past year and a half, I realized that at thirty-three I'm not just ready for the rocking chair. I've kept myself and shape since I retired, and I'll be in fight condition when I meet Jackson in six weeks."

He concluded. "Since I hung up my gloves, there's been a rise of young talent in the division. I guess I want to just show these kids that this old man still has what it takes."

[Infinity]

Marciano's being smart about it though, taking on a top 5 fighter to make his comeback legitimate. Also, a tune-up bout or 2 will help him shake that ring rust.

[Beno999]

yeah good point infinity, although i just got the impression that Hans Reuter was reluctant to give the title fight an even slight possibility in his interview, after reading the last few updates however i think its changed and its going to play into the hands of Marciano.

I personally feel even though he's been out of the ring for a year and a half he will slaughter a guy like Patterson whos chin has always been suspect. Its what the fight fans want to see and its a promoters dream cometh the hour for Marciano Vs. Patterson.

[professordp]

Reuter's no fool, and remember that there's this power struggle going on with Cus D'Amato. In the May issue of World Boxing Review Skip Bailey gets into the D'Amato-Reuter chess match and how the Marciano fight figures into it all.

I had thought about a tuneup or two for Rocky. But given the circumstances that he'd need to place five in the rankings for a title fight, doing battle with Jackson would be his best option. If you look at the most recent rankings, the younger talent is starting to move up. Outside of Carter, Jackson is the weakest of the top five and most likely would drop lower as the year wears on. The big issue is that the boxing fans want a Marciano-Patterson match asap.

Once again, Rocky has lost a little since he retired. There's no way he's coming back as the same fighter he was when he retired.

[Infinity]

Now I don't know that I would expect he lost that much at only 34, sure he's been out for 18 months or so, but that's not that long in the grand scheme of things. Marciano's skills were based on his insane conditioning in my opinion. He ALWAYS came into a fight in tip top shape, and I don't see that changing all that much. I also think that if they do allow Marciano to return and fight Patterson, (and I'm SURE he'll destroy Patterson) it'll give the organization a strong sense of legitimacy as well!

[professordp]

You make some very good points. If you get a chance, please go to the link below. It's Dean's "Ratings of the Day Council". If you go down the page, you'll see his rating for a "comeback" Marciano. I'd appreciate your thoughts (and those of any other member) on the rating.


http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...council-7.html

[Jersey-Jim]

I remember reading an article in the 70's that said Rocky was starting to have back problems which was a major factor in his decision to retire. The article said that his back would suddenly "lock up" and he was afraid of that happening during a fight. He had kept this problem, according to the article, a secret because he had already signed to fight Archie Moore.

Another thing is, fighters back then seemed to age faster than they do today. It's not like today. Of course, they fight less today, too.
Even back in Ali's time, they made a big deal out of him turning 30! Today, 40 is the new 30 and 60 is the new 50. People are active through their 80's when back then, they'd be checking out a few years after retirement.

I believe Rocky's physicla best was behind him the night he stepped into the ring against Moore for a few reasons.

1. Rocky was never one to pass up a buck. He he been able to squeeze one more title bout purse out of his career he would have.

2. Rocky would never enter the ring unless his conditioning (physical health included) was at it's peak. The fact that he decided not to enter the ring again after Moore sort of indicates to me that he knew that was the inevitable slide had begun.

It's amazing that a fighter with Rocky's all out style lasted as many fights as he did. I've never seen a fighter with as much raw determination and the ability to seemingly be able to will himself to victory as Marciano. I remember my grandfather telling me that Ezzard Charles said, "You can't boxing Marciano and win. He puts on relentless pressure. The only way to beat his style is to stand and fight him."

I didn't check out Dean's rating, but I imagine that had the Rock returned, his conditioning would have remained a 10, but his CF's would have probably dropped a hair as would have his punches landed and the effectiveness of his crouching defense. He probably would have cut easier, too. He would have still had the power, though.

I wonder who would have trained him?

[Infinity]

Originally Posted by Jersey-Jim

I remember reading an article in the 70's that said Rocky was starting to have back problems which was a major factor in his decision to retire. The article said that his back would suddenly "lock up" and he was afraid of that happening during a fight. He had kept this problem, according to the article, a secret because he had already signed to fight Archie Moore.

Another thing is, fighters back then seemed to age faster than they do today. It's not like today. Of course, they fight less today, too.
Even back in Ali's time, they made a big deal out of him turning 30! Today, 40 is the new 30 and 60 is the new 50. People are active through their 80's when back then, they'd be checking out a few years after retirement.

I believe Rocky's physicla best was behind him the night he stepped into the ring against Moore for a few reasons.

1. Rocky was never one to pass up a buck. He he been able to squeeze one more title bout purse out of his career he would have.

2. Rocky would never enter the ring unless his conditioning (physical health included) was at it's peak. The fact that he decided not to enter the ring again after Moore sort of indicates to me that he knew that was the inevitable slide had begun.

It's amazing that a fighter with Rocky's all out style lasted as many fights as he did. I've never seen a fighter with as much raw determination and the ability to seemingly be able to will himself to victory as Marciano. I remember my grandfather telling me that Ezzard Charles said, "You can't boxing Marciano and win. He puts on relentless pressure. The only way to beat his style is to stand and fight him."

I didn't check out Dean's rating, but I imagine that had the Rock returned, his conditioning would have remained a 10, but his CF's would have probably dropped a hair as would have his punches landed and the effectiveness of his crouching defense. He probably would have cut easier, too. He would have still had the power, though.

I wonder who would have trained him?

Now I'm going to have to do some research and see if I can find those articles you mention....lol As for training him, since this is a fictional Uni, perhaps the perfect trainer for "The Rock" would be Mick from the Rocky films.....

[bigMatt]

These tune-up bouts will do nothing but raise expectations for a rematch. There will be a public clamor, and the promise of such big money, that Patterson will have no choice but to face Marciano pretty soon.

I'd consider Rocky the favorite. Given his style, and Patterson's questionable jaw, it'd be a distinct possibility, but I'm not as certain as others are that a well over the hill Marciano would destroy Patterson. How much Marciano has slowed down will have considerable impact on Patterson's chance of success.

[Jersey-Jim]

Originally Posted by Infinity

Now I'm going to have to do some research and see if I can find those articles you mention....lol As for training him, since this is a fictional Uni, perhaps the perfect trainer for "The Rock" would be Mick from the Rocky films.....

I think the person who wrote the aritcle was Bobby Goodman.

[Infinity]

Thanks Jersey....

Random thought: If D'Amato's petition to permanently ban Liston works, won't that change the name of this thread to Total Eclipse of the Sonny?

[Jersey-Jim]

Originally Posted by Infinity

Thanks Jersey....

Random thought: If D'Amato's petition to permanently ban Liston works, won't that change the name of this thread to Total Eclipse of the Sonny?

Well, in a perfect world where everything works the way it should, yes. But in a Jersey world, where nothing works exactly as it should, no. Bans are made to be broken.

[Infinity]

I found this gem while doing some research. Anyone who's a boxing fan should watch this!

YouTube - Rocky Marciano About.

You're right about the back issue btw Jersey, Part of this film is an interview with Rocky's manager who explained why he retired.

This being said, unless chiropractic medicine has been made popular by this time, I don't think the Rock would come out of retirement after all!...lol