OOTP-server reports - Page 3

Subby · 06-18-2002, 10:00 AM

Why do you think you got framed? And by whom?

Ryan S · 06-18-2002, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by HornsManiac
There is NO PROOF that I have done anything wrong.

Apart from trying to trick everybody by posing as RWBL Kevin....

You claim that there is a valid excuse for you and "Kevin" having the same IP address, but is there a valid excuse for you and Kevin having the same forum password?

BUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bsak16 · 06-18-2002, 10:03 AM

Horns,

I must have missed the part where that was said. I was hoping that it was just something you over looked because I know I dont check my minors everytime but I would notice if something drastic happened to one of them. Heck there arent that many. I was trying to be impartial to this whole matter but not anymore. Dont insult my intelligence. You deserve everything you get and that's coming at you. If you get the league name so be it. I could care less but your new GM's will find out what we already know.

Draft Dodger · 06-18-2002, 10:10 AM

well,
I guess if the guy is going to use bold-face type, then what he's saying must be true...

HornsManiac · 06-18-2002, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bsak16
If you get the league name so be it. I could care less but your new GM's will find out what we already know.

Unbelievable!

Is this another childish threat? So you are going to go out of your way to sabotage my league and its new owners?

Ryan S - You are just sharp as a tack aren't you?

I created his user name and password to FOFC when he was at my house... from my computer. Before that moment he had never even heard of FOFC, so again you guys think you have this all figured out and again you are way off base.

I refuse to participate any further in this infantile bickering. Get a life and stop worrying so much about my league.

HornsManiac

Subby · 06-18-2002, 10:15 AM

I'll repeat my question:

Why do you think you were you framed? And by whom?

bsak16 · 06-18-2002, 10:18 AM

Horns,

Childish?!?! There is nothing more childish than a cheater. I am not going to sabotage anything you will do that on your own. It's funny whenever there is trouble you're right in the middle of it.

Maple Leafs · 06-18-2002, 10:20 AM

Horns... two questions for you.

Quote:

Originally posted by HornsManiac
You guys are free to leave the league if you choose to go, and no one is denying that.

I'm not clear on whether the issue here is the IDs or the league name. Since most of the IDs have now joined the new league, and since you have plenty of new owners ready to go in your league, why not just ask Andreas to release the IDs of anyone who wants to switch leagues? You could replace the departing owner IDs with your incoming owners; seems like that would work for everyone.

Quote:

What you are doing now is selfishly imploring for the name of my league and you don't have that right.

I thought that you had turned control of the league over to Kevin. Could you clarify who's league it will be; yours or his?

Ryan S · 06-18-2002, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by HornsManiac
Ryan S - You are just sharp as a tack aren't you?

I created his user name and password to FOFC when he was at my house... from my computer. Before that moment he had never even heard of FOFC, so again you guys think you have this all figured out and again you are way off base.

Of course, there was the best part of 7 hours between two of Kevins posts, and they both have the same IP address and the final one was made at around midnight, Texas time. Does Kevin come around to your house every time he wants to post on FOFC?

As for you creating his forum profile, is he too stupid to sign up to a forum? Or maybe he is internet illiterate. If that is the case, then he has no business being an online league commish.

Admit it. You are lying and you got caught out bigtime. Right now you are just digging a hole for yourself, and with every pathetic post you make defending yourself, the hole gets deeper and deeper.

Scott Vibert · 06-18-2002, 10:30 AM

Do with this what you want.

I choose not to take sides, but I have read the various message boards, including the infamous deleted thread, I will attempt to not let my own opinions of what seems to have occurred come into play.

Simply put, there is no denying that someone associated with the league was cheating. Who is the guilty party, is irrelevant; this is one of the biggest examples of cheating in an online league I've ever seen (among any online sports).

Unfortunately HornsManiac, the cheating occurred during your time as the league commissioner, and the players edited on were your team. Whether you made the edits or not is irrelevant. At this point as long as you are associated with that league, the league's reputation will be sullied as people will associate the league and the events that took place under your watch with the league.

If I were in your shoes, I would resign and have nothing more to do with the league. If you submitted your order ID, I'd try and get it back and go start a new league with your friends and those who'd step into the existing league if you stayed. What this will do is give you a fresh start and a chance to redeem yourself, the further you distance yourself from this whole situation the better of a chance there is to forget it and for your reputation to be restored.

The rest of the league or those that would stay should keep the space, let them deal with the mess and try to clean up the leagues reputation. As unfortunate as this is to have happened, unfortunately since it happened to your team on your watch you will forever be associated with it.

The added benefit of you stepping away, is if the league falters or once again shows signs of cheating you can sit back, laugh at them and say "I told you so". Meanwhile hopefully you're new league has managed to become successful and an enjoyable experience for all involved.

Now I'm not saying you did everything or anything that has been alleged, but in my humble opinion (take it for what its worth (nothing)) the better sense of valor would be to step down completely, and rebuild your reputation in another league. Obviously you can make sure that you get your order ID back (as would any of the original owners who are going to stand by you), the onus would then shift to the other owners in the "old" league to try and restore the leagues reputation, and if the cheater is still in that group, then it's likely he/she/it may not be able to help themselves again and you'll be fully vindicated. If the cheater stays cloaked after that... well you've gotten a fresh start in a new league and the old league will build back its reputation.

In any event I'd strongly suggest you get your order ID back and start a new league with a new name and a new group of owners to give yourself a fresh start and a chance to reclaim your reputation.....

Use this advice as you see fit.... good luck to all of you involved in this... hopefully your next online league experience will be much better.

Scott

HornsManiac · 06-18-2002, 10:38 AM

Andreas - PLEASE put this issue to rest. More than half of the posts in this thread are from people who have nothing to do with RWBL and never have in the past. This is only their malicious posting to keep this thread at the top and to make sure as many people as possible read it. You can also go to the online leagues forum and see the same thing happening. I guess they think that by damaging the name "HornsManiac" they think they are damaging me personally. I guess they think I would be stupid enough to use that name in the future.

Andreas, I apologize for you having to filter through so many flames and so much trolling to sort this all out. I won't post in this thread again. You have all of my info in the emails and I will just wait to hear back from you via email.

Many thanks,

HornsManiac

Subby · 06-18-2002, 10:40 AM

I'll repeat my question:

Why do you think you were you framed? And by whom?

Fritz · 06-18-2002, 10:59 AM

i did it

spleen1015 · 06-18-2002, 11:12 AM

I think this thread should be at the top. Why? So people can see it and be aware that there's something fishy with your league. It is my duty as a member of this community to help people where they need it. I would hate to see a new OOTPer get involved in your league and get spoiled on OOTP because you like to cheat.

Qrashman · 06-18-2002, 12:09 PM

I am the commish of a league and WOW, this is very interesting stuff. I've had a blast the past 45 minutes, looking up all the various threads and links to other sites. It's like a spiderweb of lies and deceit!

Anyway, I thought the best question of this entire thread was the following:

Quote:

One final question: How could you not notice the ratings and talent changes your players received?

I have one question that I haven't been able to figure out. Did these alleged edits to the players happen over a period of time or was it all at once? Were there any sims after the time of these edit(s)?

I find it very hard to believe that someone would not notice player development of this dramatic nature. Of course, if there were no sims after the edits, there would be no time for the owner to notice.

I would really like to see that question answered. I can't find it answered anywhere.

church · 06-18-2002, 12:31 PM

I am the owner of the Boston Red Sox in the RWBL. All id like to say is why is hornsmaniac so blind? Could he have 25 new owners ready to jump into the RWBL? i doubt it but sure he could. would it be the RWBL with 25 new owners? of course not, especially with 25 ORIGINAL owners of the RWBL wanting to continue on without hornsmaniacs involvement. This is a frustrating situation for the league. One person is holding it up, one person is the cancer in the league. Im sure its clear to everyone who that person is.

church · 06-18-2002, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Qrashman

I have one question that I haven't been able to figure out. Did these alleged edits to the players happen over a period of time or was it all at once? Were there any sims after the time of these edit(s)?

I would really like to see that question answered. I can't find it answered anywhere. [/B]

yes, there was at least one sim from what i understand. the owner that saw that players were altered only told a few people and they waited some time before releasing the information to the rest of the league.

Qrashman · 06-18-2002, 12:46 PM

but what I want to know is how in the world the owner of the receiving team could not notice the changes without reporting them. That is impossible, given the drastic changes that I were written about.

Not reporting those changes is cheating in itself!!!!!!!!

Draft Dodger · 06-18-2002, 12:51 PM

and you still have to ask (lord knows Subby has) why someone would "sabatoge" the commish's team by improving his players.

Andreas Raht · 06-18-2002, 01:05 PM

Responsible for that RWBL site and league is that guy who ordered the site. If the site's owner (commish) changes, the old commish should send me a mail and I will change my files accordingly. But at the moment my files show Jeff Willett as the commish, so he will get the new password. Of course.

If anybody wants to leave the league, his ID will not be freed! This could result in 50 leagues on our server each one using only one or two order IDs after some time.

If (almost) all members want to leave the league, lets say 10 of 12, the league will be closed. The IDs will all be freed then! They can be used in any other league then! So an idea would be to close the league and open a new one - probably using the same layout, why not, if you created it. And probably using the same league's name.

Dear Kyle, this is not against you or anybody else. I myself believe this whole mess must be a big misunderstanding or mistake. Simply because no seriously grownup would cheat an online league, right? But now you and the other owners are probably to separated to continue this league together... but the RWBL members should of course discuss this whole stuff on their own message board. It has nothing to do with OOTP in general and can surely be solved internal by the RWBL members.
Hopefully. I wish you luck!

06-18-2002, 10:03 AM	#43
bsak16 Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 18	Horns, I must have missed the part where that was said. I was hoping that it was just something you over looked because I know I dont check my minors everytime but I would notice if something drastic happened to one of them. Heck there arent that many. I was trying to be impartial to this whole matter but not anymore. Dont insult my intelligence. You deserve everything you get and that's coming at you. If you get the league name so be it. I could care less but your new GM's will find out what we already know. __________________ GM Philadelphia Phillies RWBL Co-Commish GM Yakult Swallows JBL GM Caracas Chupacabras LABL Co-Commish

06-18-2002, 10:10 AM	#44
Draft Dodger Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: formerly of the OTBL Posts: 4,113	well, I guess if the guy is going to use bold-face type, then what he's saying must be true... __________________ Draft Dodger (Anarchy: Anything goes. The Draft Dodger viewpoint.) Sophmoric[sic] Member of the OOTP Boards (It's not OOTP; it's your computer) 15 GB Webhosting for $6.95 a month IMO we are best off abandoning that sinking ship that is Off Topic to the rats infesting it and just starting a whole new Baseball Forum from scratch.

06-18-2002, 10:18 AM	#47
bsak16 Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 18	Horns, Childish?!?! There is nothing more childish than a cheater. I am not going to sabotage anything you will do that on your own. It's funny whenever there is trouble you're right in the middle of it. __________________ GM Philadelphia Phillies RWBL Co-Commish GM Yakult Swallows JBL GM Caracas Chupacabras LABL Co-Commish

06-18-2002, 10:30 AM	#50
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,182	Here is a bit of unsolicitated advice. Do with this what you want. I choose not to take sides, but I have read the various message boards, including the infamous deleted thread, I will attempt to not let my own opinions of what seems to have occurred come into play. Simply put, there is no denying that someone associated with the league was cheating. Who is the guilty party, is irrelevant; this is one of the biggest examples of cheating in an online league I've ever seen (among any online sports). Unfortunately HornsManiac, the cheating occurred during your time as the league commissioner, and the players edited on were your team. Whether you made the edits or not is irrelevant. At this point as long as you are associated with that league, the league's reputation will be sullied as people will associate the league and the events that took place under your watch with the league. If I were in your shoes, I would resign and have nothing more to do with the league. If you submitted your order ID, I'd try and get it back and go start a new league with your friends and those who'd step into the existing league if you stayed. What this will do is give you a fresh start and a chance to redeem yourself, the further you distance yourself from this whole situation the better of a chance there is to forget it and for your reputation to be restored. The rest of the league or those that would stay should keep the space, let them deal with the mess and try to clean up the leagues reputation. As unfortunate as this is to have happened, unfortunately since it happened to your team on your watch you will forever be associated with it. The added benefit of you stepping away, is if the league falters or once again shows signs of cheating you can sit back, laugh at them and say "I told you so". Meanwhile hopefully you're new league has managed to become successful and an enjoyable experience for all involved. Now I'm not saying you did everything or anything that has been alleged, but in my humble opinion (take it for what its worth (nothing)) the better sense of valor would be to step down completely, and rebuild your reputation in another league. Obviously you can make sure that you get your order ID back (as would any of the original owners who are going to stand by you), the onus would then shift to the other owners in the "old" league to try and restore the leagues reputation, and if the cheater is still in that group, then it's likely he/she/it may not be able to help themselves again and you'll be fully vindicated. If the cheater stays cloaked after that... well you've gotten a fresh start in a new league and the old league will build back its reputation. In any event I'd strongly suggest you get your order ID back and start a new league with a new name and a new group of owners to give yourself a fresh start and a chance to reclaim your reputation..... Use this advice as you see fit.... good luck to all of you involved in this... hopefully your next online league experience will be much better. Scott

06-18-2002, 10:38 AM	#51
HornsManiac Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: TEXAS Posts: 73	Andreas - PLEASE put this issue to rest. More than half of the posts in this thread are from people who have nothing to do with RWBL and never have in the past. This is only their malicious posting to keep this thread at the top and to make sure as many people as possible read it. You can also go to the online leagues forum and see the same thing happening. I guess they think that by damaging the name "HornsManiac" they think they are damaging me personally. I guess they think I would be stupid enough to use that name in the future. Andreas, I apologize for you having to filter through so many flames and so much trolling to sort this all out. I won't post in this thread again. You have all of my info in the emails and I will just wait to hear back from you via email. Many thanks, HornsManiac __________________ HOOK 'EM HORNS Texas Baseball 2002 Big XII Season Champs 2002 Big XII Tournament Champs 2002 Regional Champs 2002 Super Regional Champs 2002 National Champions

06-18-2002, 10:00 AM	#41
Subby Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 375	Why do you think you got framed? And by whom?

06-18-2002, 10:15 AM	#46
Subby Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 375	I'll repeat my question: Why do you think you were you framed? And by whom?

06-18-2002, 10:40 AM	#52
Subby Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 375	I'll repeat my question: Why do you think you were you framed? And by whom?

06-18-2002, 10:59 AM	#53
Fritz Minors (Single A) Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 81	i did it

06-18-2002, 11:12 AM	#54
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,951	I think this thread should be at the top. Why? So people can see it and be aware that there's something fishy with your league. It is my duty as a member of this community to help people where they need it. I would hate to see a new OOTPer get involved in your league and get spoiled on OOTP because you like to cheat.

06-18-2002, 12:31 PM	#56
church Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2002 Location: winnipeg, manitoba. Posts: 121	I am the owner of the Boston Red Sox in the RWBL. All id like to say is why is hornsmaniac so blind? Could he have 25 new owners ready to jump into the RWBL? i doubt it but sure he could. would it be the RWBL with 25 new owners? of course not, especially with 25 ORIGINAL owners of the RWBL wanting to continue on without hornsmaniacs involvement. This is a frustrating situation for the league. One person is holding it up, one person is the cancer in the league. Im sure its clear to everyone who that person is.

06-18-2002, 12:46 PM	#58
Qrashman All Star Reserve Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: NY Posts: 651	but what I want to know is how in the world the owner of the receiving team could not notice the changes without reporting them. That is impossible, given the drastic changes that I were written about. Not reporting those changes is cheating in itself!!!!!!!! __________________ ------------------- Montreal Expos / Calgary Storm, HBL HBL Baseball - Founded March 2001. HBL Waiting List

06-18-2002, 12:51 PM	#59
Draft Dodger Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: formerly of the OTBL Posts: 4,113	and you still have to ask (lord knows Subby has) why someone would "sabatoge" the commish's team by improving his players. __________________ Draft Dodger (Anarchy: Anything goes. The Draft Dodger viewpoint.) Sophmoric[sic] Member of the OOTP Boards (It's not OOTP; it's your computer) 15 GB Webhosting for $6.95 a month IMO we are best off abandoning that sinking ship that is Off Topic to the rats infesting it and just starting a whole new Baseball Forum from scratch.

06-18-2002, 01:05 PM	#60
Andreas Raht Administrator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hollern/Stade/Germany Posts: 8,992	Passwords changed Responsible for that RWBL site and league is that guy who ordered the site. If the site's owner (commish) changes, the old commish should send me a mail and I will change my files accordingly. But at the moment my files show Jeff Willett as the commish, so he will get the new password. Of course. If anybody wants to leave the league, his ID will not be freed! This could result in 50 leagues on our server each one using only one or two order IDs after some time. If (almost) all members want to leave the league, lets say 10 of 12, the league will be closed. The IDs will all be freed then! They can be used in any other league then! So an idea would be to close the league and open a new one - probably using the same layout, why not, if you created it. And probably using the same league's name. Dear Kyle, this is not against you or anybody else. I myself believe this whole mess must be a big misunderstanding or mistake. Simply because no seriously grownup would cheat an online league, right? But now you and the other owners are probably to separated to continue this league together... but the RWBL members should of course discuss this whole stuff on their own message board. It has nothing to do with OOTP in general and can surely be solved internal by the RWBL members. Hopefully. I wish you luck! __________________ Andreas Raht andreas@ootpdevelopments.com Out of the Park Developments