100% reproducable TOTAL game lockup - Page 2

Sublimity · 12-15-2005, 04:32 PM

I haven't tried to reproduce the error (because, umm, why?), but like Kuff-dawg said, I've minimized the game any number of times to go do something else, run something else, maximized things, and I haven't had this problem. Would an effective workaround be to minimize it?

ChrisH · 12-15-2005, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eriqjaffe

Because you're over-reacting at too late a stage.

1) As Steve said, the screensaver / lock PC issue has been around for years now. Plenty of time for you to find another game that works to your satisfaction.

2) The current codebase of OOTP is within 4-5 months of the end of it's life cycle anyways, so why wait until now to make your first posts about it?

Both points 1 and 2 have the same answer.

Due to the fact it's been a known problem for years that hasn't been fixed in many iterations of the program. There are otehr examples of BASIC gameplay that are busted. The scouts have nver worked right since the first version of OOTP 5, they did work then they got broke and it's never been bothered to be fixed. I've brought that up many times always for it to be shot down as irrelevent compared to a stat issue. Scouts are a major part to an online league that runs with them, having them work is essential but no unfortunately it's ignored.

Another issue is the fact that so many people get defensive of anything at all that is posted that is in the slightest way against OOTP, major 'fanboy-dom' that is not constructive, no one is slagging of anyone personally merely stating bugs that are present and have significant issues on the game.

I once kept a zip of a set of league files that are completely corrupted due to a very messed up export / import code mechanisum, Marcus said he wanted them then proceeded never to get in touch to actauuly receive them so he could work out the problem. I kept them for well over a year and reminded him, but again it was ignored.

spleen1015 · 12-15-2005, 05:15 PM

I'm a fanboy because I find your issue insignificant? I'm a fanboy because I've never found this issue to the big deal you are making it out to be? Whateva' homie!

RoadMovie · 12-15-2005, 05:24 PM

First off...I do want to say that I really do enjoy playing OOTP baseball. I think it's a fantastic game. I'm not trying to be like those two guys in the comic book store in the cut scenes of Chasing Amy(for those of you who have seen it).

The point to be taken from this is that some of the major problems have taken years to fix and been transported from generation to generation of the software. I'm going to guess(not having a strong programming background outside of web and database programming), that chunks of these big problems could have to do with bloat from modifying and adding on to code over the years, and maybe fixing that would have broken the game entirely. I don't know. I am perfectly willing to give OOTP7 and the total rewrite a try. In fact, I'm excited for it. If I'm understanding correctly, we should have an easier time writing programs to work with ootp due to the new db structure. That alone makes me tingly.

I'm willing to keep swinging this hammer, though, to make sure it's known that I expect major problems(like 100% cpu usage and this problem where it locks up quite regularly) to be fixed without having to wait for 3 or 4 full releases or a complete rewrite. I expect problem to arise. I just also expect the major ones to be taken seriously.

andymac · 12-15-2005, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoadMovie

I expect problem to arise. I just also expect the major ones to be taken seriously.

But this is considered a minor problem, not a major one, by about 95% of OOTP users.

sporr · 12-15-2005, 05:35 PM

I'm pretty sure there won't be another patch to 6.51a.

ChrisH · 12-15-2005, 05:36 PM

Personally I do consider it a major one.

I do normally close the program down due to this issue however it's not always possible! people do forget other things crop up.
Now the fact you have to forcibly terminate is where the major issue crops up in that in forcibly terminating the program corruption can and does occur. This programs database system is most definately not a particularly robust one and even looking at it can cause problems (ok that last bit is probably over the top

) however it gets the point over.

Now if when it looks up there was an option to CLEANLY shutdown the program then I'd agree it's a minor issue, but there isn't so to me at least (and it seems to a number of others in the thread) that makes is a major issue.

Andymac so you'd consider the other issue with here of the scouts being broken, a minor issue as well? (as I stated earlier this originally worked was broken and then never fixed in a good number of release despite me asking for it repeatedly and being told the reason was know for why it was broken) when this ruins a good proportion of what having them enabled in a online league uses them for.

Sublimity · 12-15-2005, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sublimity

Would an effective workaround be to minimize it?

Have you tried that? I'm genuinely curious since I haven't had this problem before.

spleen1015 · 12-15-2005, 05:39 PM

FYI, Esc brings up the 'Exit Program' dialogue box. Hit Esc, then press enter. The game should close normally. If it doesn't work the first time, try it twice.

I have always been able to close it by hitting Esc no more than twice.

EDIT - Obviously, you can't see it happen, but it will get your out of OOTP normally.

Steve Kuffrey · 12-15-2005, 05:46 PM

Not to take lightly anything in this thread BUT reality dictates that issues must be prioritized and then taken care of. This is a known issue and has been but not every issue brought up by every person can be corrected even if many want it or not. The issue is not one that cannot be avoided, is not one that many experience that I am aware of and as was stated and game progress demands that we will likely not see another 6.5 patch and that it is also possible that this may not even be an issue with the new incarnation of the game. Time to move on.

Pike · 12-15-2005, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eriqjaffe

Because you're over-reacting at too late a stage.

1) As Steve said, the screensaver / lock PC issue has been around for years now. Plenty of time for you to find another game that works to your satisfaction.

2) The current codebase of OOTP is within 4-5 months of the end of it's life cycle anyways, so why wait until now to make your first posts about it?

To answer question #1: I agree, it does give me good reason to try out one of the many other options available in this genre. If a problem has been around for years now, why isn't there a fix yet? This isn't the only problem I am having (see my lock up post in this same forum), so if something like this never gets fixed, can I really expect another lockup problem to be fixed as well?

To answer question #2: You incorrectly assume that I have had the game for a long time. I picked this game up less than 2 weeks ago, hence why I only just recently signed on to the forums and am only just now posting a problem. If a problem exists, then it is never "too late in the game". I should be able to expect a relatively bug free game for my $$$. So far I've encountered this rather annoying bug, and gamekilling bug that ended an otherwise enjoyable experience (detailed in my thread).

And yes spleen, you can be a smartass all you want, I never said you couldn't. I only remarked that there wasn't a need for it here.

ibdb · 12-15-2005, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spleen1015

FYI, Esc brings up the 'Exit Program' dialogue box. Hit Esc, then press enter. The game should close normally. If it doesn't work the first time, try it twice.

I have always been able to close it by hitting Esc no more than twice.

EDIT - Obviously, you can't see it happen, but it will get your out of OOTP normally.

I'll have to try that the next time it happens to me. On my desktop, I've avoided the problem. On my laptop, it happens EVERY TIME the screensaver activates. Since I'm a bit of a security freak, I've got the laptop set to activate screensaver and lock up pretty quickly -- so it's a bit of a pain.

And, no, I don't expect another patch. I do expect this to be tested for and worked on should it reappear in with the new code.

disposableheros · 12-15-2005, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisH

Personally I do consider it a major one.

I do normally close the program down due to this issue however it's not always possible! people do forget other things crop up.
Now the fact you have to forcibly terminate is where the major issue crops up in that in forcibly terminating the program corruption can and does occur. This programs database system is most definately not a particularly robust one and even looking at it can cause problems (ok that last bit is probably over the top

) however it gets the point over.

Now if when it looks up there was an option to CLEANLY shutdown the program then I'd agree it's a minor issue, but there isn't so to me at least (and it seems to a number of others in the thread) that makes is a major issue.

Andymac so you'd consider the other issue with here of the scouts being broken, a minor issue as well? (as I stated earlier this originally worked was broken and then never fixed in a good number of release despite me asking for it repeatedly and being told the reason was know for why it was broken) when this ruins a good proportion of what having them enabled in a online league uses them for.

funny how 90% of them are GMs in your league

edm · 12-15-2005, 11:35 PM

I've had this occur many times as well. I can always click ootp in taskbar (it won't allow you to see ootp) but you can then hit escape twice and it will save/close it.

QuestGAV · 12-15-2005, 11:39 PM

Like edm, this can be worked around if you know the program's interface well enough to operate it blind. This also occurs if you switch screen resolution while OOTP is open IIRC. Though not dealing with screen resolution switches optimally certainly isn't unique to OOTP, the potential loss of data makes it alot more serious.

But like others have said this version of the OOTP codebase is at its end. Fixing this would be like performing a tummy tuck on a 90 year old woman with Alzheimer's. Not worth the hassle you put the patient through, nevermind the doctor.

ChrisH · 12-16-2005, 04:31 AM

I have never heard of that blind mode control.
I'll instigate a test and see if it does indeed work for me in the situations I've got into. If it does, while not a fix, it will be a satisfactory short-term workaround, in the fact that at least it will shut the program down cleanly.

spleen1015 · 12-18-2005, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisH

I have never heard of that blind mode control.
I'll instigate a test and see if it does indeed work for me in the situations I've got into. If it does, while not a fix, it will be a satisfactory short-term workaround, in the fact that at least it will shut the program down cleanly.

For OOTP6.51a it is the only workaround since we're not getting any more patches.

Malleus Dei · 12-18-2005, 02:22 PM

I have the same problem and I work around it.

gmo · 12-18-2005, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

I have the same problem and I work around it.

I went to the doctor and said, "Doc, it hurts when I do this," and he told me, "then don't do that."

I really wanted to use that joke. Now I guess I am obliged to try to say something meaningful.

It is plenty fair to be bothered by a problem and to voice that. But there must be understanding that by the nature of software "bug-free" does not exist and that some problems are addressed but only by workarounds. Often the long-timers could be much more, er, something (diplomatic?), when addressing these issues even if for the umpteenth time, just as accusations of fanboy-ism and the company not caring need not be raised because the answer to the problem is not as good as wanted.

"Doc, no one cares when I make wishy-washy 'simmer down guys' posts!"
"Stop making those posts!"

Aordolin · 12-18-2005, 04:50 PM

ive seen this problem, basically if your system hibernates and sometimes with the screensaver it will freeze up and not come back. however I think you should just close it if your going to leave it for that long. how hard is it to just close it and start it back up agian. Takes 10 seconds. And put more than 5 minutes on your screensaver. Ive had lots of programs running though with OOTP running and never had a problem, unless your run something thats running in full screen. but then agian why not just close OOTP then?

12-15-2005, 04:32 PM	#21
Sublimity Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: This thread. Posts: 3,199	I haven't tried to reproduce the error (because, umm, why?), but like Kuff-dawg said, I've minimized the game any number of times to go do something else, run something else, maximized things, and I haven't had this problem. Would an effective workaround be to minimize it? __________________ mrs ria: I hereby dub Sublimity the Glorious Upholder of the 5B3. Current leading vote-getter in the Worst Poster in OT History poll.

12-15-2005, 05:24 PM	#24
RoadMovie Minors (Single A) Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 58	First off...I do want to say that I really do enjoy playing OOTP baseball. I think it's a fantastic game. I'm not trying to be like those two guys in the comic book store in the cut scenes of Chasing Amy(for those of you who have seen it). The point to be taken from this is that some of the major problems have taken years to fix and been transported from generation to generation of the software. I'm going to guess(not having a strong programming background outside of web and database programming), that chunks of these big problems could have to do with bloat from modifying and adding on to code over the years, and maybe fixing that would have broken the game entirely. I don't know. I am perfectly willing to give OOTP7 and the total rewrite a try. In fact, I'm excited for it. If I'm understanding correctly, we should have an easier time writing programs to work with ootp due to the new db structure. That alone makes me tingly. I'm willing to keep swinging this hammer, though, to make sure it's known that I expect major problems(like 100% cpu usage and this problem where it locks up quite regularly) to be fixed without having to wait for 3 or 4 full releases or a complete rewrite. I expect problem to arise. I just also expect the major ones to be taken seriously. __________________ ASAHI2 KC Athletics BOS St. Louis Cardinals UKBL Rough Riders 2008 2015 Champs Last edited by RoadMovie; 12-15-2005 at 05:26 PM.

12-15-2005, 05:36 PM	#27
ChrisH Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 110	Personally I do consider it a major one. I do normally close the program down due to this issue however it's not always possible! people do forget other things crop up. Now the fact you have to forcibly terminate is where the major issue crops up in that in forcibly terminating the program corruption can and does occur. This programs database system is most definately not a particularly robust one and even looking at it can cause problems (ok that last bit is probably over the top ) however it gets the point over. Now if when it looks up there was an option to CLEANLY shutdown the program then I'd agree it's a minor issue, but there isn't so to me at least (and it seems to a number of others in the thread) that makes is a major issue. Andymac so you'd consider the other issue with here of the scouts being broken, a minor issue as well? (as I stated earlier this originally worked was broken and then never fixed in a good number of release despite me asking for it repeatedly and being told the reason was know for why it was broken) when this ruins a good proportion of what having them enabled in a online league uses them for. __________________ Chris UKBL - For a fun time

12-15-2005, 05:46 PM	#30
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 17,022	Not to take lightly anything in this thread BUT reality dictates that issues must be prioritized and then taken care of. This is a known issue and has been but not every issue brought up by every person can be corrected even if many want it or not. The issue is not one that cannot be avoided, is not one that many experience that I am aware of and as was stated and game progress demands that we will likely not see another 6.5 patch and that it is also possible that this may not even be an issue with the new incarnation of the game. Time to move on. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ *DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays Epicenter Baseball League - Astros 2014 The CBL Rewind - Phillies '95

12-16-2005, 04:31 AM	#36
ChrisH Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 110	I have never heard of that blind mode control. I'll instigate a test and see if it does indeed work for me in the situations I've got into. If it does, while not a fix, it will be a satisfactory short-term workaround, in the fact that at least it will shut the program down cleanly. __________________ Chris UKBL - For a fun time

12-15-2005, 05:15 PM	#23
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,951	I'm a fanboy because I find your issue insignificant? I'm a fanboy because I've never found this issue to the big deal you are making it out to be? Whateva' homie!

12-15-2005, 05:35 PM	#26
sporr Global Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Muscatine, IA Posts: 8,277	I'm pretty sure there won't be another patch to 6.51a.

12-15-2005, 05:39 PM	#29
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,951	FYI, Esc brings up the 'Exit Program' dialogue box. Hit Esc, then press enter. The game should close normally. If it doesn't work the first time, try it twice. I have always been able to close it by hitting Esc no more than twice. EDIT - Obviously, you can't see it happen, but it will get your out of OOTP normally.

12-15-2005, 11:35 PM	#34
edm All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 1,991	I've had this occur many times as well. I can always click ootp in taskbar (it won't allow you to see ootp) but you can then hit escape twice and it will save/close it.

12-15-2005, 11:39 PM	#35
QuestGAV Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,008	Like edm, this can be worked around if you know the program's interface well enough to operate it blind. This also occurs if you switch screen resolution while OOTP is open IIRC. Though not dealing with screen resolution switches optimally certainly isn't unique to OOTP, the potential loss of data makes it alot more serious. But like others have said this version of the OOTP codebase is at its end. Fixing this would be like performing a tummy tuck on a 90 year old woman with Alzheimer's. Not worth the hassle you put the patient through, nevermind the doctor.

12-18-2005, 04:50 PM	#40
Aordolin All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 586	ive seen this problem, basically if your system hibernates and sometimes with the screensaver it will freeze up and not come back. however I think you should just close it if your going to leave it for that long. how hard is it to just close it and start it back up agian. Takes 10 seconds. And put more than 5 minutes on your screensaver. Ive had lots of programs running though with OOTP running and never had a problem, unless your run something thats running in full screen. but then agian why not just close OOTP then?