Still have to question the trade AI

tward13 · 03-18-2019, 04:05 PM

Started with the Mets. So I looked to move guys with no options who wouldn't go to the minors.

Shopped around Hechavarria, basically a back-up inf type. I have trade difficulty set to hard.

I received many offers, for players way to good. Would the Braves really be offering Josh Donaldson? They just signed him. That's just one example. Many very good relievers too. Lots of teams dumping salaries.

It's going to take a bit of self control not to abuse the AI

jimmysthebestcop · 03-18-2019, 04:08 PM

If you were on a small market team it wouldn't really help you all that much as you can't eat those contracts.

But being in a top 3 market yeah you can pretty much always eat the contract.

Financially Atlanta isn't top 10 team. So I can see that Josh contract being a big thing. If I took Atlanta over I would dump it too.

But overall I see what you mean. Think its more about financials then player vs player quality levels.

IanIachimoe · 03-18-2019, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tward13

Started with the Mets. So I looked to move guys with no options who wouldn't go to the minors.

Shopped around Hechavarria, basically a back-up inf type. I have trade difficulty set to hard.

I received many offers, for players way to good. Would the Braves really be offering Josh Donaldson? They just signed him. That's just one example. Many very good relievers too. Lots of teams dumping salaries.

It's going to take a bit of self control not to abuse the AI

LOL. just shopped & traded the same player.

chriskelly · 03-18-2019, 04:54 PM

you might be able to work around this by raising the budgets of all teams

backspace4353 · 03-18-2019, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tward13

Started with the Mets. So I looked to move guys with no options who wouldn't go to the minors.

Shopped around Hechavarria, basically a back-up inf type. I have trade difficulty set to hard.

I received many offers, for players way to good. Would the Braves really be offering Josh Donaldson? They just signed him. That's just one example. Many very good relievers too. Lots of teams dumping salaries.

It's going to take a bit of self control not to abuse the AI

I hate that about the trade AI. Sorry to see it still signs players to over priced contracts and then the next day tries to offload them. Doesn't make sense. Most likely Donaldson has a very large contract and they are trying to offload it for anyone.

BMW · 03-18-2019, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by backspace4353

I hate that about the trade AI. Sorry to see it still signs players to over priced contracts and then the next day tries to offload them. Doesn't make sense. Most likely Donaldson has a very large contract and they are trying to offload it for anyone.

Honestly, a fantastic way to fix this would be to simply have a cooldown on player signings. In order to get human-like behavior, do what a human would do. They are very unlikely to sign or trade for a guy and immediately offer that same person up in a trade, unless the deal was something that was patently ridiculous in their favor.

backspace4353 · 03-18-2019, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMW

Honestly, a fantastic way to fix this would be to simply have a cooldown on player signings. In order to get human-like behavior, do what a human would do. They are very unlikely to sign or trade for a guy and immediately offer that same person up in a trade, unless the deal was something that was patently ridiculous in their favor.

I was thinking something similar. How about they just code in when a team signs a star player to the large contract, the team will keep that player for 50%( or at least the first two years) of the length of the new contract before offering them up for a trade. I think you could even make it so after the first year of the contract if a new GM is hired then that would erase the code and allow the new GM to trade that player if it wishes to.

tward13 · 03-18-2019, 07:00 PM

But the game came with Donaldson on the Braves. He was signed by them in real life.

I realize that the moment I advance a day nothing is as it was in real life, but the AI GMs should behave somewhat like the real life teams. At least initially. Maybe the budgets are set incorrectly? Whatever it is, the Braves AI's first thought shouldn't be to dump a good player even up for bench depth.

Danbo80 · 03-18-2019, 07:30 PM

Or at least wait for the trade deadline. Maybe the Braves can make the playoffs with Donaldson, in which case he would have more value to them. They should at least see how good they are before unloading players

wallewalls · 03-18-2019, 07:41 PM

I always turn trading off until the draft passes in the first season. That way you dont get trades that dont quite work at the start. By waiting a bit I guess there are more ways to explain trades depending on what happened in the league so far

DaBears · 03-18-2019, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wallewalls

I always turn trading off until the draft passes in the first season. That way you dont get trades that dont quite work at the start. By waiting a bit I guess there are more ways to explain trades depending on what happened in the league so far

I have found this to be a good tactic as well.

tward13 · 03-18-2019, 08:53 PM

Which only indicates that the roster management and/or trade AI still have issues. People have been using house rules for years due to these issues.

MizzouRah · 03-18-2019, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tward13

Started with the Mets. So I looked to move guys with no options who wouldn't go to the minors.

Shopped around Hechavarria, basically a back-up inf type. I have trade difficulty set to hard.

I received many offers, for players way to good. Would the Braves really be offering Josh Donaldson? They just signed him. That's just one example. Many very good relievers too. Lots of teams dumping salaries.

It's going to take a bit of self control not to abuse the AI

Honestly.. the AI doesn't know the player was just signed, so like some have said, it's dumping salary. I like the suggestion of a "cool off" period after a player is signed, unless of course a team or human GM'd team offers a ton for said player.

The first year playing an MLB setup is typically some unrealistic trading as the AI is playing the way it has been programmed to play so it's not going to mirror real life.

*the trade block will always have high salary players in their last year of their contract, which the player wants the same or more money long term so the AI wants to dump them and get something in return

tward13 · 03-18-2019, 10:05 PM

I suggest that it's not programmed correctly if a bench infielder can bring back quality starters. It's not programmed correctly if it's a baseball game AI and it doesn't act like baseball GMs.

I must need to "know" that the player has just signed if necessary. This wasn't me asking for these players in a trade, they were offered to me by the AI.

pgjocki · 03-18-2019, 10:49 PM

On the other hand the AI might feel it's fleecing you by dumping a broken down fragile 3B making $20 million a year for a capable infielder/depth player for $600k. I'd be upset if the AI didn't try that strategy.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

CurlyKarkovice · 03-18-2019, 11:34 PM

Interesting tactic. Anybody toggle the ability to trade draft picks ON? I feel like that would cause mayhem but I might be old school.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wallewalls

I always turn trading off until the draft passes in the first season. That way you dont get trades that dont quite work at the start. By waiting a bit I guess there are more ways to explain trades depending on what happened in the league so far

Arobbins · 03-18-2019, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurlyKarkovice

Interesting tactic. Anybody toggle the ability to trade draft picks ON? I feel like that would cause mayhem but I might be old school.

I've put the whole reserve roster on the block and haven't been able to complete any that involve draft picks yet. It's almost like the AI doesn't recognize the picks at all.

Shake Appeal · 03-19-2019, 05:43 AM

Football Manager uses a similar "cooling off" period where teams and players are simply uninterested in moving if they've recently been traded. It doesn't work with players who are traded before the gameworld is created, though, so it wouldn't protect Donaldson in this instance.

FM also lets you disable trades until the first transfer window (January, after the season starts in August) when setting up a new game.

wallewalls · 03-19-2019, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurlyKarkovice

Interesting tactic. Anybody toggle the ability to trade draft picks ON? I feel like that would cause mayhem but I might be old school.

I've had it on in the past and it just makes it easier to fleece the AI so I no longer use it

MizzouRah · 03-19-2019, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgjocki

On the other hand the AI might feel it's fleecing you by dumping a broken down fragile 3B making $20 million a year for a capable infielder/depth player for $600k. I'd be upset if the AI didn't try that strategy.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

Starting with v19, I haven't had one trade where in the end maybe several years down the road, it didn't finally make sense. It actually might be smarter than real life GM's in most cases.

03-18-2019, 04:05 PM	#1
tward13 All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,957	Still have to question the trade AI Started with the Mets. So I looked to move guys with no options who wouldn't go to the minors. Shopped around Hechavarria, basically a back-up inf type. I have trade difficulty set to hard. I received many offers, for players way to good. Would the Braves really be offering Josh Donaldson? They just signed him. That's just one example. Many very good relievers too. Lots of teams dumping salaries. It's going to take a bit of self control not to abuse the AI

03-18-2019, 10:49 PM	#15
pgjocki All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Maryland - just outside DC Posts: 1,483	On the other hand the AI might feel it's fleecing you by dumping a broken down fragile 3B making $20 million a year for a capable infielder/depth player for $600k. I'd be upset if the AI didn't try that strategy. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk __________________ - - - World Series championships: 1926, 1931, 1934, 1942, 1944, 1946, 1964, 1967, 1982, 2006, 2011

03-18-2019, 04:08 PM	#2
jimmysthebestcop Banned Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 1,728 Infractions: 0/2 (5)	If you were on a small market team it wouldn't really help you all that much as you can't eat those contracts. But being in a top 3 market yeah you can pretty much always eat the contract. Financially Atlanta isn't top 10 team. So I can see that Josh contract being a big thing. If I took Atlanta over I would dump it too. But overall I see what you mean. Think its more about financials then player vs player quality levels.

03-18-2019, 04:54 PM	#4
chriskelly All Star Reserve Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 738	you might be able to work around this by raising the budgets of all teams

03-18-2019, 07:00 PM	#8
tward13 All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,957	But the game came with Donaldson on the Braves. He was signed by them in real life. I realize that the moment I advance a day nothing is as it was in real life, but the AI GMs should behave somewhat like the real life teams. At least initially. Maybe the budgets are set incorrectly? Whatever it is, the Braves AI's first thought shouldn't be to dump a good player even up for bench depth.

03-18-2019, 07:30 PM	#9
Danbo80 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 72	Or at least wait for the trade deadline. Maybe the Braves can make the playoffs with Donaldson, in which case he would have more value to them. They should at least see how good they are before unloading players

03-18-2019, 07:41 PM	#10
wallewalls All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 774	I always turn trading off until the draft passes in the first season. That way you dont get trades that dont quite work at the start. By waiting a bit I guess there are more ways to explain trades depending on what happened in the league so far

03-18-2019, 08:53 PM	#12
tward13 All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,957	Which only indicates that the roster management and/or trade AI still have issues. People have been using house rules for years due to these issues.

03-18-2019, 10:05 PM	#14
tward13 All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,957	I suggest that it's not programmed correctly if a bench infielder can bring back quality starters. It's not programmed correctly if it's a baseball game AI and it doesn't act like baseball GMs. I must need to "know" that the player has just signed if necessary. This wasn't me asking for these players in a trade, they were offered to me by the AI.

03-19-2019, 05:43 AM	#18
Shake Appeal Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 104	Football Manager uses a similar "cooling off" period where teams and players are simply uninterested in moving if they've recently been traded. It doesn't work with players who are traded before the gameworld is created, though, so it wouldn't protect Donaldson in this instance. FM also lets you disable trades until the first transfer window (January, after the season starts in August) when setting up a new game.