Is anyone planning to make roster sets based on 19th century leagues

canadiancreed · 05-27-2006, 09:10 PM

Because if so, I'd be very interested in such a project as I'd be in need of a lot of players for a future project that I have in mind

SO is there anyone that is looking into such a task at present or in the near future??

Garlon · 05-27-2006, 09:43 PM

I am planning on releasing an 1871 starter league file after Arod23 and I finish our DB.

canadiancreed · 05-27-2006, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garlon

I am planning on releasing an 1871 starter league file after Arod23 and I finish our DB.

thar'd be cool. What leagues and level of completeness does this DB have?

Also I"m assuming that anything that pre-dates the National League is almost impossible to find players for?

Garlon · 05-27-2006, 09:50 PM

The DB goes back to 1871, includes National Association, National League, and American Association. We are dumping out almost all of the Union Association players and many of the Players League players though.

canadiancreed · 05-27-2006, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garlon

The DB goes back to 1871, includes National Association, National League, and American Association. We are dumping out almost all of the Union Association players and many of the Players League players though.

Hmm 1871, that's pretty impressive. I assume records before that are sketchy at best for the amateur ranks (I forget what the name of that league was, I ahve ti listed in another thread).

Also if I may ask, how come you're dumping the players from these two leagues?

disposableheros · 05-27-2006, 09:54 PM

its not that difficult to find names of players who played pre-1871, but finding any info on their abilities is tough and then translating those into something meaningful in relation to stats for a usable database is even tougher.

i gave up trying to add them to a DB i've been working on for the last few months.

Garlon · 05-27-2006, 10:02 PM

We are probably dunping all but 14 of the Union Association players because it should not be considered a major league. If we don't dump them out, when you get to 1884 in a historical simulation your rookie draft will be flooded with all of these guys who played in a league that only lasted a single season and they'll of course be in you OOTP league for full careers. We just didn't want these guys infiltrating an OOTP league dedicated to historical major league simulation.

The sam thing pretty much goes for the 1890 Players League, however we are keeping anyone who played in that league but also had significant time in the real major leagues.

canadiancreed · 05-27-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garlon

We are probably dunping all but 14 of the Union Association players because it should not be considered a major league. If we don't dump them out, when you get to 1884 in a historical simulation your rookie draft will be flooded with all of these guys who played in a league that only lasted a single season and they'll of course be in you OOTP league for full careers. We just didn't want these guys infiltrating an OOTP league dedicated to historical major league simulation.

The sam thing pretty much goes for the 1890 Players League, however we are keeping anyone who played in that league but also had significant time in the real major leagues.

wel the way I look at it, once the league folds (or even if it folds for us folks that do alt. history), they'd probably be so crappy that they'd either sit in the low minors or stay unemployed.

That's just my suggestiosn though.

Garlon · 05-27-2006, 10:15 PM

That's not what happens tho actually. The 1884 Union Association was a bogus league. You had guys who played in that league and hit over .350, but couldn't hit .125 in the real major during trial periods. There's nothing OOTP that says playyer X had a 1-year career so he will scrub out after 1 season in OOTP. Let's say we keep these guys in and there's some guy who hit .350 in the UA....he imports with a great contact rating and will be a dominant player against other real major leaguers when we know that shouldn't be the case. Of course I could modify the stats of all these players to look like majo league stats, but even then we'd still be flooding the major leagues with all these 1-year players. It's just not something we wanted to have with our DB.

You can get all of those guys straight out of the lahman DB of course.

Vris · 05-29-2006, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garlon

That's not what happens tho actually. The 1884 Union Association was a bogus league. You had guys who played in that league and hit over .350, but couldn't hit .125 in the real major during trial periods. There's nothing OOTP that says playyer X had a 1-year career so he will scrub out after 1 season in OOTP. Let's say we keep these guys in and there's some guy who hit .350 in the UA....he imports with a great contact rating and will be a dominant player against other real major leaguers when we know that shouldn't be the case. Of course I could modify the stats of all these players to look like majo league stats, but even then we'd still be flooding the major leagues with all these 1-year players. It's just not something we wanted to have with our DB.

You can get all of those guys straight out of the lahman DB of course.

Or, with the new game, set the Union Association to about .25 of what the major leagues at the time are at.

swampdragon · 05-30-2006, 12:51 AM

I ran over to paper of record to check out old copies of the Sporting News. In 1901, you had, in addition to the two major leagues, about a dozen minor leagues significant enough to have their box scores listed. The three AAA leagues all formed sometime in the 19th century under different names. The Western Association, the Eastern League, and the California League eventually formed the core of the American Association, the International League, and the Pacific Coast League respectively. There was also a Western League, a Southern League/Association with 12 teams in 1893, a Connecticut League, the Three I League, and others. I don't know the dates all these were actually formed, but since we can't add and delete leagues I guess it's not important.

canadiancreed · 05-30-2006, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swampdragon

I ran over to paper of record to check out old copies of the Sporting News. In 1901, you had, in addition to the two major leagues, about a dozen minor leagues significant enough to have their box scores listed. The three AAA leagues all formed sometime in the 19th century under different names. The Western Association, the Eastern League, and the California League eventually formed the core of the American Association, the International League, and the Pacific Coast League respectively. There was also a Western League, a Southern League/Association with 12 teams in 1893, a Connecticut League, the Three I League, and others. I don't know the dates all these were actually formed, but since we can't add and delete leagues I guess it's not important.

but can you not add and remove sub-leagues? Either way if worse comes to wose I'll just do it like we ahve too in OOTP6 or something.

05-27-2006, 09:10 PM	#1
canadiancreed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 11,660 Blog Entries: 1	Is anyone planning to make roster sets based on 19th century leagues Because if so, I'd be very interested in such a project as I'd be in need of a lot of players for a future project that I have in mind SO is there anyone that is looking into such a task at present or in the near future?? __________________ PT21 PT22

05-27-2006, 09:54 PM	#6
disposableheros Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 4,332	its not that difficult to find names of players who played pre-1871, but finding any info on their abilities is tough and then translating those into something meaningful in relation to stats for a usable database is even tougher. i gave up trying to add them to a DB i've been working on for the last few months. __________________ 2 Wild Cards, 11 Division Champs, 4 League Champs, 3 World Champs, and 3 Best GM awards Baseball Maelstrom - New York Mets - 180-149 .547 Corporate League Baseball - Coke Buzz - 889-649 .578 Western Hemisphere Baseball League - Santiago Saints - 672-793 .459 Record - 2428-2271 .517

05-30-2006, 12:51 AM	#11
swampdragon Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: The Lonely Mountain Posts: 2,509	I ran over to paper of record to check out old copies of the Sporting News. In 1901, you had, in addition to the two major leagues, about a dozen minor leagues significant enough to have their box scores listed. The three AAA leagues all formed sometime in the 19th century under different names. The Western Association, the Eastern League, and the California League eventually formed the core of the American Association, the International League, and the Pacific Coast League respectively. There was also a Western League, a Southern League/Association with 12 teams in 1893, a Connecticut League, the Three I League, and others. I don't know the dates all these were actually formed, but since we can't add and delete leagues I guess it's not important. __________________ “Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies." -- C.S. Lewis

05-27-2006, 09:43 PM	#2
Garlon Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,751	I am planning on releasing an 1871 starter league file after Arod23 and I finish our DB.

05-27-2006, 09:50 PM	#4
Garlon Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,751	The DB goes back to 1871, includes National Association, National League, and American Association. We are dumping out almost all of the Union Association players and many of the Players League players though.

05-27-2006, 10:02 PM	#7
Garlon Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,751	We are probably dunping all but 14 of the Union Association players because it should not be considered a major league. If we don't dump them out, when you get to 1884 in a historical simulation your rookie draft will be flooded with all of these guys who played in a league that only lasted a single season and they'll of course be in you OOTP league for full careers. We just didn't want these guys infiltrating an OOTP league dedicated to historical major league simulation. The sam thing pretty much goes for the 1890 Players League, however we are keeping anyone who played in that league but also had significant time in the real major leagues.

05-27-2006, 10:15 PM	#9
Garlon Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,751	That's not what happens tho actually. The 1884 Union Association was a bogus league. You had guys who played in that league and hit over .350, but couldn't hit .125 in the real major during trial periods. There's nothing OOTP that says playyer X had a 1-year career so he will scrub out after 1 season in OOTP. Let's say we keep these guys in and there's some guy who hit .350 in the UA....he imports with a great contact rating and will be a dominant player against other real major leaguers when we know that shouldn't be the case. Of course I could modify the stats of all these players to look like majo league stats, but even then we'd still be flooding the major leagues with all these 1-year players. It's just not something we wanted to have with our DB. You can get all of those guys straight out of the lahman DB of course.