Bullpen Usage

CMH · 04-18-2015, 02:30 PM

This has been extremely frustrating during simming. It's been an issue for years and the inclusion of more detailed bullpen usage was meant to resolve it.

I'm not sure it has, or perhaps I'm just not using the feature correctly.

I have my bullpen set up in a very specific way and my arms are not used as intended. This, by the way, when all relievers are rested.

Some examples:

I have a bullpen arm set to only face left-handed batters. This is almost always never the case. He will come in to face a left-hander and then remain in the game to face several righties, ultimately surrendering ones because he has no business facing righties. (Again, this is immediately after the starter has thrown).

In a particular situation, this reliever came into the game in the 8th to get the left-hander out. He shut the door down. My team was up one run with a fresh closer. The lefty stayed in the game to face right-handed hitters in the 9th and proceeded to surrender the game-tying home run to a righty. Guess who came into the game immediately? The closer. That sort of mismanagement shouldn't happen when it's made clear in my bullpen usage settings.

In another game, I have a fresh reliever who is set to use more often as a middle reliever. Yet, while fresh and ready to go, this reliever was not used in a game in which my team was down 1-0. Instead, a reliever who is set to only throw in the 7th as a set-up arm was used.

I don't understand this scenario. Why would the game not use my middle reliever when my set-up guy isn't in position to hold the score? That reliever then surrendered five runs. That of course is inconsequential. Things happen and he should have been effective enough to shut down the hitters. The real point is, he should have never come into the game when I have a reliever set to handle that spot in the 7th.

Making matters worse, when that reliever gave up 2 runs in the 7th, he was not replaced for the fresh middle reliever I want to use more often. Instead, this short stamina set-up man stayed in the game to pitch in the 8th and surrender 3 more runs before finishing the inning. He threw 43 pitches in total, half of which were likely unnecessary.

I want to build my team's bullpen similar to how Kansas City ran it, but while there are options that allow for this sort of management, it becomes impossible when those instructions are not followed.

I have v16 and haven't tested how it works in that because I'm not in any online leagues that use the version just yet. But I'm not confident this has been fixed.

All I ask is that the instructions are followed to the letter with exception being scenarios in which an instructed arm is exhausted and therefore should be skipped over. In addition, can specialist just be used as specialists? It would be nice.

RchW · 04-18-2015, 07:02 PM

Bullpen management is a serious issue IMO. As you suggest the AI appears to bypass the human player settings and uses RP according to its own criteria. I just finished a season where the AI obviously did not like 3/7 of my bullpen and overused two low stamina RP to the point of exhaustion. There is no doubt in my mind that RP usage is not tied to assigned roles except for closer. This applies to v15 and v16

I should have done a better job of documenting this in beta. Let me collect some data and try again.

CMH · 04-18-2015, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RchW

Bullpen management is a serious issue IMO. As you suggest the AI appears to bypass the human player settings and uses RP according to its own criteria. I just finished a season where the AI obviously did not like 3/7 of my bullpen and overused two low stamina RP to the point of exhaustion. There is no doubt in my mind that RP usage is not tied to assigned roles except for closer. This applies to v15 and v16

I should have done a better job of documenting this in beta. Let me collect some data and try again.

What I've noticed, or at least feel I've noticed, is the AI will sort of use your settings but it also has it's own pre-determined feelings about each of your relievers.

If you choose a reliever to be in high usage that the AI feels is not a good enough reliever, it will bypass that decision in order to put in a reliever it believes is more suitable to handle the task.

Sometimes this is beneficial. But, when the AI does this, it leads to scenarios down the line in which your relievers are not as fresh as they should be and creates a domino effect that forces it to override your settings because specific relievers are exhausted.

I've seen scenarios where I had an awful bullpen but a dominant closer and that closer made nearly 70 appearances while saving 35 or so games. Sure, you want your arms to not get rusty, but understand that this closer was basically pitching every other day.

It created scenarios where my team blew games in the 9th because my closer was exhausted and could not come into the game, so the AI was forced to use whichever reliever was fresh.

I consider this decision making similar to police officers directing traffic when there are already traffic lights that do a good job of it.

The Game · 04-19-2015, 01:05 AM

I have had the issue of the lefty specialist never being used. My lefty specialist pitched 3 innings in August and most of those were when I played out games and he came in to face 1-2 batters.

CMH · 04-19-2015, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Game

I have had the issue of the lefty specialist never being used. My lefty specialist pitched 3 innings in August and most of those were when I played out games and he came in to face 1-2 batters.

That I used to see in version 14. I haven't seen it in 15 so much. But could just be the way we build our bullpens. I'd bet those differences cause varying results.

My lefties simply just come in to face righties. I'm okay with it if the rest of my bullpen is tired. I get it. But when I have a fresh middle reliever or set-up guy, I would prefer they come in to face a right-handed hitter before my LOOGY even sniffs the ballgame.

04-18-2015, 02:30 PM	#1
CMH Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,057	Bullpen Usage This has been extremely frustrating during simming. It's been an issue for years and the inclusion of more detailed bullpen usage was meant to resolve it. I'm not sure it has, or perhaps I'm just not using the feature correctly. I have my bullpen set up in a very specific way and my arms are not used as intended. This, by the way, when all relievers are rested. Some examples: I have a bullpen arm set to only face left-handed batters. This is almost always never the case. He will come in to face a left-hander and then remain in the game to face several righties, ultimately surrendering ones because he has no business facing righties. (Again, this is immediately after the starter has thrown). In a particular situation, this reliever came into the game in the 8th to get the left-hander out. He shut the door down. My team was up one run with a fresh closer. The lefty stayed in the game to face right-handed hitters in the 9th and proceeded to surrender the game-tying home run to a righty. Guess who came into the game immediately? The closer. That sort of mismanagement shouldn't happen when it's made clear in my bullpen usage settings. In another game, I have a fresh reliever who is set to use more often as a middle reliever. Yet, while fresh and ready to go, this reliever was not used in a game in which my team was down 1-0. Instead, a reliever who is set to only throw in the 7th as a set-up arm was used. I don't understand this scenario. Why would the game not use my middle reliever when my set-up guy isn't in position to hold the score? That reliever then surrendered five runs. That of course is inconsequential. Things happen and he should have been effective enough to shut down the hitters. The real point is, he should have never come into the game when I have a reliever set to handle that spot in the 7th. Making matters worse, when that reliever gave up 2 runs in the 7th, he was not replaced for the fresh middle reliever I want to use more often. Instead, this short stamina set-up man stayed in the game to pitch in the 8th and surrender 3 more runs before finishing the inning. He threw 43 pitches in total, half of which were likely unnecessary. I want to build my team's bullpen similar to how Kansas City ran it, but while there are options that allow for this sort of management, it becomes impossible when those instructions are not followed. I have v16 and haven't tested how it works in that because I'm not in any online leagues that use the version just yet. But I'm not confident this has been fixed. All I ask is that the instructions are followed to the letter with exception being scenarios in which an instructed arm is exhausted and therefore should be skipped over. In addition, can specialist just be used as specialists? It would be nice.

04-18-2015, 07:02 PM	#2
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: The big smoke Posts: 15,628	Bullpen management is a serious issue IMO. As you suggest the AI appears to bypass the human player settings and uses RP according to its own criteria. I just finished a season where the AI obviously did not like 3/7 of my bullpen and overused two low stamina RP to the point of exhaustion. There is no doubt in my mind that RP usage is not tied to assigned roles except for closer. This applies to v15 and v16 I should have done a better job of documenting this in beta. Let me collect some data and try again. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

04-19-2015, 01:05 AM	#4
The Game Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Inside The Game Posts: 30,803	I have had the issue of the lefty specialist never being used. My lefty specialist pitched 3 innings in August and most of those were when I played out games and he came in to face 1-2 batters. __________________ Go today don't wait for tomorrow It isn't promised, all the time you get borrowed Don't live your life for other people Don't bottle your emotions till they crack and fill a couple just sorrows Take your mind and refocus go get a paper write your goals out Throw your middle fingers to all your haters "Stay Strong"