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Old 10-08-2019, 12:40 PM   #1
daves
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Hold Runners rating?

Is there a pitching stat showing how many stolen bases and caught steals against a certain pitcher? I know there is a catcher stat, but I want to review the relevance of the Hold runners rating on the pitching card.
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Old 10-08-2019, 12:43 PM   #2
Orcin
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Look at the pitcher stats and change the view to opponent's batting stats.
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Old 10-08-2019, 12:43 PM   #3
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Pitching Stats --> View --> Opponent Batting Stats
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Old 10-08-2019, 01:48 PM   #4
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wow, I didn't know about that view. Cool.

Just checked my staff and am not finding much of a pattern between HOLD rating and CS%. Here are the numbers (minimum 5k batters faced in perfect level)

Johan Santana - 90 HOLD rating - 34.1% CS
Willie Hernandez - 87 HOLD rating - 33.8% CS
Warren Spahn - 79 HOLD rating - 34% CS
Max Scherzer - 68 HOLD rating - 32.1% CS
Garland Braxton - 63 HOLD rating - 34.9 % CS
Whit Wyatt - 63 HOLD rating - 33.6% CS
Dennis Eckersley - 59 HOLD rating - 40% CS

At first it looks like the pattern you expect to see, but then Braxton & Eckersley are notable outliers. Two out of three expected to be the worst, are actually the best, so that's kind of crazy.

I prioritize the hold runner rating pretty highly...maybe some teams with more extreme low ratings will show more of a pattern.
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Old 10-08-2019, 01:54 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by chazzycat View Post
wow, I didn't know about that view. Cool.

Just checked my staff and am not finding much of a pattern between HOLD rating and CS%. Here are the numbers (minimum 5k batters faced in perfect level)

Johan Santana - 90 HOLD rating - 34.1% CS
Willie Hernandez - 87 HOLD rating - 33.8% CS
Warren Spahn - 79 HOLD rating - 34% CS
Max Scherzer - 68 HOLD rating - 32.1% CS
Garland Braxton - 63 HOLD rating - 34.9 % CS
Whit Wyatt - 63 HOLD rating - 33.6% CS
Dennis Eckersley - 59 HOLD rating - 40% CS

At first it looks like the pattern you expect to see, but then Braxton & Eckersley are notable outliers. Two out of three expected to be the worst, are actually the best, so that's kind of crazy.

I prioritize the hold runner rating pretty highly...maybe some teams with more extreme low ratings will show more of a pattern.
That doesn't necessarily seem like the best way to evaluate the hold rating. Wouldn't you actually need to know how many SBs are attempted on average vs how many are attempted on an individual pitcher? Presumably, hold runner actually discourages SB attempts, but I'm not sure it follows that it would have any impact on how many SB attempts fail.
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:01 PM   #6
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Maybe a good combo to have is a pitcher with low holding and a catcher with high arm strength. The 'ol Maddux/Pudge combo.

I checked my Maddux with 7 Hold, and he has had a 67% SB success against him over many seasons, which seems pretty average. I've mostly had good catchers on that team.
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:05 PM   #7
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Wouldn't you actually need to know how many SBs are attempted on average vs how many are attempted on an individual pitcher? Presumably, hold runner actually discourages SB attempts, but I'm not sure it follows that it would have any impact on how many SB attempts fail.
then I think you just end up measuring which pitchers have the best opponents OBP.
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:11 PM   #8
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That doesn't necessarily seem like the best way to evaluate the hold rating. Wouldn't you actually need to know how many SBs are attempted on average vs how many are attempted on an individual pitcher? Presumably, hold runner actually discourages SB attempts, but I'm not sure it follows that it would have any impact on how many SB attempts fail.
There is a saying in baseball that a stolen base is on the Pitcher not the Catcher. Also, lack of holding runners may allow for higher base running success. I am not sure OOTP depicts this or not?

Perfect Greg Maddux is an awesome card, but do teams run on him well since he has a 17 hold runner rating?
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Old 10-08-2019, 04:03 PM   #9
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At first it looks like the pattern you expect to see, but then Braxton & Eckersley are notable outliers.
I'd be curious to learn if Braxton's left handedness played any role in either the performance or the rating itself.
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Old 10-08-2019, 04:24 PM   #10
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There is a saying in baseball that a stolen base is on the Pitcher not the Catcher.
It's actually one of the quotes they show in-game during loading screens.

"When you steal a base, 99 percent of the time you steal on a pitcher. You actually never steal on a catcher". - Lou Brock
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Old 10-08-2019, 04:37 PM   #11
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It's actually one of the quotes they show in-game during loading screens.

"When you steal a base, 99 percent of the time you steal on a pitcher. You actually never steal on a catcher". - Lou Brock


LOL. If Lou said it, it must be true!


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