NFL 2019 Thread

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

I'm not Patriots fan. But in what manner did Brady cheat? I played a lot of football in my life and this entire conversation regarding the air pressure in the ball really showed me who never played a football game in their life. Sometimes certain topics and the things they say about them can truly expose people for what they truly do not know.

The "you can't prove anything" argument doesn't make Brady 100% innocent. I have Brady #1, I'm just saying there's an argument that could conceivably be made.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by BaseballMan

Not really a fair comparison. You would not put Dilfer in Marino's class with or without a championship. I don't think most people would compare those two players as being on the same field of greatness. A better comparison would be between Marino and Elway. If anyone even considered Dilfer a better qb, its probably time to watch another sport.
But does Elway's championships get him over the top or did Marino play on worst teams? I think Marino could have won the 2 championships with those bronco teams but i'm not sure he could have led them to Elway's other 3 super bowls. Could Elway have led the Dolphins to more super bowls i dont know.

You also have to factor in the way the game is played when comparing qbs. Marino passing for 5,000 yds was harder to do back then.

Actually a good comparison is Steve Young and Joe Montana. Montana gets all the praise while Young is barely mentioned. This is solely due to the championships. But watching the games during that time there was virtually no drop off from Montana to Young.

The problem Young had was that he constantly faced a juggernaut in the Cowboys, Montana had no such opponent. Only one year did he face a declining Cowboys team and barely squeaked out a victory. Young faced a formidable rival every year.

The 1990 playoff game between the 49ers and Giants was a great example. While Montana struggled all game to move the ball and was finally knocked out of the game with an injury, Young came in and moved the ball effortlessly. Made it look easy. If not for a Roget Craig fumble in the final minutes the 49ers go on to win that Super Bowl.

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

The "you can't prove anything" argument doesn't make Brady 100% innocent. I have Brady #1, I'm just saying there's an argument that could conceivably be made.

I'm not using the "you can't prove anything" argument. I'm asking what he did to cheat? The PSI in a football has no impact on a game or its results. Not one iota. Those who talk about it as if it does expose themselves as to what little they actually know. They're being laughed at. Now, besides that non issue, what has he done to cheat?

[low]

Two things. First, the Lions got screwed by the refs tonight. No two ways about it.

Also, if I recall correctly, Rodgers' last 4 INTs over the last two seasons have come from dropped/tipped balls by his own receivers.

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

I'm not using the "you can't prove anything" argument. I'm asking what he did to cheat? The PSI in a football has no impact on a game or its results. Not one iota. Those who talk about it as if it does expose themselves as to what little they actually know. They're being laughed at. Now, besides that non issue, what has he done to cheat?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spygate_(NFL)

[monkeyman576]

Anyways, here are my top 10 G.O.A.T


1. Tom Brady
2. Jim Brown
3. Joe Montana
4. Lawrence Taylor
5. Walter Payton
6. Reggie White
7. Joe Greene
8. John Elway
9. Jerry Rice
10. Barry Sanders

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

Anyways, here are my top 10 G.O.A.T


1. Tom Brady
2. Jim Brown
3. Joe Montana
4. Lawrence Taylor
5. Walter Payton
6. Reggie White
7. Joe Greene
8. John Elway
9. Jerry Rice
10. Barry Sanders

A good ten. I can't comment on Jim Brown because I never saw him play. But I still think Emmitt Smith is the best RB I ever saw play the position. I give him that because he was not only a great runner, but he holds the rushing title. Some say Sanders was better, and I might agree if it weren't for his one flaw that was a liability to his team. He had to run from a single setback spread formation and was taken off the field by the goal line. Back then stacked defenses would eat that up. They never really had a chance.

[Hrycaj]

As a Lion's fan it is easy to blame the officiating. The problem is, even though I agree with LOW in his assessment of the officiating, the Lions just do not do enough to close out games. They are just not there. They are that organization that is playing against themselves and always have an excuse as to why they were close but not there.

With that said this officiating fiasco is the leagues fault. They for some reason have made officials part of the game in a bad way. Gene Staratore??? Index card guy? He is going to break down officials for me? I liked it better when they did their job and we didn't know who they were. Maybe it started with Ed Hochuli all those years ago. Perhaps the league should have sent him a memo going "Ed, wear a shirt that fits. Nobody is paying to see you officiate." ��

[Boomcoach]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

A good ten. I can't comment on Jim Brown because I never saw him play. But I still think Emmitt Smith is the best RB I ever saw play the position. I give him that because he was not only a great runner, but he holds the rushing title. Some say Sanders was better, and I might agree if it weren't for his one flaw that was a liability to his team. He had to run from a single setback spread formation and was taken off the field by the goal line. Back then stacked defenses would eat that up. They never really had a chance.

Sanders reminded me of Eric Dickerson (in effect, not in style). He was a joy to watch, especially since I wasn't going to care a lot if the Lions lost. But he was almost like a passing game. You had to put up with the in-completions (1 or 2 yard gains in his case) hoping to get some big yardage occasionally. I want a running back that I know will almost always give me 3 or 4 yards, I have a passing game for the nothing or big gain part of the game!

[Cobra Mgr]

1. Jim Brown - because ask anyone from that era about who was the best and they don't hesitate to call his name. There is no debate between them
2. Lawrence Taylor - He changed the game. Imagine what he could have done if he didn't have all night coke parties w/hookers?
3. Jerry Rice - It is astounding when you see veteran future HOF WR's reach certain milestones and then hear "just 400 behind Jerry Rice"
4. John Elway - I couldn't stand him but what he did w/what he had. He didn't have Belichek, Bill Walsh, Jerry Rice and still made 6 SB's.
5. Tom Brady - Can't deny the numbers or the rings. Also can't deny some of the events that surround those numbers and rings
6. Deon Sanders - Dominated his side of the field even when he was giving football only part time attention. The Super Bowl trophy switched hands between the Niners & Cowboys simply because of whose roster he was on
7. Reggie White - Unblockable. No offense he opposed didn't account for White first.
8. Walter Payton - He was the only thing that made Chicago relevant for most of his career. Yet you still tuned in to watch.
9. Bo Jackson - His shortened career is the only reason I don't have him higher. Barry Sanders was my last "favorite player", but no one combined the speed, power and moves that Bo had.
10. Deacon Jones - Again, listen to players from that era. He was the original sack master.

Joe Montana - I know people will freak seeing I don't have him in my top 10. But QB's get too much credit for a team's SB wins. Montana was good. His name itself was cool. But he also had Jerry Rice. And go back and look at the staffs that Bill Walsh had. I don't deny his ability. But I think his legendary status is a product of fortunate timing and not as much due to his ability.

Barry Sanders - He and Steve Largent were my favorite players. I wanted to put Barry in the top 10 sooooo bad. But just couldn't.

[dkgo]

I feel like the way PI challenges are handled is how replay everywhere was supposed to be. Only clear, blatantly missed calls get changed. Instead in every sport we are looking frame by frame to see if the ball moved a millimeter on the ground after being caught or if a soccer player was offside by his foreskin

I was in london sunday for the panthers game. lot of fun. saw every team represented and before I was actually in the stadium a good number were supported more than the bucs lol

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by dkgo

I feel like the way PI challenges are handled is how replay everywhere was supposed to be. Only clear, blatantly missed calls get changed. Instead in every sport we are looking frame by frame to see if the ball moved a millimeter on the ground after being caught or if a soccer player was offside by his foreskin

I was in london sunday for the panthers game. lot of fun. saw every team represented and before I was actually in the stadium a good number were supported more than the bucs lol

The problem is what is the standard for clear and blatant? That changes from person to person. That's why you don't go down that slope. If you are going to use replay, then you have to go by the letter of the law IMO. That's why replay shouldn't be used on judgement calls.

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

The problem is what is the standard for clear and blatant? That changes from person to person. That's why you don't go down that slope. If you are going to use replay, then you have to go by the letter of the law IMO. That's why replay shouldn't be used on judgement calls.

I'm old school but I feel like replay shouldn't be used at all. Human error should be part of the game, makes it more fun.

[dkgo]

Originally Posted by Cobra Mgr

The problem is what is the standard for clear and blatant? That changes from person to person. That's why you don't go down that slope. If you are going to use replay, then you have to go by the letter of the law IMO. That's why replay shouldn't be used on judgement calls.

the standard is that you know it when you see it. you can apply some common sense to the rules, everything in football is pretty much a judgment call since so much is based on "having control" or "excessive" contact

[dkgo]

Originally Posted by monkeyman576

I'm old school but I feel like replay shouldn't be used at all. Human error should be part of the game, makes it more fun.

this is just dumb. might as well watch a roulette wheel spin to determine the winner

[monkeyman576]

Originally Posted by dkgo

this is just dumb. might as well watch a roulette wheel spin to determine the winner

A little bit of hyperbole there. The world continued spinning before instant replay.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by dkgo

the standard is that you know it when you see it. you can apply some common sense to the rules, everything in football is pretty much a judgment call since so much is based on "having control" or "excessive" contact

Common sense isn't common. If it was as easy as "know it when you see it" the Saints would have been in Atlanta last February.

[dkgo]

Well yeah, that is literally what I'm saying. The whole point is that a call like that is "clear and obvious", we know it when we see it, and it would be reversed on replay.

[Cobra Mgr]

Originally Posted by dkgo

Well yeah, that is literally what I'm saying. The whole point is that a call like that is "clear and obvious", we know it when we see it, and it would be reversed on replay.

We would see the call was missed. But at this point, I have serious doubts it would be reversed.

[ukhotstove]

It’s impossible to say who the best was in any sport, the NFL as changed in the last 5 years let alone from when Jim Brown played. Players who played say 20 years ago specially on the defensive side of the ball would have to reinvent themselves. It’s like I watched a quiz show the other day, 2 ex football (soccer) players were on who played in the late 80s early 90s they’d never had made it now infact they’d have been amateurs at best.