Major Glitch - Ticket Prices

WillieMaysHayes · 12-21-2013, 09:00 PM

Need to fix ticket prices in this game.

You can jack your ticket prices to astronomical levels in this game, still draw fans, and outpace your entire league in revenue.

I've seen it happen recently multiple times with multiple leagues.

Please fix this. It's out of hand. If ticket prices are twice the price of the league average, you should be penalized. If your ticket prices are 5x or 10x the league average, no one should show up. But they still do.

Bluenoser · 12-21-2013, 09:14 PM

Not to knock your suggestion, but you should police yourself. If you set the avg ticket price in league setup, finances, you'll find that AI controlled teams don't stray too far from that setting. If you're exploiting the AI by jacking your prices way up, well, you should just police yourself and not take advantage of the AI.

Honorable_Pawn · 12-22-2013, 08:21 AM

House rule alert.

Easier than a fix.

WillieMaysHayes · 12-22-2013, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluenoser

Not to knock your suggestion, but you should police yourself. If you set the avg ticket price in league setup, finances, you'll find that AI controlled teams don't stray too far from that setting. If you're exploiting the AI by jacking your prices way up, well, you should just police yourself and not take advantage of the AI.

Not to knock your advice, but it's 30 owners in an online league I'm trying to police, not me vs. the AI.

Having to check everyone's ticket price every time I conduct a sim is a horrible solution to this problem.

Set up a league with an average ticket price of $1, and then set your ticket price to $10. Even if you lose 3/4 of your games, you'll blow away the league in revenue.

I'm starting to see this ticket price exploit happen in all kinds of online leagues now, and it's practically become a cheat to outspend all of your competition.

Honorable_Pawn · 12-22-2013, 04:23 PM

Should be easier to police in the team financial section. You need to have a hard and fast rule: Get caught once and your out--no warnings.

If there were a central report for the commish this wouold make your job easier. As it stands you have to go team by team.

RchW · 12-22-2013, 04:49 PM

This must be an online league issue because it doesn't happen in solo leagues I play.

It must also be recent because I don't remember it being a concern in earlier versions of OOTP.

Bluenoser · 12-22-2013, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillieMaysHayes

Not to knock your advice, but it's 30 owners in an online league I'm trying to police, not me vs. the AI.

Having to check everyone's ticket price every time I conduct a sim is a horrible solution to this problem.

Set up a league with an average ticket price of $1, and then set your ticket price to $10. Even if you lose 3/4 of your games, you'll blow away the league in revenue.

I'm starting to see this ticket price exploit happen in all kinds of online leagues now, and it's practically become a cheat to outspend all of your competition.

If it is human owners abusing the system, then it's a league problem, not a game problem. Commish just has to set a ticket price cap, with appropriate penalties for violations.

You say you see it in all kinds of online leagues? How many leagues are you seeing it in? I've been playing in online leagues since OOTP came out back in the late 90's. Never see the abuse you mention, but please list the leagues so I can avoid them.

A simple league rule fixes your problem.

PSUColonel · 12-26-2013, 02:37 PM

Owners should be the ones to set prices, not the GM.

mrbill · 12-28-2013, 12:09 PM

Come on now, it's definitely a bug in OOTP. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

If the attendance model breaks when ticket prices are 10X the league average, then the attendance model is broken.

House rules work, but this is a legit suggestion for v15.

Honorable_Pawn · 12-28-2013, 12:26 PM

Agreed, but it's way down the list.

Bluenoser · 12-28-2013, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrbill

Come on now, it's definitely a bug in OOTP. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

If the attendance model breaks when ticket prices are 10X the league average, then the attendance model is broken.

House rules work, but this is a legit suggestion for v15.

The attendance model doesn't break, it works fine. This is nothing more than a case of abuse by owners that is preventable by a simple league rule.

If the AI was abusing it, it might be considered a bug, but when owners abuse something that they can easily control themselves, it's not a bug in the game.

byzeil · 12-28-2013, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

Should be easier to police in the team financial section. You need to have a hard and fast rule: Get caught once and your out--no warnings.

If there were a central report for the commish this wouold make your job easier. As it stands you have to go team by team.

There is a central report available to commissioners:

'League Menu --> Stats & Leaders --> Teams Statistics & Info --> Team finances'

This lists Tickets prices along with Market size, loyalty, interest, and several other things for all teams in a 'sub-league'

chucksabr · 12-28-2013, 09:00 PM

I agree: fix this ticket pricing problem. Any major aspect of the game that allows the player to game the system like this is a major flaw, and the ticket pricing/attendance relationship is a major aspect.

Lukas Berger · 12-28-2013, 10:47 PM

While I can't get too worked up about this myself (sorry

) I have logged it in the official bug report tool fwiw.

ssceec · 12-31-2013, 06:28 AM

I agree that the max ticket price cap should be reduced. It sounds like a simple fix.

Sure, it helps for the league to establish a rule about price caps, but the AI can do this even more easily.

The current cap, as pointed out, is 10x the base. If you have a losing team, you can set your price to the max, and guarantee yourself revenues at or near the top of the league every year (because there's also a guaranteed minimum attendance applied). 5x would be much more reasonable, to avoid conflicts in leagues where ticket price dynamics aren't clearly recognized, or where the commissioner doesn't have the best opportunity to regularly police the matter.

From there, more hands-on leagues and commissioners could set whatever cap they wanted to permit the desired amount of variability in gate receipts.

Honorable_Pawn · 01-01-2014, 10:46 PM

Hey OP...

I'm not ehre to agree or disagree. Currently it is what it is. But hopefully you will find this report useful.

It's all in one place:

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Name: Untitled.jpg
Views: 686
Size: 362.9 KB

If you are unfamiliar with how to get this report it was discussed here

Snarf054 · 01-02-2014, 01:49 PM

I'd be happy if they just made ticket price viewable to everyone. It's not like it is not public knowledge IRL. In my online league I wanted to change my ticket price but to figure out what everyone else was charging I had to divide gate revenue by attendance for everyone just to get an idea. If you could just go look it would be really easy to see if anyone is cheating and it would be easier for new GM's to know if theirs is set to a reasonable price of if the previous owner was as big of an idiot as their payroll looks like they were.

le receveur · 01-02-2014, 03:42 PM

also on Solo leagues, if you can cheat, AI should also allow itself to cheat. I went and 4x the rate of the lowest revenue franchise, and AI changed it back immediately.

ssceec · 01-02-2014, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le receveur

also on Solo leagues, if you can cheat, AI should also allow itself to cheat. I went and 4x the rate of the lowest revenue franchise, and AI changed it back immediately.

Yeah, I noticed that about a solo league I tried to test with. The AI has no interest in bumping ticket prices more than about 20% above the set baseline. In order to make a test of max prices work, I had to take commissioner and GM charge over all teams, and thus force the game to maintain a 10x the baseline max.

WillieMaysHayes · 02-03-2014, 12:27 PM

Just a quick example of an online league where a 10x price just outdistances everyone. I am the Cubs owner and my team currently has a .455 record.

League Financial Report for National Baseball League

Note my gate revenue and attendance level.

There has to be a better cap to this. 10x max is way too high. I'd argue the max should be between 1.25-1.5x

12-21-2013, 09:00 PM	#1
WillieMaysHayes Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 143	Major Glitch - Ticket Prices Need to fix ticket prices in this game. You can jack your ticket prices to astronomical levels in this game, still draw fans, and outpace your entire league in revenue. I've seen it happen recently multiple times with multiple leagues. Please fix this. It's out of hand. If ticket prices are twice the price of the league average, you should be penalized. If your ticket prices are 5x or 10x the league average, no one should show up. But they still do.

12-22-2013, 08:21 AM	#3
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	House rule alert. Easier than a fix. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

12-22-2013, 04:23 PM	#5
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	Should be easier to police in the team financial section. You need to have a hard and fast rule: Get caught once and your out--no warnings. If there were a central report for the commish this wouold make your job easier. As it stands you have to go team by team. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

12-22-2013, 04:49 PM	#6
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: The big smoke Posts: 15,628	This must be an online league issue because it doesn't happen in solo leagues I play. It must also be recent because I don't remember it being a concern in earlier versions of OOTP. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

12-28-2013, 12:09 PM	#9
mrbill All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: LA, CA Posts: 982	Come on now, it's definitely a bug in OOTP. Don't hate the player, hate the game. If the attendance model breaks when ticket prices are 10X the league average, then the attendance model is broken. House rules work, but this is a legit suggestion for v15. __________________ UBL - Best Online League Evar! - Los Angeles Dodgers: 25 seasons, 13 NL West titles, 4 WC, 8 NL Titles, 5-time Champs LBB v5 league (retired) - Detroit Tigers/Commish: 19 seasons, 18 straight AL Central titles, 2006, 2008, 2014, 2015 Champs! NGBL v6 league (dead) - Texas Rangers: 10 seasons, 4 AL South titles, 2 Wild Cards, one WS app

12-21-2013, 09:14 PM	#2
Bluenoser Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In The Moment Posts: 13,683	Not to knock your suggestion, but you should police yourself. If you set the avg ticket price in league setup, finances, you'll find that AI controlled teams don't stray too far from that setting. If you're exploiting the AI by jacking your prices way up, well, you should just police yourself and not take advantage of the AI.

12-26-2013, 02:37 PM	#8
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 12,990 Blog Entries: 37	Owners should be the ones to set prices, not the GM.

12-28-2013, 12:26 PM	#10
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	Agreed, but it's way down the list. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

12-28-2013, 09:00 PM	#13
chucksabr Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: In the canyons of your mind Posts: 3,172	I agree: fix this ticket pricing problem. Any major aspect of the game that allows the player to game the system like this is a major flaw, and the ticket pricing/attendance relationship is a major aspect. __________________ The (English) Baseball League (est. 1888): A History The 1932 Season is Underway Dynasty Mission \| Creation Story \| Subscribe 1888 1889 1890 1891 1892 1893 1894 1895 1896 1897 1898 1899 1900 1901 1902 1903 1904 1905 1906 1907 1908 1909 1910 1911 1912 1913 1914 (Great War Hiatus) 1919 1920 1921 1922 1923 1924 1925 1926 1927 1928 1929 1930 1931 The OOTP Interview about the Baseball League

12-28-2013, 10:47 PM	#14
Lukas Berger OOTP Developments Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Nice, Côte d'Azur, France Posts: 19,901	While I can't get too worked up about this myself (sorry) I have logged it in the official bug report tool fwiw.

12-31-2013, 06:28 AM	#15
ssceec Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 15	I have two online leagues going through this now I agree that the max ticket price cap should be reduced. It sounds like a simple fix. Sure, it helps for the league to establish a rule about price caps, but the AI can do this even more easily. The current cap, as pointed out, is 10x the base. If you have a losing team, you can set your price to the max, and guarantee yourself revenues at or near the top of the league every year (because there's also a guaranteed minimum attendance applied). 5x would be much more reasonable, to avoid conflicts in leagues where ticket price dynamics aren't clearly recognized, or where the commissioner doesn't have the best opportunity to regularly police the matter. From there, more hands-on leagues and commissioners could set whatever cap they wanted to permit the desired amount of variability in gate receipts.

01-01-2014, 10:46 PM	#16
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	Hey OP... I'm not ehre to agree or disagree. Currently it is what it is. But hopefully you will find this report useful. It's all in one place: If you are unfamiliar with how to get this report it was discussed here __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

01-02-2014, 01:49 PM	#17
Snarf054 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 127	I'd be happy if they just made ticket price viewable to everyone. It's not like it is not public knowledge IRL. In my online league I wanted to change my ticket price but to figure out what everyone else was charging I had to divide gate revenue by attendance for everyone just to get an idea. If you could just go look it would be really easy to see if anyone is cheating and it would be easier for new GM's to know if theirs is set to a reasonable price of if the previous owner was as big of an idiot as their payroll looks like they were.

01-02-2014, 03:42 PM	#18
le receveur All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: canada Posts: 1,736	also on Solo leagues, if you can cheat, AI should also allow itself to cheat. I went and 4x the rate of the lowest revenue franchise, and AI changed it back immediately.

02-03-2014, 12:27 PM	#20
WillieMaysHayes Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 143	Just a quick example of an online league where a 10x price just outdistances everyone. I am the Cubs owner and my team currently has a .455 record. League Financial Report for National Baseball League Note my gate revenue and attendance level. There has to be a better cap to this. 10x max is way too high. I'd argue the max should be between 1.25-1.5x