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Old 02-20-2020, 03:02 AM   #421
thehef
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Admit I blew it.
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LOL. Easy for you to give that advice.
Well, at this point, EVERYBODY - probably even Manfred himself - knows that he blew it, so it should be easy advice to take
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Old 02-20-2020, 10:24 AM   #422
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Well, at this point, EVERYBODY - probably even Manfred himself - knows that he blew it, so it should be easy advice to take
Don't know. For some people no amount of evidence or public disdain is enough.
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Old 02-20-2020, 11:20 AM   #423
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I see where Stanton said he would have hit 80 home runs if he would have known what pitch was coming. The good thing is he clarified that he would have done so in 2017. I'm guessing if someone would have beat on a trash can anywhere near him last year, he would have missed a month with an ear infection.

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Old 02-20-2020, 11:46 AM   #424
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I see where Stanton said he would have hit 80 home runs if he would have known what pitch was coming. The good thing is he clarified that he would have done so in 2017. I'm guessing if someone would have beat on a trash can anywhere near him last year, he would have missed a month with an ear infection.

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Old 02-20-2020, 03:33 PM   #425
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Red Sox "legend" David Ortiz calls Astros whistleblower Mike Fiers a 'snitch,' stands up for Rob Manfred

Shoooocking ... a known cheater defends the same guy who kowtows to known cheaters, and has defended this known cheater in the past.

It's to the point that I'd rather have Dud Selig back as commish instead of Brainsfried.

**** Ortiz, **** Brainsfried, **** the Astros.
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Old 02-20-2020, 03:37 PM   #426
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Red Sox "legend" David Ortiz calls Astros whistleblower Mike Fiers a 'snitch,' stands up for Rob Manfred

Shoooocking ... a known cheater defends the same guy who kowtows to known cheaters, and has defended this known cheater in the past.

It's to the point that I'd rather have Dud Selig back as commish instead of Brainsfried.

**** Ortiz, **** Brainsfried, **** the Astros.
I thought the Mitchell report said every single player in the league did steroids except for the Red Sox and David Ortiz?
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Old 02-20-2020, 03:46 PM   #427
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Red Sox "legend" David Ortiz calls Astros whistleblower Mike Fiers a 'snitch,' stands up for Rob Manfred

Shoooocking ... a known cheater defends the same guy who kowtows to known cheaters, and has defended this known cheater in the past.

It's to the point that I'd rather have Dud Selig back as commish instead of Brainsfried.

**** Ortiz, **** Brainsfried, **** the Astros.

After seeing your avatar, I'm curious what you think about the fact that Ortiz will almost certainly get into the HOF before Bonds
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Old 02-20-2020, 04:08 PM   #428
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I haven't read this entire thread so this may have been addressed already, but who is telling the truth?

Manfred who says the MLBPA wanted all players immune from punishment during the investigation or the Players Association that says MLB said from the outset that it was not its intention to discipline players?
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Old 02-20-2020, 04:47 PM   #429
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I haven't read this entire thread so this may have been addressed already, but who is telling the truth?

Manfred who says the MLBPA wanted all players immune from punishment during the investigation or the Players Association that says MLB said from the outset that it was not its intention to discipline players?
I haven't paid much attention to it lately, but it's always possible that neither is telling the truth
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Old 02-20-2020, 08:16 PM   #430
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I haven't paid much attention to it lately, but it's always possible that neither is telling the truth
Or that they both are:

MLBPA: We don't want any players punished because of this.

Manfred: Oh, don't worry, it's not my intention to punish any players.
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Old 02-20-2020, 09:43 PM   #431
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Who at the MLBPA said it didn't want players punished or would fight it tooth and nail etc? Wonder what each teams (except the Astros and Red Sox) players rep has to say?
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Old 02-20-2020, 10:57 PM   #432
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Ortiz needs to pipe down. Nobody outside of Boston wants his input.
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Old 02-21-2020, 01:29 AM   #433
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Who at the MLBPA said it didn't want players punished or would fight it tooth and nail etc? Wonder what each teams (except the Astros and Red Sox) players rep has to say?
Justin Turner is the Dodgers' player rep, and we know what he had to say...
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Old 02-21-2020, 03:04 AM   #434
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Justin Turner is the Dodgers' player rep, and we know what he had to say...
Seems to me the MLBPA is accountable to the players through the team reps. And if a bunch of them think the union did wrong, then if they can't adjust it some heads should roll.
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Old 02-22-2020, 09:12 PM   #435
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Ortiz needs to pipe down. Nobody outside of Boston wants his input.
Ortiz is clearly firing a shot across the bow of any member of the 2018 Red Sox who thinks it'd be a good thing to come clean about what went down in that run to the World Series. Protecting the brand obviously comes well above truth and integrity for him. **** that guy! David Price, the floor is yours. Remember how the organization and its fans treated you, step up to the plate, and get it off your chest. Show some damn guts.
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Old 02-22-2020, 10:45 PM   #436
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Sign stealing 'stros steal signs
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Old 02-23-2020, 10:56 AM   #437
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This is scraping the bottom of the barrel now.

Fans can't bring signs to the game.

So you don't have backbone enough to go after the guilty because you're afraid of the union.

No, instead you punish the innocent fans by not allowing them to show their displeasure. After all, the fans have no union, they can't do anything about it.

Sad, just really sad.
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Old 02-23-2020, 11:30 AM   #438
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Dumb, but funny.
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Old 02-23-2020, 02:06 PM   #439
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Dumb, but funny.
No, I agree with Bluenoser: sad. On three counts:

1) That this happened at all. What were those guys thinking? Are they that stupid that nobody would notice rhythmic trash can banging? That a guy would need to yell about not ripping off his shirt and run quickly into the dugout? That somehow it would leak out (and in the most dependable way, via a trade or free agency and altered allegiances)?

2) That the team would seek to cover up their shame in denials, lame excuses, insincere apologies, and a desire to quickly move on? Not so fast, friends.

3) That they will try to suppress fan anger, albeit unsuccessfully. They must and will take their lumps. (3a - that some fans will of course be stupid and offensive in expressing their anger).

I read an article that explained Manfred's position. He made his bargain with the MLBPA in order to get at the truth and to get the scandal over with as quickly as possible. He was under the impression that the players themselves (to say nothing of the fans) would go along with this agreement. He now knows better, but I can understand where he was coming from (his profession is labor attorney).

But he, or the owners by vote, should void the 2017 World Series title. Same for the 2018 title if more news about the Red Sox is found and verified. These will forever be tainted, stained by cheating.
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Old 02-23-2020, 06:47 PM   #440
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I read an article that explained Manfred's position. He made his bargain with the MLBPA in order to get at the truth and to get the scandal over with as quickly as possible. He was under the impression that the players themselves (to say nothing of the fans) would go along with this agreement. He now knows better, but I can understand where he was coming from (his profession is labor attorney).

But he, or the owners by vote, should void the 2017 World Series title. Same for the 2018 title if more news about the Red Sox is found and verified. These will forever be tainted, stained by cheating.
But do we know the truth yet? Specifically, Manfred's report said the cheating schemes continued into the 2017 postseason, including on the road. But in what games, at what times, and by what means?

For example, in the pivotal game 5 when Kershaw gave up two big leads, I suspect that the BlackStros weren't signaling pitches to the batters right off the bat because Kershaw works fast with nobody on base (so not enough time to pick up, interpret, relay, and indicate). In addition, the Dodgers apparently were switching up signs so it's possible that it takes a few batters or even a few innings before it's known what the signals are. And I suspect that once they figured out the signs and once they slowed Kershaw down a bit by getting a runner or two on base, there were able to fully implement the cheating schemes. But I don't know this because it hasn't been addressed... And were they cheating later in that game when the rocked Maeda, Jansen and other Dodger pitchers? And in game seven, when they destroyed Darvish: Did they have a sign-stealing scheme at Dodger stadium? Or was Darvish tipping pitches, as was originally told? Or, was Darvish simply shell-shocked from the cheating-induced beating he received in Houston in game 3?

Also, we know about the trash-can banging scheme. But other systems were alluded to. What other systems? Manfred said he has no evidence of the buzzer scheme. But, to my knowledge, no other systems have been revealed.

If Manfred didn't get these answers, then his "deal" with the union and players was even weaker than most presume it already was. Or his people asking questions were morons.
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