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11-20-2014, 05:34 PM | #301 |
Minors (Rookie Ball)
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 48
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This game is being sold on the reputation earned by OOTP. It's not an unfair assumption by the buyers that they will receive something of the same quality.
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11-20-2014, 05:37 PM | #302 |
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Come on, so we magically build a game in 2 years that is on the same level as a game build in over 15 years?
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11-20-2014, 05:51 PM | #303 | |
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Quote:
As a buyer of a new game from a publisher that has a very high reputation (I don't do baseball sims myself so I have only that reputation to go on), I would expect that that new game would include all the lessons about game development that has previously been learned by developing the other games. I would be very surprised to find that none of all that accumulated knowledge appears to have been used in the making of this game. I have no desire to start an argument with you or any of the other staff involved in the making of this game but instead as someone that still play EHM I yearn for a game that improves on that experience. I've stated before and I'll say it again, it saddens me that a game that is billed as a "management game" has very little to do with managing the team. I do hope it will improve and that a design philosophy that can do that will be used. Ivan PS. If I were to design such a game as this (which I readily admit to not being capable of) I would sit down and for every decision try to imagine what a GM IRL would want to do and then try to find a good way to emulate that in the game. |
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11-20-2014, 10:29 PM | #304 |
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Location: Bear, DE
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The game should not be compared to one that is twelve years old. If you want to say "hey, we're shooting to be at an equal development level to OOTP 6" for example, I can live with that. But aiming to be twelve years behind doesnt compute to me. The game can be compared to one a few years old, but it should then "age" at an exponential rate.
If the EA crew released a new game pointed towards a different FPS genre, they would never say "This game will be as good as Battlefield 1942 was back in 2002."
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11-20-2014, 11:46 PM | #305 | |
FHM Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Quote:
It is simply ridiculous comparing OOTP Developments to EA. A text sports sim is a very niche game where only a select few are interested and the complexities that the customers demand for AI is a seemingly impossible demand on it's own. As much as OOTP would love to put even a fraction of what EA spends developing a game, that simply cannot and will never happen. Like it or not, but for a niche genre such as this, the only way to create a long standing franchise is by building a solid foundation, and slowly each year adding to it. If OOTP hire 1 too many staff member, it could mean the difference between a profit or loss and possibly the demise of the franchise. Comparing that to a 100 million dollar budget, 250 employed AAA game that EA would come out with is simply ludicrous. The business works differently for genres like this as it's the only way for it to survive.
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IN 1964 THE LEAFS WON THE STANLEY CUP :: IT'S ALSO THE YEAR THE CANADIAN FLAG WAS DESIGNED...coincidence? Last edited by dave1927p; 11-20-2014 at 11:55 PM. |
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11-20-2014, 11:58 PM | #306 |
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Its the best example I could come up with on the spot. Obviously OOTP does not compare on a basic scale to a company like EA.. but the concept on a macro vs micro scale in my opinion is a similar one. The game should not be a clone of OOTP and I never said it should, but the reputation and the lessons learned in development, well, those apply.. I agree 100% with Ivan on that one.
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11-21-2014, 07:05 AM | #307 |
Developer
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It is the last I write on this topic because we had all this in the past and I don't want to talk the same topic over and over again with 5 user but instand work on the game for 10.000+ user.
Of course we don't aim for a game that is 6 years old, we want to be better. But comparing us with games, that have 15+ years of development is unfair and will not work. EA just released NHL Hockey that removed a lot of previous features because there was not enough time to port it to the ps4 and Xbox. They are a big Company with many people working on the game and have problems. The new Elite game just announced that they throw out the promised Singleplayer Mode and they got almost 2 Million from kickstarter. Thats how game Development works. We will do our best to learn from our errors, concentrate on the main features, keep it simple and improve over time. We will not make everyone happy, thats ok as long as the majority is enjoing the game it is good. Thats it for me now, as I said above, it makes no sense to continue this conversation as you guys have your opinion (which is fine) and I (and others) have our and we will not get on one page. So lets talk game or hockey.
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11-21-2014, 08:09 AM | #308 |
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Is a two-team expansion still a go for the final patch?
Will editing be improved on the final patch or will we still be hand-cuffed too do transactions on only one day(July 1st) for the whole year and season? |
11-21-2014, 09:36 AM | #309 |
Minors (Triple A)
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11-21-2014, 09:43 AM | #310 | |
Minors (Triple A)
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 202
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Quote:
We've been close to 6 months going with a promise of a "big patch" ... instead of smaller incremental patches that address the myriad of issues this software has. There are bugs and flawed game mechanics that have existed from beta which imply a failure by the developers to understand some of the basics of professional hockey at the NHL level (contracts, RFA's etc have been a mess since release). So yeah, you can scoff and say I don't know more than developers (you have no idea about that though do you? I could very well be a software developer). My 173 posts as being insignificant instead of an indication that I signed up for these forums specifically for FHM over a year ago and my lack of robust posting is from sheer frustration with the state of the game and the attitude of the devs. I mean you have twice the posts I do ... yet Thanked 72x in 40 posts for you, and thanked 104 in 50 posts for myself ... draw your own conclusion of who's posts resonate more with people and touch on reality rather than blind faith in the company. Last edited by Mordrehl; 11-21-2014 at 09:48 AM. |
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11-21-2014, 10:49 AM | #311 | |
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Quote:
And post count doesn't matter what so ever.
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IN 1964 THE LEAFS WON THE STANLEY CUP :: IT'S ALSO THE YEAR THE CANADIAN FLAG WAS DESIGNED...coincidence? Last edited by dave1927p; 11-21-2014 at 11:00 AM. |
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11-21-2014, 11:04 AM | #312 |
Minors (Triple A)
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 200
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I'm sorry I sparked this debate again Sebastian. It was not my plan. I simply wanted to mention that I felt that given how long we had waited, one last roster update would have gone a long way to sate those who have waited. You do not agree and that is fine. Either way I, like others here, will wait and get the patch. We will probably purchase the next version, and the one after that. That is the thing for myself and many others, we sound ungrateful and sound like we appreciate nothing, but please don't take it as such, we are an extremely passionate bunch. Some of us had grown to be friends in the EHM days and compared notes, strategies, and dynasties. We're happy you are part of that, for the good and the bad. Forgive our passion as we work through the understandable shortcomings of a first volume.
As for the editing of rosters, I will make one suggestion, it does not solve the fact that I would not get the rookies from the last draft on my team, but it would appease many. Now this feature may exist and I did not notice it, if so I apologize. What if you added a feature in game to remove the other GMs decision in a trade. Like an auto-approve feature. I start a new campaign, turn on auto-approve, make all the trades I want to get my team to be how it is now, then I can turn it back off an play in full simulation. It would not be a full on editor, just allows more leeway and stops some grumbling. It is how I used to do it in EA's NHL, before the season I would do all my trades and then start my season with what I wanted. The way I suggest would not make it before the season and therefore not add a full new feature, just a setting to your season. Then if you start a campaign, you have to do it again because it does not alter the database, just the single campaign. I don't think any of us has ever played a flawless game. Let alone a hockey game. While we herald EA's NHL, we should all remember that by the end of any version we could win most games 10-0. All new features had bugs, like the wrap-around being an instant goal at some point, the one-timer has always been overpowered. In EHM how many of us have had seasons where our first line was getting 150 points each? I know I have, or I have seen screen shots of 100 goal seasons. I could take almost any team in EHM and win the cup in 2 seasons. I could trade for the first overall pick any season I want. 2K Sports was a pain the first 2 years. So yes, we grumble but Sebastian is right on some points, they are infants in this world and we compare them to giants. But I say this to all involved in this development, our passion is strong, we are not maybe as entitled as we think, but understand us as well, this has nothing to do with the money for most of us, this is about hockey, which for a Montrealer like me, is a religion. We will be loud and we will be vocal, but we will be faithful. Last edited by SushamiBoy; 11-21-2014 at 11:33 AM. |
11-21-2014, 03:52 PM | #313 | |
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11-21-2014, 11:29 PM | #314 | |
Minors (Triple A)
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 202
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Quote:
One day, if they keep at it .. maybe we'll have a product as good as OOTP14/15 ... right now, we don't. My frustration is with the process, the long bouts of silence, etc etc |
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11-22-2014, 05:45 AM | #315 | |
Developer
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Location: Hamburg, Germany
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Quote:
Yes, you are right.
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11-22-2014, 09:28 AM | #316 | |
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Punta Gorda FL.
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Quote:
I think you need to step back and look at this empirically - it's only a game, not life... Yes I am disappointed too. Balanced by the knowledge that they have posted in general terms what the FHM plans are, I don't have a beef with that. Look we get it. I last posted here asking if I could look for this update for Christmas, and they wisely said they couldn't say... That IS OK... I am around 50% positive in my postings, or I refrain from posting after I have made my point. HOW many times do you feel the need to point out someone else's failings? Does it do something for you? Are you really that narcissistic? This game may not be for you, but it does have people playing it, warts and all. Yes it has shortcomings and I simply work around them or move on until the craving starts up again and I click on the FHM shortcut and try it again. And as a side benefit for me... The older I get the quicker my memory fails me and I wonder why I wasn't playing this game more often... <grin> Last edited by moore4807; 11-22-2014 at 09:32 AM. Reason: last thoughts |
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11-22-2014, 04:02 PM | #317 | |
Bat Boy
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Quote:
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11-26-2014, 11:29 AM | #318 |
Bat Boy
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2
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So, when should I expect the new game? Summer 2015?
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11-26-2014, 11:53 AM | #319 |
Developer
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Whenever it is ready and we are happy with it.
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11-26-2014, 04:42 PM | #320 |
Minors (Single A)
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Moving back towards talk of the 2014 patch...
1) Should we expect the changes to the match engine to radically change the usefulness of certain players? Earlier, enforcers weren't fighting as much as they do in real life, for instance. Should we expect to see more of that, for instance? 2) Related to that, should we expect to see players like Steve Ott and Antoine Roussel have a little more value to their respective teams because they can perform their sort of hybrid enforcer/pest/secondary scorer roles better? 3) Is it worthwhile playing out a save several years into the future at this point? I'm hesitant to do so, because I don't want to see a patch come out shortly that will require a restart for best results. I presume that any patch will be save game compatible, but I know from previous experience that a fresh start is almost always preferrable. |
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