Do you want team color text back...Vote here!

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm3

...Why am I arguing this? This is asinine.

I was wondering this myself.

[Gambo]

Wow this has become quite an animated topic. I skimmed the 5+ pages here but it's a stiff debate on many tangents.

During the beta test I was one of the dissenters regarding the new skin. To be honest I focused on the GUI and the historical gameplay through sims. I actually did not play out a game and never noticed the box issues in that game. Needless to say, had I noticed that I would have freaked out even more than I did.

My major issue with the new skin is that it totally eliminated the secondary color (a major factor is differentiating teams) and it made every teams club house seem the same. The second thing I didn't like was the dark back ground for the logos. It made many custom logos look flawed.

From my conversations with the developers during beta, it honestly seemed to me that the plan was to make a skin and GUI setup that would be ideal "out of the box". Which is fine, however, I felt they missed the boat on just how many people do not play this game as is "out of the box".

In my opinion is was design miss...but the story will be told in new customers and repeat business.

As the product is...having been part of the beta team the new features and engine upgrades are worth the purchase of 15 simply because it is a much more realistic and accurate game compared to 14.

Second with the skin is I hope somebody is able to do a custom skin that looks like this...

[megamanmatt]

Originally Posted by StyxNCa

No sense of humor?

You always give me a hard time. I ought to be used to it by now.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by BDMarvel

As a game developer myself I'm appalled at your lack of respect for the developer here.

We respect the OOTP staff a lot. That does not mean that we think that they are perfect and never make mistakes, or that we won't call them on any mistakes that they do make.

Originally Posted by BDMarvel

As a consumer you have precisely zero right to dictate the content of the product.

Nonsense. We are the customers. Designers and developers either please us or go broke. I can refer you to along list of game companies that never learned that lesson until it was too late.

Originally Posted by BDMarvel

this sense of entitlement is just not appropriate.

Bad label. It's participation.

Originally Posted by BDMarvel

I realize I'm new here

That much is obvious. You don't understand the dynamic here, or how much the user base has contributed to the game. A significant number of features in the game were suggested by the user base, and the user base supplies the mods that make the game experience what it is.

[Gambo]

BD,

This game is a special case where the consumers do a great deal in making this game what it is. Nearly every aspect outside of the skin has a mod that has been developed in order to improve the product in some fashion. The developers in fact use the community in order to develop improvements for them such as the statistical database, transaction files, storylines etc. all this has been and is done for free by members of the community.

Originally Posted by BDMarvel

You purchased it as-is. Markus is the artist. You're just the consumer. If you don't like the art, don't buy the damn painting.

In regards to this statement, yes Markus has crafted an excellent game and it is his vision, however, it is not solely his work. Without the excellent community, this game is very much like Baseball Mogul. Also, large amounts of the purchases are done as a pre-order before any of the dynamics are seen by the purchaser. The purchasers have put their faith in the product and based their purchase on promised improvements.

In this case many feel the skin and the immersion has been the opposite of an improvement and had they been informed of it previously they would not have pre-ordered.

[swoboda]

Game stability comes first. Realism and accuracy second. Appearance 3rd. Having said that I miss the old color schemes.

[Bowtie]

Originally Posted by Gambo

BD,

This game is a special case where the consumers do a great deal in making this game what it is. Nearly every aspect outside of the skin has a mod that has been developed in order to improve the product in some fashion. The developers in fact use the community in order to develop improvements for them such as the statistical database, transaction files, storylines etc. all this has been and is done for free by members of the community.



In regards to this statement, yes Markus has crafted an excellent game and it is his vision, however, it is not solely his work. Without the excellent community, this game is very much like Baseball Mogul. Also, large amounts of the purchases are done as a pre-order before any of the dynamics are seen by the purchaser. The purchasers have put their faith in the product and based their purchase on promised improvements.

In this case many feel the skin and the immersion has been the opposite of an improvement and had they been informed of it previously they would not have pre-ordered.

Gambo hit the nail on the head here. However, even if I would have previously known about this change it would not have made any difference in whether I pre-ordered or not. I'll still support the developers even if they don't make some sort of change.. I have a major preference that they do make the change (make this an option so those that like it the way it is now can use it and those that like the old can use it) but as I stated earlier, it's by no means a gamebreaker. With or without the change this game is definitely worth 40 bucks. The other improvements in v15 alone are enough for me to still get lots of pure enjoyment.

Lastly, newbies need to understand that this game would not be what it is today without the awesome knowledge of this community. Markus and Andreas are more than just the developers. They are a sports sim gamer's best friend. They just didn't realize the mistake they was making when they made this change.

[Déjà Bru]

Yes. BD, if you are going to be a successful game developer, take notes here. This is how it's done, and OOTPD knows it and relishes it, warts and all. They don't do everything we ask, but they sure as heck try to do so especially once an issue comes to their attention with a nearly 80% tag on it.

[pmoehrin]

Originally Posted by swoboda

Game stability comes first. Realism and accuracy second. Appearance 3rd. Having said that I miss the old color schemes.

That's pretty much spot on with my priorities and opinion as well.

[Jamee999]

Wowww, the new in-game display looks real bad. Need that changed ASAP.

[Fyrestorm3]

Originally Posted by swoboda

Game stability comes first. Realism and accuracy second. Appearance 3rd. Having said that I miss the old color schemes.

No doubt, and I think everyone here agrees with you. Thing is, the game is fairly stable (except on Macs... they really need to get that under control), and the realism and accuracy has, as usual, made large strides from the previous version. So if I'm good with both the first and second priorities, then I'm free to complain about the third.

[Déjà Bru]

All right, which one of you big-league insiders is going to knock on a certain haus door and present the occupants with a transcript of this thread, a virtually signed petition, no less?

[Bigrod]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

All right, which one of you big-league insiders is going to knock on a certain haus door and present the occupants with a transcript of this thread, a virtually signed petition, no less?

I've linked to this in our Beta forum..may help..

[MizzouRah]

Forget the color.. I want little 2d figures running around.. :P

For you Wolf!

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

All right, which one of you big-league insiders is going to knock on a certain haus door and present the occupants with a transcript of this thread, a virtually signed petition, no less?

I'll go.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Wow. I am gone for a couple of days and now I see this thread.

But, because I am a happy person, I won't argue with those who cry as if their favorite pet just died. Instead, I simply act my part (read: superhero) and add an option to the game preferences which will let you select wether the team text color is used (in the menus and game screen) or not. The result will be love everywhere, satisfied forum friends, free beer for everyone and the Swedish Bikini Team knocking on my door... and the world is a better place because of all this, obviously.

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Nonsense. We are the customers. Designers and developers either please us or go broke. I can refer you to along list of game companies that never learned that lesson until it was too late.

I am happy to inform the public that sales numbers for OOTP 15 are through the roof. Hence, we are pretty darn good designers I suppose. So, even more good news! What a day!

[jazzrack]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Wow. I am gone for a couple of days and now I see this thread.

But, because I am a happy person, I won't argue with those who cry as if their favorite pet just died. Instead, I simply act my part (read: superhero) and add an option to the game preferences which will let you select wether the team text color is used (in the menus and game screen) or not. The result will be love everywhere, satisfied forum friends, free beer for everyone and the Swedish Bikini Team knocking on my door... and the world is a better place because of all this, obviously.



I am happy to inform the public that sales numbers for OOTP 15 are through the roof. Hence, we are pretty darn good designers I suppose. So, even more good news! What a day!

so you had a good rest! awesome news. If you don't have your health you don't have anything.

you know I have not even played a game yet..... been converting my online league and working on the wiki.

I must really love this game to not be playing it this game makes you weird

I like the team text colors, but didn't notice they were gone until it was mentioned, I don't know what that means but it's what it is.

[Hooray Saturday]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Wow. I am gone for a couple of days and now I see this thread.

But, because I am a happy person, I won't argue with those who cry as if their favorite pet just died. Instead, I simply act my part (read: superhero) and add an option to the game preferences which will let you select wether the team text color is used (in the menus and game screen) or not. The result will be love everywhere, satisfied forum friends, free beer for everyone and the Swedish Bikini Team knocking on my door... and the world is a better place because of all this, obviously.



I am happy to inform the public that sales numbers for OOTP 15 are through the roof. Hence, we are pretty darn good designers I suppose. So, even more good news! What a day!

Thank You Markus Keep Up The Good Work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

and everyone else, remember none of this will matter in a couple of years when we have little uniformed animated 3D guys running around on the field!

[Markus Heinsohn]

Oh, and while I was at it, I added the option to select the effect of the background of a dialog. You can now choose between darken (default), black & white and blur (which was the default early in development, but some beta testers were very vocal about it and did not like it).

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by Bowtie

I am temporarily breaking my self imposed silence to voice my concerns about this topic.

This is utterly despicable. It does not surprise me that OOTP Developments made such a disrespectful and selfish decision to remove the team colors in OOTP 15 that were highly favored in OOTP 14. And to rub salt in our wounds, they made their paying customers find out the hard way. Shame on you! Here I am making new logos for OOTP 15 using the hex codes from the OOTP 14 logos and I find out the hard way that I now have to go back and eliminate part of the codes? Pathetic. In the mods forum, there was no mention of this change. Why? That in itself is ridiculous.

I second what Charlie Hough said in his post above. It is my every hope that OOTP Developments has learned their lesson and that they compromise with us and make this an option. By the way, I voted yes to bring them back.

I apologize for my rant but the way I see it is OOTP Developments brought this upon themselves.

As always, cheers to all.

Bow

Um, no. You don't have to change anything on any logos. The hexcode is acknowledged just like it has been for the past few iterations. The secondary team color was just not used on the team page. That's it.