Your 2015 Hall of Fame Ballot

[Westheim]

Not quite sure why some are getting so worked up. It's not like the writers' dogs defecated on your lawn.....

Plus... Since when are Supreme Court judges infallible? But it's okay - society may be falling to pieces, but some house of sports hanging plaques of players onto the walls must be watched more closely than any branch of state power.

[CONN CHRIS]

Originally Posted by Westheim

Not quite sure why some are getting so worked up. It's not like the writers' dogs defecated on your lawn.....

Plus... Since when are Supreme Court judges infallible? But it's okay - society may be falling to pieces, but some house of sports hanging plaques of players onto the walls must be watched more closely than any branch of state power.

Obviously, what happens elsewhere is of greater importance. This is however ... you know ... a baseball related message board. Odd that folks talk about and get excited about baseball related topics here isn't it.

[Orcin]

Final voting totals with OOTP voting shown in parenthesis:

Randy Johnson 97.3% (100%)
Pedro Martinez 91.1% (96%)
John Smoltz 82.9% (56%)
Craig Biggio 82.7% (88%)
---------------------
Mike Piazza 69.9% (60%)
Jeff Bagwell 55.7% (84%)
Tim Raines 55.0% (52%)
Curt Schilling 39.2% (44%)
Roger Clemens 37.5% (48%)
Barry Bonds 36.8% (44%)
Lee Smith 30.2% (16%)
Edgar Martinez 27.0% (24%)
Alan Trammell 25.1% (52%)
Mike Mussina 24.6% (52%)
Jeff Kent 14.0% (12%)
Fred McGriff 12.9% (12%)
Larry Walker 11.8% (20%)
Gary Sheffield 11.7% (16%)
Mark McGwire 10.0% (16%)

We undervalued Smoltz and overvalued Bagwell as compared to the BBWAA voters. Going farther down the list, we undervalued Lee Smith and overvalued Mike Mussina and Alan Trammell. Otherwise, pretty close considering our small sample of 25.

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by rpriske

There is no reason to limit ballots to 10 players. At all.

Exactly. Either make the limit larger, or make it a simple yes or no on every player on the ballot. It might result in some larger classes for the next little while, but maybe that's a good thing. After all, when the HoF started, there were only 16 teams. Now there are 30. Maybe go back to the way they used to have it, where you had to vote for no more and no less than 10 players on the ballot. I don't know, just putting it out there.

[The Game]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The 2015 Hall of Fame Class:

Randy Johnson
Pedro Martinez
John Smoltz
Craig Biggio

Very good class. Glad they voted so many in. Half tempted to go back again this year. Might just make me some reservations near Utica, Richfield, Little Falls or this time at the KOA vs Yogi Bear. If i dont go i could always cancel later on.

[Orcin]

I am really annoyed to hear Craig Biggio referred to as a "compiler". The term is used to diminish his accomplishments, as if somehow playing 20 years at a very high level is not that big a deal. He led the league in plate appearances five times, and in four of those years he finished in the top 12 in MVP voting. He wasn't just filling a roster spot while "compiling" 3060 hits, scoring 1844 runs, and smacking 668 doubles (#1 all-time by a RH batter).

I was able to watch Biggio's entire career here in Houston, and he was always the player that got the most appreciation and respect from Astros fans. Bagwell and Berkman often had bigger years but Biggio was the true leader of the team and set the tone for the clubhouse. He is a class act and you never hear a bad word about him from teammates and opponents alike.

Biggio's HOF selection is well-deserved. Instead of "compiler", let's call him a great player.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Orcin

I am really annoyed to hear Craig Biggio referred to as a "compiler". The term is used to diminish his accomplishments, as if somehow playing 20 years at a very high level is not that big a deal. He led the league in plate appearances five times, and in four of those years he finished in the top 12 in MVP voting. He wasn't just filling a roster spot while "compiling" 3060 hits, scoring 1844 runs, and smacking 668 doubles (#1 all-time by a RH batter).

I was able to watch Biggio's entire career here in Houston, and he was always the player that got the most appreciation and respect from Astros fans. Bagwell and Berkman often had bigger years but Biggio was the true leader of the team and set the tone for the clubhouse. He is a class act and you never hear a bad word about him from teammates and opponents alike.

Biggio's HOF selection is well-deserved. Instead of "compiler", let's call him a great player.

Very well said. A certain radio host on ESPN has been tossing that compiler crap out there about Biggio for years now. I turn him off the minute he starts. You can't penalize guys because they were able to stay healthy. Biggio belongs in the Hall of Fame.

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by Orcin

I am really annoyed to hear Craig Biggio referred to as a "compiler". The term is used to diminish his accomplishments, as if somehow playing 20 years at a very high level is not that big a deal. He led the league in plate appearances five times, and in four of those years he finished in the top 12 in MVP voting. He wasn't just filling a roster spot while "compiling" 3060 hits, scoring 1844 runs, and smacking 668 doubles (#1 all-time by a RH batter).

I was able to watch Biggio's entire career here in Houston, and he was always the player that got the most appreciation and respect from Astros fans. Bagwell and Berkman often had bigger years but Biggio was the true leader of the team and set the tone for the clubhouse. He is a class act and you never hear a bad word about him from teammates and opponents alike.

Biggio's HOF selection is well-deserved. Instead of "compiler", let's call him a great player.

Hear, hear! It's like people get lazy when they see 5-digit AB totals and automatically throw out the word "compiler" as a derogatory term. Look at his peak from 1991 through 1999 for cryin' out loud: 50.1 bWAR during this time, 32.4 WAA. That's an average of 5.6 WAR and 3.6 WAA over the course of nine consecutive seasons. Don't forget that 1994 and 1995 were shortened seasons. That's a pretty sweet peak.

It's not Rogers Hornsby, or Eddie Collins, or Nap Lajoie, or Joe Morgan, or Charlie Gehringer sweet, but it's pretty damn good and I don't think anybody would claim he's in the same class as those guys anyway. I think he's also a tick below Whitaker, Grich, (don't get me started - breathe - that's a discussion for another day), and Frankie Frisch. I also think Utley will pass him and that Jackie's incredible 10 year career is better. But that's it. I'd put him right with Sandberg and Robbie Alomar, also with Joe Gordon (if you give him a two year boost for lost years during the war) right there as well. Willie Randolph's pretty close to that bunch too, even though he got no respect from the voters either (great defense/very good offense at your position = no respect from BBWAA, same for Whitaker and Grich).

Perhaps Biggio's career is a little more defined by his longevity than his peak, but in the end, who cares? There are many different ways to the HoF for the few that are worthy, and Craig Biggio is worthy. Period. To discriminate against him for playing longer than a lot of players is borderline insane. He may not have been very good from age 40 on. Few are. So he hung on for maybe a year or two too many. So what? He earned it by being such a great player for so long.

[CONN CHRIS]

Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS

Two things that I would like to see which seem reasonable and doable:

1) Make all ballots public.
2) Have a process in place that re-evaluates voter eligibility every 5 or 10 years. These aren't popes or Supreme Court Justices.

... Or: Just close the thing down and start over.

This was great.


http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-bi...085458598.html

[CONN CHRIS]

We are a no cable and almost no T.V. household so I just never happen to watch Olbermann. My loss, this is outstanding.

(all you in cable world have likely seen these so my apologies to you!)
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-bi...085458598.html

[ihatenames]

Originally Posted by actionjackson

Perhaps Biggio's career is a little more defined by his longevity than his peak, but in the end, who cares? There are many different ways to the HoF for the few that are worthy, and Craig Biggio is worthy. Period. To discriminate against him for playing longer than a lot of players is borderline insane. He may not have been very good from age 40 on. Few are. So he hung on for maybe a year or two too many. So what? He earned it by being such a great player for so long.

I never understood why this was a bad thing. It's almost more rare to play at relatively high level for an extended period of time. There are plenty of guys who had a better peak than Biggio but there is not many who were as consistently good for as long as Biggio was. I think that matters in my Hall of Fame.