A poll about women's / mixed leagues

[Fredrocker]

Originally Posted by stevebydac

Prospective members scan our forum, and then see a disrespectful/closeminded post such as those typically posted by you and a handful of others here, and then they shy away from joining so as to not suffer the abuse.

Well being a 'newbie' here, I haven't found anything in this thread that would turn me off from becoming an active member. Plus I have never heard anything bad about this board or its members, actually its the opposite, members here are refered to as 'Those Baseball Geeks' which is a good thing IMHO.

And heck, what difference does it make if there is or isnt women included, I would figure the more options and features the better off the product will be for everyone... It's not like you to use all the features.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by shawa666

So? It's still baseball played according to MLB's regulations.


So now that your previous argument which stated that women have never played regulation baseball has been proved false (and that's a fact) you change your stance? Or are you now stating that any baseball played outside of the MLB and it's affiliated leagues is not really baseball? Or even more, that we're all fools for believing that there is a league out there in Japan? :sarcasm:

Face it, wolfie, you've lost this one.

WOMEN didn't play. There has never been a WOMEN'S league. A woman or two doing BS publicity stunts doesn't count.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Dregen

Any real stance against this has to be based around sexism, sorry to say it.

That's the biggest lie I've ever read on these borders. My opposition is based on the fact that there never has been a women's baseball league, there is no women's baseball league, and there never will be a women's baseball league. It's science fiction. And putting this SF into the game would be a waste of developer time that could be used instead to make the baseball game better.

Why isn't reality-based gaming enough for you people? What is with this craving for SF?

[Afino]

File me under the "no opinion" option.

[The Wolf]

Give up on science fiction baseball and go support something that will actually improve the game instead:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...y-options.html

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

WOMEN didn't play. There has never been a WOMEN'S league. A woman or two doing BS publicity stunts doesn't count.

Toni Stone playing in the Negro Leagues wasn't a "BS publicity stunt".

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Why isn't reality-based gaming enough for you people? What is with this craving for SF?

Women playing in MLB, I will grant you that, but as I've said, I don't see how a separate women's league is SF. One doesn't exist at present, but that doesn't mean it can't exist. SF implies it's impossible.

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Give up on science fiction baseball and go support something that will actually improve the game instead:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...y-options.html

No-one is saying we should have "science fiction baseball" over that stuff. Clearly that is a higher priority.

[PSUColonel]

Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS

I still don't get folks being so angry over the mention of options that they feel aren't worthwhile to them. Even if something takes coding time; if enough people want it to make it worth adding to the developers and it's something that I would never in a million years use - why would I care?

Something else that I want might have been included as opposed to something others want. I would love a to have a good in-game HOF balloting system. I couldn't care less about story lines, enhanced or otherwise.

I recognize that story lines (by way of example) are important to people so that's fine with me. But if I decided to advocate for what I want I could:

1) Make a case for including a HOF balloting system (I have)

2) Argue that it is a better use of developer time than option/enhancement 'x'

3) Throw cold water on sugested options that are not 'my' desired options

4) Get downright obnoxious when people make suggestions that I don't like.

Somewhere on that continuum, I think I'd cross the line into sillyville.

No offense here, and maybe I'm showing my age, but anyone who want this as a feature in this game is clearly a little odd IMO.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

No offense here, and maybe I'm showing my age, but anyone who want this as a feature in this game is clearly a little odd IMO.

I don't claim to be anything other than "A little odd".

[Chicagofan76]

Originally Posted by Cooleyvol

A women's league would have to play during MLB's offseason, putting in cold weather. No viewers during MLB season (see WNBA).

There's already a women's professional softball league. Do you watch that? Is it even on the tube?

The Chicago Bandits have been on tv a few times, mostly on ESPN 2. I have been to 5 games in 2009, and thats only cuz Jennie Finch is hot.
and they could schedule a womens league in june - end of august...but a network that currently doesnt have baseball would have to pick it up...It could provide a good ratings boost for Oxygen or Oprahs new network.

To 1 of your posts earlier Cooley, I am on your side, Its easier to create a womens league then to have it coded into the game. The full version of Facegen has hair? I didnt know that.

[Muzamba]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

No offense here, and maybe I'm showing my age, but anyone who want this as a feature in this game is clearly a little odd IMO.

Well, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it.

I don't personally care about female players in the game, but I don't think someone who does want them in the game is odd.

What I DO want to see is the ability to use female names in storylines. I know a lot of people think storylines are fluff and don't belong in the game, either. Of course, these are generally the people who want a very sterile statistics-driven game that lacks any real character. I, OTOH, prefer a more realistic simulation experience that doesn't make me feel like I'm watching a bunch of one-dimensional robots. But I suppose all of this goes back to the eternal struggle between purists and "fantasizers", or as I see it, tradition vs. progress.

But I digress.

My point is that everyone has their own opinion of what is and isn't important in OOTP. I've already seen some counter-suggestions in this thread that I personally consider boring and a waste of time and resources, but I'm not gonna attack them for having an idea. Again, if there are a reasonable number of people who want to see it in the game, I'm all for Markus eventually adding it.

If you have something you want to see added to the game, you should feel free to say so - regardless of how weird it may seem - and not have to be subjected to the snide, arrogant remarks that some of our community's more grizzled members feel it's their anointed duty to make. (Not directing this at you, PSU. It's more of just a "to whom it may concern" statement.)

Anyway, it's not as if Markus has said he's thinking about adding women players to v12. If that were the case, I could see someone politely (sorry if that's too "PC" for some people) asking him to consider giving higher priority to another area of the game. But I don't see the need for people to slam anyone just for making a suggestion.

[Athletics17]

Chicagofan-that picture was the best post in this whole damn thread.

I would go to a game if Jenny Finch was playing too.

[Chicagofan76]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

WOMEN didn't play. There has never been a WOMEN'S league. A woman or two doing BS publicity stunts doesn't count.

Part of the reason for that is because girls play softball at the HS level, If they had HS womens baseball vs softball u would have seen it ages ago.
I dont think you would question women can play other women in baseball.

How r 2 girls who played multiple years in a league, a publicity stunt?
Stone, Toni - Negro League Baseball Player, Female

Eddie Gaedel was a publicity stunt, Chad Ochocinco racing a horse, trying to play MLS, and riding a Bull for 1.5 seconds were publicity stunts. Its not a publicity stunt when u r an effective player in your league for multiple years.

[Muzamba]

Originally Posted by Sweed

Exactly, if a few people want face-gen for women it should eventually be added, right?

Actually, I'd ultimately like to see Markus purchase the Facegen license. I may be wrong about this, but I believe it would 'only' cost about $500. I know, that's a pretty good chunk of change, but that's, what, 15 pre-order copies of the game? (Honestly, OOTPD probably gives out an average of 30 free copies a year to beta testers who really haven't even earned it.)

But my reason for wanting a FG license has to do with creating male players with long hair and front office personnel wearing business attire and no hat. If it allows those who want female players/personnel in the game, that's just gravy.

Bottom line is, with OOTP moving into the 2D/3D realm next year, it's probably just a matter of time until there's an in-game player editor.

[kingcharlesxii]

Sure, it would be a nice option and I could see using it in some leagues. Then again I'm one of those guys that The Wolf hates, having made Viking, arena baseball and robot baseball leagues.

I'm not interested in most historical leagues but it doesn't mean I shoot down every idea related to it either. What makes OOTP different from every other game on the market is that I CAN do all the crazy stuff that I think of. I fully support people doing whatever crazy ideas they come up with too.

[Cooleyvol]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

Part of the reason for that is because girls play softball at the HS level, If they had HS womens baseball vs softball u would have seen it ages ago.
I dont think you would question women can play other women in baseball.

Girls have played basketball in HS for generations, yet a women's pro league have been very few............all of which were not a success until the WNBA (if it can be called a success). What makes you think a women's baseball league would be any different?


Truth is (and this is not sexist), female sports are just not that popular with males (the majority of sports fans/followers).

[Chicagofan76]

Originally Posted by Cooleyvol

Girls have played basketball in HS for generations, yet a women's pro league have been very few............all of which were not a success until the WNBA (if it can be called a success). What makes you think a women's baseball league would be any different?


Truth is (and this is not sexist), female sports are just not that popular with males (the majority of sports fans/followers).

I agree, I wasnt saying a womens baseball league would be overly popular but it would have happened at some point.
Although I would watch some of a womens baseball league, I hate the WNBA and watch very few womens sports outside of College Gymnastics and College/NFP softball.

[mayberrb]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

Stone, Toni - Negro League Baseball Player, Female

Thanks to Cryomaniac and Chicagofan for introducing me to Toni Stone. I hadn't heard of her. I will add her to my growing list of women who played professional and "regulation" baseball.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by kingcharlesxii

Then again I'm one of those guys that The Wolf hates, having made Viking, arena baseball and robot baseball leagues.

I do hate the leagues, but certainly not you. You're pretty funny. I hate bad ideas and bad things, not people (well, except those few people who have to make every argument personal or who inappropriately play the race or sex card). For instance Cry brought this whole mess up but I like him just fine.

Dick Allen once said, discussing artificial turf, "If cows can't eat it, I don't want to play on it." Likewise, if it isn't in real baseball, then I do not want it in my baseball simulation. Ever.

[kehowey]

I will replicate the National Pro Fastpitch (NPF) in OOTP11 by this June. Making all of the Photofit files from the free Facegen Modeller is taking most of my efforts. I am also doing a Proof Of Principle on running a league of 16 players per team and a gate attendance 0f 750 per game. Things are going pretty well. Do I want to see OOTP spend significant time adding features to support female players. No. I would rather see OOTP spend their time improving AI (especially in player evaluation and roster management) and fixing bugs. Although, seeing Jennie Finch's long blonde hair in OOTP would certainly be quite a plus to me.

[MimesisBTG]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

there never will be a women's baseball league. It's science fiction.

I personally don't have a problem with the option of women's leagues, Wolf, but I understand your preference for the developers to spend their time on other aspects of the game. I am not sure, however, how you can be so certain that there will never be a women's baseball league. Unlike many science fiction ideas, all this one would require is enough people committed to the idea, and there seem to be a quite a few on these boards. I'm not sure on what basis you are entirely discounting the possibility.