Just wanted to say "Thanks", but...

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

I have responded with bolded above.

But they are personal insults. You use the term "fanboys." You also said "it makes perfect sense, maybe you're just too young."

Slinging mud is slinging mud. Then in the response, you decide to place only one of three labels on everyone. "Fanboys," "Neutrals," and "Haters." Placing yourself in the "best sounding" category.

In the world of media using psychology, this is called "framing." Framing is a dishonest practice, meant to lead people to think in one particular, biased, direction.

In any case, nobody really jumped on CJ too much. Even if they did, I am sure he could defend himself rather nicely. In fact, I know he can. I see him do it all the time in the OT forums.

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

That's not the case in the minors. Especially in earlier years.

Ah, so true. I always forget about the historical aspect of the game. Something I very rarely, if ever, touch.

Doubleheaders are also more common at the collegiate and highschool levels as well, than they are in the pros. (what, with shorter seasons, and all. And the regular season taking place in the Spring, when it rains more often.)

[The Wolf]

Let me urge a couple of you to calm down.

I disagree with cephasjames completely, personally think he would have done better for the game and the community not to have started this thread at all, but he has every right to his views and to do what he has done and we should discuss this issue calmly and rationally.

I've faced versions that didn't have features in them that I wanted but bought them anyway. I would have bought 12 without a save game feature, delighted as I am that 12 will finally have it. But not buying a version because something I want hasn't been added to it? I just can't see doing that. Every single new version since OOTP 2006 has brought added value, no matter what features weren't in it, because of the ones that were in it.

[Queensryche]

Originally Posted by Vinny P.

But they are personal insults. You use the term "fanboys." You also said "it makes perfect sense, maybe you're just too young."

Slinging mud is slinging mud. Then in the response, you decide to place only one of three labels on everyone. "Fanboys," "Neutrals," and "Haters." Placing yourself in the "best sounding" category.

In the world of media using psychology, this is called "framing." Framing is a dishonest practice, meant to lead people to think in one particular, biased, direction.

In any case, nobody really jumped on CJ too much. Even if they did, I am sure he could defend himself rather nicely. In fact, I know he can. I see him do it all the time in the OT forums.

Since when is being too young to remember something an insult? I mean come ON.

Also, the fanboy/neutral/hater thing, that's just the way it is man. I'm not politically correct, I just state the facts, and the facts are people on this forum are one of the three categories.

Neutral is the best category for sure, and the vast majority of people that view this forum probably fall into that category, but you have plenty of the other two options as well.

Again, it's not politically correct, but it is correct none the less.

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

Since when is being too young to remember something an insult? I mean come ON.

Also, the fanboy/neutral/hater thing, that's just the way it is man. I'm not politically correct, I just state the facts, and the facts are people on this forum are one of the three categories.

Neutral is the best category for sure, and the vast majority of people that view this forum probably fall into that category, but you have plenty of the other two options as well.

Again, it's not politically correct, but it is correct none the less.

I never said being too young to not remember something is bad. Just the way you typed it out made it sound insulting, and condescending.

Same with your use of the term "fanboy."

And something as simplistic as using a scale of 1 - 3 to label someone is not correct in any way, shape, or form.

[Queensryche]

Originally Posted by Vinny P.

And something as simplistic as using a scale of 1 - 3 to label someone is not correct in any way, shape, or form.

For the OOTP forums, yes it is.

Everyone on here is either one of the three.

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

For the OOTP forums, yes it is.

Everyone on here is either one of the three.

lol, whatever you say, Mr. 55 posts/year.

[Chicagofan76]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

Not entirely correct. In the minors, doubleheaders have been structured by rule to involve a 9-inning game followed by a 7-inning game. Some leagues opted to play a doubleheader as two 7-inning games.

Personally, I'd like to see that as an option under the league rule settings.

Got a link for that?

[BadluckinOOTP]

The world would be an awful, boring, negative place if we felt the need to go around and tell everyone all the things we're not going to do.

[Chicagofan76]

I'm cool with being called a fanboy...in fact he makes me want to sing

Fanboy, baby!
I'm in nerd overdrive, I will always survive.
Fanboy, baby!
Feel so alive, watching Babylon 5!
Was born to be a fanboy, baby!
Makin' best friends, with a robot, Bender!
Fanboy, baby!
I never give up, and I never surrender!

YouTube - Luke Ski's "Fanboy" Rap

[tejdog1]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

Got a link for that?

I'm a HUGE minor league baseball fan (Well...Mets farm, anyway), every DH I've seen has been two 7 inning games.

[Chicagofan76]

never knew that

League Scoreboard | Birmingham Barons Scoreboard

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by BusterKing

So lets say that we all take that stance, 100% of the customers and Markus releases a new version and actually doesn't sell one copy. Do you think he would make another release or would it be the end of the road for this game?

That's the way I see it. I love this game and the only way I can support it where it really counts is by letting my money do the talking.

I bought every version of this game and will continue to do so. Regardless if my own requirements are met or not.

In my books, it is a wise investment to keep this great OOTP series going.

Thank you, I couldn't have said it better!

This is a very small business, and if we'd sell less copies, the company would get shut down and Andreas and I would have to get another job. So the best way to make sure OOTP improves each year is to support it by making a purchase. It's that simple.

"Speaking with my wallet" might work for big companies, but it sure does not work the way intended for such small companies as ours.

Cheers,
Markus

[mm7607]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Thank you, I couldn't have said it better!

This is a very small business, and if we'd sell less copies, the company would get shut down and Andreas and I would have to get another job. So the best way to make sure OOTP improves each year is to support it by making a purchase. It's that simple.

"Speaking with my wallet" might work for big companies, but it sure does not work the way intended for such small companies as ours.

Cheers,
Markus

While I agree with these two comments I wont continue to buy this game blindly as before. I want to see the total feature list before I buy this time. If people cant understand my view and get all upset then I'm sorry.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by mm7607

While I agree with these two comments I wont continue to buy this game blindly as before. I want to see the total feature list before I buy this time. If people cant understand my view and get all upset then I'm sorry.

That is certainly your right, nobody forces you to buy our games, not even me

But I see it this way: The 'big' companies like EA or Take2 only add 4-5 new features to their games each year, plus updated rosters. We have been adding a minimum of 50 new features & improvements each year since OOTP 1. The problem is, that most of our loyal customers now expect long new feature lists each year. For example, look at the OOTP 11 review on Gamespot. They liked the game, but said something like "not all that different from OOTP 10". The reality is, we added more new stuff in OOTP 11 than all EA sports games in the past 5 years combined.

What do you think would happen if we shifted to the EA-way of doing new versions? Right, we'd sell half as many copies and be out of business within a year. EA can get away with such a strategy since their games sit on the shelves in big stores and 250,000 people buy it without even caring what the new features are, as long as a new professional athlete is on the box.

OK, enough rant, I get back to work...

[mm7607]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

That is certainly your right, nobody forces you to buy our games, not even me

But I see it this way: The 'big' companies like EA or Take2 only add 4-5 new features to their games each year, plus updated rosters. We have been adding a minimum of 50 new features & improvements each year since OOTP 1. The problem is, that most of our loyal customers now expect long new feature lists each year. For example, look at the OOTP 11 review on Gamespot. They liked the game, but said something like "not all that different from OOTP 10". The reality is, we added more new stuff in OOTP 11 than all EA sports games in the past 5 years combined.

What do you think would happen if we shifted to the EA-way of doing new versions? Right, we'd sell half as many copies and be out of business within a year. EA can get away with such a strategy since their games sit on the shelves in big stores and 250,000 people buy it without even caring what the new features are, as long as a new professional athlete is on the box.

OK, enough rant, I get back to work...

Well this is why I am waiting on a full feature list. Maybe you made 11 to good. (I just spent 6 hours playing and dont want to stop) If just one feature pops out the I'll buy. I really really want to give you my money but I gotta have at least 1 feature I wanted. But just to let you know, I NEVER buy EA games. OOTP is the only brand I buy every year. Give me a list and I'll give you money.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

Got a link for that?

Not directly. If you check the box scores for doubleheaders for a league over at the MILB web site, you'll find they are played as two 7-inning games. As for a doubleheader consisting of a 9-inning game followed by a 7-inning game, if I recall correctly, I came across that in an article which described that rule being adopted by the International League. Late 1960s, I think it was. I probably found it in a TSN issue while looking for something else.

I don't think I wrote it down reference specifically. But the tidbit of info did lodge in my brain.

[Cooleyvol]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

Are you too young to remember map packs for RTS games like Warcraft?
They would release disks of just maps for RTS games and charge money for them even though it really didn't add a whole lot to the game, just more maps.

I think you pointed this towards me, so I'll answer this. You say you're 28 and retired. Whatever, but that makes me squarely in high school the day you were born, so no, son, I'm not too young. Your statement still makes not sense and we both know it. I have children closer to your age than I am. Are you too young to remember how to have some tact?


Don't buy the game. Do you honestly think I give a rat's ass? Its the public display of 'I'm not buying b/c Markus didn't add what I want' that bothers me. I havent seen any 'I'm buying the game bc threads', but if I did, I'd call those bothersome as well.

[BusterKing]

Originally Posted by robc

First, let me start with the positive. You have a lot of good posts and I agree with many of the issues you bring up. You are vocal about what you perceive as problems with the game and that is good.

If you are concerned about costing Markus sales, why did you make the below statements in a public forum where prospective buyers can see them? They are surely more harmful to sales then the OP's respectful post praising OOTP. So I say to you, if you love the game so much why didn't you PM Markus with these issues instead of posting them in the forum? My guess is that you wanted to be heard in a public forum to express your opinions, maybe hoping to garner public support for items you find important. Not too different from the OP wanting to express his opinion on the importance of these features to him. I don't have a problem with any of your statements below, but your complaint about the OP seems a little hypocritical.

Here are some quotes from your posts (links included in case anyone cares about the context of the quotes):
1) Nice bump but in deaf ears. Swept under the carpet like many other bugs that re-appears in every version, yet never fixed.
2) It has become an OOTP ritual to move on to a new version instead of fixing the present version to perfection. It's all about money.
3) Wow, that's $20 more then what we are paying right now. Almost a 100% price increase. Well, good luck with that Markus.
4) Another bug that goes unfixed and we just move on to version 11 has if it never existed. And I'm willing to bet that it will still be in the new version. There's no reason why we should turn off injuries to bypass a bug. This glitch has been mentioned before and like many others just ignored.

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post2859119
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post2814805
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post2910131
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post2898985

Thank you for going out of your way in attempting to make me look bad. It shows a lot of class.

I have been vocal about some aspects of the game that I dislike but I never started a thread so that everyone can read that I was not buying the game. I have bought every version and intend to continue. Anyone trying to dissuade others in buying a new version by making a thread like this one will not get my approval. That's my point. Sorry that you missed it.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

This is a very small business, and if we'd sell less copies, the company would get shut down and Andreas and I would have to get another job. So the best way to make sure OOTP improves each year is to support it by making a purchase. It's that simple.

Well, there it is in black and white. Want OOTP to keep on existing? Then buy a new copy of the game every year. Not buying one out of pique may one day get you no more OOTP at all again, ever.

Man up and support the best baseball game ever!