The European football thread

[ukhotstove]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

Absurdity of the FIFA World Ranking #1310
Of course the UEFA region isn't that much better.
Italy and France are the top two (ranked 2 and 4 overall), which is fair enough, although Brazil as always number one for some unknown reason.
In fact I had to laugh at the headline on the FIFA ranking website - "world champions close in on Brazil". They might just pass them in about 20 years time when Brazil fail to qualify for two World Cup's in a row.

But I digress.
After Italy and France, England are third in UEFA. Uh, how?
And fifth overall. Even after not getting past the quarter-finals of any tournament since Euro 2000, they are 400 points better off than the team that beat them, Croatia, and are ahead of Portugal by three places. Again, just how is this ranking actually calculated?

Germany, even though they finished 3rd at the World Cup are only 6th, just ahead of the Netherlands who didn't beat Portugal in the round of 16, who themselves then went on to finish fourth, yet are still ranked ahead of Portugal.
And that's even before taking into account the fact that Portugal finished runners-up at Euro 2004.

http://www.fifa.com/en/mens/statisti...v-2006,00.html

Brazil will always be ranked high as they pretty much get a bye into the World Cup finals, love to see them have to qualify through the European section and it wouldn't be hard for them to play in seeing most of their players are European based anyways.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

Ahhhh I was close, I mean you beat that powerhouse of world football Haiti and you should go up 15 places at least.

There are two things in the ranking that I would change, at least.

First, friendlies shouldn't play any part in the calculation. Yes it means the smaller countries are able to count more games but it just distorts the results.

Secondly, there should be a bonus for qualifying for a continental tournament.
You could squeak through qualifying and then lose all three games at the World Cup and still be ranked behind a team that doesn't qualify for anything (see the CONCACAF example).

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

Brazil will always be ranked high as they pretty much get a bye into the World Cup finals, love to see them have to qualify through the European section and it wouldn't be hard for them to play in seeing most of their players are European based anyways.

I think the USA and Mexico should play in CONMEBOL. Let's see if they can qualify from that instead of the weak CONCACAF. lol.


Oh man, I'm so devious with some of my plans.

Seriously the only likely change is the AFC and OFC merging into a super-confederation. The OFC can't survive as it is IMO.

[Sdpm100]

Talking of lol, this is hilarious.

Newcastle will collect their first trophy in 37 years when they are awarded the 2006 Intertoto Cup.

Glenn Roeder's side are the winners as they are the last surviving Intertoto entrants in the Uefa Cup.

"We will be very happy to receive it," said Roeder. "It would be disrespectful to consider it a lesser tournament, as some managers do."

Uefa has revealed there is likely to be a presentation before Newcastle's next Uefa Cup home tie on 22 February.

The trophy is Newcastle's first since the Fairs Cup in 1969.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foot...ed/6185511.stm

So you've played in a trophy that has 11 winners to start with, and you are saying it's "not a lesser tournament"? Come on, we are not stupid. The Intertoto Cup is about as good to win as a pre-season friendly tournament.

[bababui]

Likr Euro qualifying is hard..each group has a good team ir two and 6 dogs and its almost assured that all the good teams qualify. Lets put all the worlds teams into the hopper and draw qualifying groups from there. id like to see how the English team would respond to a match in Honduras when baloons and cups filled with urine are hurled at them. It would be a bit harder than a match against Macedonia or San Marino. Apart from Germany, Italy and France who have results to back it up, the rest of Europe is vastly overrated.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by bababui

Likr Euro qualifying is hard..each group has a good team ir two and 6 dogs and its almost assured that all the good teams qualify. Lets put all the worlds teams into the hopper and draw qualifying groups from there. id like to see how the English team would respond to a match in Honduras when baloons and cups filled with urine are hurled at them. It would be a bit harder than a match against Macedonia or San Marino. Apart from Germany, Italy and France who have results to back it up, the rest of Europe is vastly overrated.

Small countries couldn't afford it.

[rudel.dietrich]

Arsenal vs Portsmouth has been one of the better EPL matches this season.

Im gearing up for Celtic vs Rangers tomorrow morning

[bababui]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

Small countries couldn't afford it.

Which ones? And Europe should chip in because of all the 3rd world talent they import into their leagues...to the detriment of local football in those countries. And FIFA would pay for those who couldnt afford the bill. After the top ten nations or so the difference between countries becomes much smaller and seems to be shrinking by the year. Truly international qualifying will also stop all the bitching about automatic regional spots in the final 32.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by bababui

Which ones?

Amazingly I haven't asked all the members of FIFA this important question.

I'd suspect around 100-120 of them.

Originally Posted by bababui

And Europe should chip in because of all the 3rd world talent they import into their leagues...to the detriment of local football in those countries. And FIFA would pay for those who couldnt afford the bill.

Yes this is the same UEFA that members want to get rid of a number of the small countries from the qualifying competition. I can see them paying for them to travel halfway around the world at multiple times the cost of them playing in Europe.

Originally Posted by bababui

After the top ten nations or so the difference between countries becomes much smaller and seems to be shrinking by the year. Truly international qualifying will also stop all the bitching about automatic regional spots in the final 32.

Which nations that didn't get in to the 2006 World Cup should have been in?
The only ones were the likes of Nigeria, Cameroon, South Africa being upstaged by some new African teams. But you can't honestly suggest they deserve any more slots than the current five.

[bababui]

Which nations that didn't get in to the 2006 World Cup should have been in?
The only ones were the likes of Nigeria, Cameroon, South Africa being upstaged by some new African teams. But you can't honestly suggest they deserve any more slots than the current five.

As well as several other countries from the Americas. Ukraine, Switzerland and Poland off the top of my head didnt deserve to be there.

Amazingly I haven't asked all the members of FIFA this important question.

I'd suspect around 100-120 of them.

The TV revenue alone would more than pay for any overhead the teams would incur.

Yes this is the same UEFA that members want to get rid of a number of the small countries from the qualifying competition. I can see them paying for them to travel halfway around the world at multiple times the cost of them playing in Europe.

The money could come from a surcharge on non UEFA transfers. The large European soccer nations have grown massivly wealthy with the help of many 3rd world players. It wouldnt hurt them to kick some of the money back to make the World Cup a fairer competition.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by bababui

As well as several other countries from the Americas. Ukraine, Switzerland and Poland off the top of my head didnt deserve to be there.

What, Guatemala?

Ukraine reached the last eight didn't they?
I wouldn't have had Angola and Togo, but they won't qualify next time anyway as there will only be four CAF slots in 2010. Replace them with Nigeria and Cameroon and you've got the "big" African nations all in there.

Originally Posted by bababui

The TV revenue alone would more than pay for any overhead the teams would incur.

Yes, people will tune in in their droves for Vanuatu vs. Andorra and Belize vs. Congo. And also playing across different continents leaves problems with time zones.

Originally Posted by bababui

The money could come from a surcharge on non UEFA transfers. The large European soccer nations have grown massivly wealthy with the help of many 3rd world players. It wouldnt hurt them to kick some of the money back to make the World Cup a fairer competition.

You've obviously missed this then.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mai...1/sfnfif21.xml

And this.
http://msn.foxsports.com/soccer/story/6247926

The one thing I will agree with you on is the bigger nations helping smaller nations.
But sadly the big European clubs and nations don't care a jot about anyone else. As long as they get the best players, it don't matter what happens to these places (see clubs moaning at the African Cup of Nations being played in the middle of the European season).

[bababui]

Here is my plan for a new WC qualifying structure...16 teams qualify automaticaly based on the old system..

8 Europe
3 South America
2 Africa
2 Asia
1 CONCACAF

To fill the remaining 16 slots there would be a 64 team home and home playoff with the final 16 advancing...the 64 would be drawn from this pool..

30 Europe
12 S America
8 Africa
8 Asia
4 CONCACAF
2 From the Australia/New Zealand region

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by bababui

Here is my plan for a new WC qualifying structure...16 teams qualify automaticaly based on the old system..

8 Europe
3 South America
2 Africa
2 Asia
1 CONCACAF

To fill the remaining 16 slots there would be a 64 team home and home playoff with the final 16 advancing...the 64 would be drawn from this pool..

30 Europe
12 S America
8 Africa
8 Asia
4 CONCACAF
2 From the Australia/New Zealand region

I see two issues with this.
1 - You've got 38 UEFA members there, so I'm guessing you would only need a qualifying campaign for the small nations, yes?

2 - There are only 10 CONMEBOL members, not 15+ as you've got.

[bababui]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

I see two issues with this.
1 - You've got 38 UEFA members there, so I'm guessing you would only need a qualifying campaign for the small nations, yes?

2 - There are only 10 CONMEBOL members, not 15+ as you've got.

The numbers could be adjusted..its a rough framework..but this system allows half the places to be decided by the teams on the pitch and is much fairer. It would also be a big money maker as the pressure to qualify would be intense and every match would have meaning.

[Sdpm100]

Originally Posted by bababui

The numbers could be adjusted..its a rough framework..but this system allows half the places to be decided by the teams on the pitch and is much fairer. It would also be a big money maker as the pressure to qualify would be intense and every match would have meaning.

It would be easier to go back to 16 teams.
I really don't see the depth in countries outside the top 25-30 nations that you seem to. I could easily be wrong though, and the real fans will correct me if that's the case.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by bababui

Here is my plan for a new WC qualifying structure...16 teams qualify automaticaly based on the old system..

8 Europe
3 South America
2 Africa
2 Asia
1 CONCACAF

To fill the remaining 16 slots there would be a 64 team home and home playoff with the final 16 advancing...the 64 would be drawn from this pool..

30 Europe
12 S America
8 Africa
8 Asia
4 CONCACAF
2 From the Australia/New Zealand region

Probably not a good idea to appoint yourself Czar of football and change the qualifying format when you seem to have little idea of how many team are in each region



The system is not broken, and does not need to be fixed

[ukhotstove]

Originally Posted by bababui

Likr Euro qualifying is hard..each group has a good team ir two and 6 dogs and its almost assured that all the good teams qualify. Lets put all the worlds teams into the hopper and draw qualifying groups from there. id like to see how the English team would respond to a match in Honduras when baloons and cups filled with urine are hurled at them. It would be a bit harder than a match against Macedonia or San Marino. Apart from Germany, Italy and France who have results to back it up, the rest of Europe is vastly overrated.

World Cup

Winners.
European 9 times
World 9 times

Semi Finalists or Top 4.
European 51 times
World 21 times

Different Winners.
European 4 different winners
World 3 different winners

Different Semi Finalists or Top 4.
European 18 times
World 6 times

4 times there have been 4 European teams in the final four the last time this happened was 2006 (the last World Cup), best that the World teams have done is 3 and that was the very first World Cup in 1930. The usual ratio of teams in the final four is 3 European teams and 1 World team, I don't know how you can say European football is overated seeing that 4 of the last four teams in the last World Cup were European when there were more World teams in the finals than European teams (European teams 14 - World teams 18)

[ukhotstove]

Breakdown of the last World Cup was.

Taking Part.
European 14
World 18

Group Winners.
European 6
World 2

Last 16
European 10
World 6

Last 8
European 6
World 2

Last 4
European 4
World 0

Last 2
European 2
World 0

[Sdpm100]

UKHS, your two posts reminded me of this from the World Cup thread.
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...postcount=5747

Give me a few minutes and I'll update it.

[ukhotstove]

Originally Posted by Sdpm100

UKHS, your two posts reminded me of this from the World Cup thread.
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...postcount=5747

Give me a few minutes and I'll update it.

Cool, I posted something like what I just posted either on this thread or the World Cup thread to show Europe has the stronger nations, I mean you take Brazil and Argentina out and the World teams are nothing.

Be able to tell you in a day or two what that Baghdad FC book is like as it's on it's way from Amazon.