How do you maximize OOTP's AI

[Lou Gehrig]

Originally Posted by I♥Pepper

Continuing with the attitude of "it's just too hard to code" will result in no further improvements and the eventual decline and death of this game. Which, in my opinion, has already begun.

The decline and death of OOTP has already begun...Really?
That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard since the nonsense about the games being pre-determined.

[ezpkns34]

Originally Posted by Lou Gehrig

That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard since the nonsense about the games being pre-determined.

Next time, just come out & ask for Toast to start posting

[RchW]

Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

Okay, can you name one of the options that the AI handles as well as the player?

I'd say mid-level SP. The AI routinely signs guys I won't consider and they respond as so many do with 185-215 innings with a 0.500 record. My feeling is that I overanalyse the evaluation process.

[Lou Gehrig]

Originally Posted by ezpkns34

Next time, just come out & ask for Toast to start posting

No thanks. We've already been down that "rabbit hole".

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by I[emoji813

Pepper;3855848]So your saying the a.i. is "pretty darn good" and " it would require too much processing power and an impossible amount of coding" in the same argument? Which is it? Is it good or is it impossible to code? Baseball isn't so much more complicated than chess that it's "impossible to code". In fact, the game of baseball itself is simple. There are in fact limited scenarios.
Complications are introduced when the a.i is asked to manage the roster. Not just in game, but throughout a season. Also, not just for one team, but many teams, in many leagues. As a result, there are numerous posts in these forums pointing out weaknesses in the a.i.'s substitution patterens and roster management quirks, like trading oddities. Are these difficult to code? Yes. Is it impossible? No. If it was impossible, OOTP wouldn't exist in its current form. One thing is for sure with absolute certainty, however. Continuing with the attitude of "it's just too hard to code" will result in no further improvements and the eventual decline and death of this game. Which, in my opinion, has already begun.

The only real thing thats the AI is inept at and the user has no control over with settings is in-game subs which is a legacy issue and have been tweaked in every version of the game that I have played.

Compared to other sim managers and sports games in general, OOTPB's AI ranks up there with the best. So yes, its good but at the same time its hard to make it "perfect" with limitations.

[MKG1734]

Continuing with the attitude of "it's just too hard to code" will result in no further improvements and the eventual decline and death of this game. Which, in my opinion, has already begun.

I<3Pepper ... I wholeheartedly agree to your first sentence. Because, where one person says something is too hard to do, another person who is willing to invest the time/capital will make that improvement in order to take your market share.

With regard to your second sentence...I am not the type to dismiss someone's comment out of hand. If someone had told a Roman in the year 100 AD that their empire was in a state of decline, they would have surely laughed you out of the room (even though it was true). But...I am not sure with regard to OOTP. What is your reasoning for making this statement?

[Doc_Brown]

Originally Posted by Lou Gehrig

The decline and death of OOTP has already begun...Really?
That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard since the nonsense about the games being pre-determined.

OOTP 1999-2015: It was a good run. RIP.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan

The game has so many different settings and options that it is impossible assume everyone's experience is the same as the next guy's.

That's probably the truest thing anybody ever posted here.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Lou Gehrig

The decline and death of OOTP has already begun...Really?
That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard since the nonsense about the games being pre-determined.

Every year the game gets better, more expansive, more inclusive, and more popular.

Some decline. Some death.

[Strasburger]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm3

One of my personal favorite rule changes I've made was to lower the expanded roster size down to 30 (on a standard 25-man roster).

Does this also affect Rule 5 draft protection and options usage, or do you still have the real life standard "40 man" roster, with only 30 bench seats available for September?

[Fyrestorm3]

Originally Posted by Strasburger

Does this also affect Rule 5 draft protection and options usage, or do you still have the real life standard "40 man" roster, with only 30 bench seats available for September?

The 40-man roster and all other roster rules operate normally. All it does is limit the number of September call-ups to 5, rather than anyone on the 40-man.

[Toast]

[Removed for forum rules violation]

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by I♥Pepper

So your saying the a.i. is "pretty darn good" and " it would require too much processing power and an impossible amount of coding" in the same argument? Which is it? Is it good or is it impossible to code? Baseball isn't so much more complicated than chess that it's "impossible to code". In fact, the game of baseball itself is simple. There are in fact limited scenarios.
Complications are introduced when the a.i is asked to manage the roster. Not just in game, but throughout a season. Also, not just for one team, but many teams, in many leagues. As a result, there are numerous posts in these forums pointing out weaknesses in the a.i.'s substitution patterens and roster management quirks, like trading oddities. Are these difficult to code? Yes. Is it impossible? No. If it was impossible, OOTP wouldn't exist in its current form. One thing is for sure with absolute certainty, however. Continuing with the attitude of "it's just too hard to code" will result in no further improvements and the eventual decline and death of this game. Which, in my opinion, has already begun.

Baseball is exponentially more complicated than chess once all those roster rules etc. you casually dismiss are taken into account, which they have to be in order to build a superior ai.

The ai now is good, very good, but it can't regularly overcome an intelligent, experienced human intent on "winning" the game and gaming the system. No ai can. That's sort of ai is what's literally impossible to code.

But a good, challenging, though not perfect ai? That's not impossible, it's already part of the game. And it gets better every year because improving it is always a priority for Markus. To help with that, posting any ai oddities you see in the bug report thread is encouraged, it's a good thing. No one should be discouraging others from doing that.

Beyond that, no one's saying that it's too hard to improve or fix the ai, just that it'll never be perfect.

[SirMichaelJordan]

I am not even sure if I would want a perfect AI, I want the AI to commit human errors.

[MKG1734]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

Baseball is exponentially more complicated than chess once all those roster rules etc. you casually dismiss are taken into account, which they have to be in order to build a superior ai.

The ai now is good, very good, but it can't regularly overcome an intelligent, experienced human intent on "winning" the game and gaming the system. No ai can. That's sort of ai is what's literally impossible to code.

But a good, challenging, though not perfect ai? That's not impossible, it's already part of the game. And it gets better every year because improving it is always a priority for Markus. To help with that, posting any ai oddities you see in the bug report thread is encouraged, it's a good thing. No one should be discouraging others from doing that.

Beyond that, no one's saying that it's too hard to improve or fix the ai, just that it'll never be perfect.

I've now seen this type of post, again, and from a moderator here. Which is the reason I started the post. To find out exactly what options the AI has the most trouble with (and hence a human has a distinct advantage) so that I can avoid them in my new game by turning them off...

['94 EXPOS]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm3

The 40-man roster and all other roster rules operate normally. All it does is limit the number of September call-ups to 5, rather than anyone on the 40-man.

I finally now understand what you are getting at. This seems like a great idea. I am going to try it out!

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by MKG1734

I've now seen this type of post, again, and from a moderator here. Which is the reason I started the post. To find out exactly what options the AI has the most trouble with (and hence a human has a distinct advantage) so that I can avoid them in my new game by turning them off...

The ai doesn't have trouble with any specific function to the point it should be turned off.

The only thing that the ai really struggles with is if you set roster limits at the lowest level of the minor leagues. Beyond that, it deals with most options reasonably well.

All I'm trying to say is that if someone is intent on gaming the game, they'll be able to do so.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by MKG1734

I've now seen this type of post, again, and from a moderator here. Which is the reason I started the post. To find out exactly what options the AI has the most trouble with (and hence a human has a distinct advantage) so that I can avoid them in my new game by turning them off...

The hardest is all ratings off, scouting set to a low level of accuracy, and all the fancy stuff turned off. Set the AI to 0/67/22/11, check the AI evaluation box to on and set trading to very hard. Grit your teeth and strap in.

[MKG1734]

Edit (double post)

[OldFatGuy]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

The ai doesn't have trouble with any specific function to the point it should be turned off.

Wasn't the question though how to MAXIMIZE the ai?

Coaching, I have never, NOT ONCE, played a game with coaching on where I eventually didn't end up with all of the best coaches at all levels. Another AI team here or there would also have a good staff, but mine would be the best in the league. If there's an advantage to having the best coaching staff, then doesn't having it on give the human player an advantage?

Scouting. Same thing. NEVER have I played with scouting on and not ended up with the best scout in the game, by ratings, across the board. It may take 5 seasons, it may take 10, but eventually, I will end up with the best scouts and coaches available. Does every AI team? No. Is this an advantage or not?

Sure, I could set up house rules, but I was answering the question at hand.

Player morale and player personality are jokes as far as trade decisions the AI makes for unhappy players demanding trades. Do I make trades that are less than optimal for my team just because a player is unhappy??? No. Is that an advantage or not?

Jeebus, I knew when I typed the response it was going to go over like a fart in a church because I dared to criticize the almighty OOTP in some way and didn't "qualify" my remarks by saying "OOTP's AI is the best available." It just gets so old and tiring.

Not one poster on here has named a single option that I listed where the AI handles it better than a human player. Can you? Can anyone?

Come on, here they are again.
Coaching
Scouting
Player Morale
Player Personality
Option years
Rule V Draft
Even financials (again I don't even turn this one off but if anyone thinks the AI handles financials better than the human player and doesn't lose quality players it wouldn't have to if it had handled them better than I'll eat my hat)

Which of those does the AI handle better than or even as well than as the human player??? And if the answer is none, then how is having them on NOT an advantage? You can argue it may not be a huge advantage, and I'm not making that argument either way. The OP asked HOW TO MAXIMIZE THE AI. The way to maximize the AI is to REMOVE AS MANY ADVANTAGES as you can.

I'll do everyone here the favor of making this my last post here because this crap just gets old. OOTP is the best baseball game on the market. I've said that at every site I've ever commented at. When I heard about this version adding the MLB license, I wanted to support that decision so badly I wanted to buy two copies and gift one here at the forums because of how many times I've received help here. Only to be told by Markus that he didn't approve of that idea as he wanted people purchasing the game instead of waiting to win it free. And then, within two weeks of taking down my post, what do I see???? At least TWO other giveaways, right here on the forums, of OOTP 16.

So I get it, I get the message loud and clear. And hopefully everyone else does as well so they can be saved themselves the frustration. Don't be critical of the game AT ALL and all is well. Otherwise, better carry a crap umbrella cause the turds will begin raining down on you.

Good bye