Rosters from the off!, next time maybe?

[Zeyes]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Im not suggesting that Markus and SI do it and release it, im suggesting that someone like Cubby and Rolen do it, but maybe SI hands them a bug free MOD that they can distribute through a forum.

Brilliant! If only Marc and Markus hadn't misplaced their totally bug-free version of OOTP2006 back in April, wilkiburger wouldn't have to suffer through this public nervous breakdown right now.

[<Pion>]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Why get involved in a "Method of getting a playable game with a real roster in it" debate then.

Maybe we are spoilt in England, we get licences in all our home bred games (That I know of)

Because I'm interested in historical rosters and had no clue from your thread title what you were referring to.

[wilkiburger]

Originally Posted by hawk236

I think the point that many have been trying to make is that would also be BLOODY ILLEGAL! One would actually be "braindead" to put their company up for that kind of risk.

Poppycock.

I demand Cubby and Rolen be put in shackles now, they must be doing something illegal!

Oh no , they do it for free, therefore it is not illegal.

So it must be the venue then. Cubby does it from home, (legal?)

Cubby walks into SI towers and liases with the game makers so that his hard work doesnt crash, he then produces it in exactly the same way as he does now at home but with the knowledge of SI. (Illegal?)

Someone else who might even have the stage name of Cubby, works full time for SI, is a programmer and knows the intricate ins and outs of the game and its database. He goes home produces a roster and posts it on the forum. (Illegal?)

Last time I checked being more advanced than someone else was not illegal!?

I think not, and your right this thread should be closed, because the doubters are sat at home in padded rooms scared to go out on the street incase they get run over by a UFO. They have no imagination whatsoever to solve this 1+1=? equation.

I am now officially bored.

Wake up USA

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by piperclap

If the work is done in the SI "building" by SI employees, SI would be liable for the infringements. The risk is not worth it at all for SI to do clandestine things like that.

Cubby/Rolen are private parties operating in a not-for-profit manner. Since they aren't charging a fee for it, they are breaking no laws in the US. Since they are a private party, MLB will not go through the trouble of dealing with them.

If SI does what you propose, they will hear from the MLB, and quickly, I would think. Its just not bloody possible.

How would they know SI did it?

It can happen behind the scene and no one will know.

As long SI release the game with fictional names they are legally fine.

[Zeyes]

Originally Posted by jbmagic

How would they know SI did it?

It can happen behind the scene and no one will know.

As long SI release the game with fictional names they are legally fine.

As they say: Everyone's a lawyer on the internet.

[Raidergoo]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

I am now officially bored.

Best news all day.

[scefalu]

Wow. Thank goodness we have such wisdom!

I will offer the obligatory "In before lock."

[NYJuggalo45]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Poppycock.

I demand Cubby and Rolen be put in shackles now, they must be doing something illegal!

Oh no , they do it for free, therefore it is not illegal.

So it must be the venue then. Cubby does it from home, (legal?)

Cubby walks into SI towers and liases with the game makers so that his hard work doesnt crash, he then produces it in exactly the same way as he does now at home but with the knowledge of SI. (Illegal?)

Someone else who might even have the stage name of Cubby, works full time for SI, is a programmer and knows the intricate ins and outs of the game and its database. He goes home produces a roster and posts it on the forum. (Illegal?)

Last time I checked being more advanced than someone else was not illegal!?

I think not, and your right this thread should be closed, because the doubters are sat at home in padded rooms scared to go out on the street incase they get run over by a UFO. They have no imagination whatsoever to solve this 1+1=? equation.

I am now officially bored.

Wake up USA

thanks for clarifying everyone's opinion of you with this post

[endgame]

What about the many owners who only play fictional and have no desire to see any recognizeable Major League player? Why would they want anything included they wouldn't envision using?

[Cooker]

As a lawyer myself, in my opinion Markus and SI made exactly the right/safe call on the roster issue. Non-lawyers may think thinly disguised rosters/stats ought to work legally, but they won't. End of discussion. US intellectual property laws give draconian legal remedies to anyone whose intellectual property rights are infringed. MLB and the MLBPA have protected their rights in all the names, logos, images, etc. and licensed them exclusively to Take Two. Any company that infringes (directly or indirectly) is taking a big risk. Secretly preparing the files and then "giving" them to Cubby or others to use wouldn't save SI. Those who litigate intellectual property claims are very good at finding evidence that a company has end-run their legal protections.

Modders who create free roster sets/logo sets/stadium mods are likely safe from litigation. There's no incentive to chase those who prepare such sets for personal use and give them free of charge to others. But once anyone starts charging, or doing it in conjunction with a game's producer, watch out. The legal beagles from MLB and MLBPA will be all over them.

Simply stated, Markus and SI chose the only safe (and legal) approach on this issue. We might wish the laws were different, but they're not.

[darkenigma510]

Wilki

Because this was a complete re-write, no one could prepare rosters ahead of time. I imagine in future years, because rosters will be compatible with one version to the next (we hope!) this won't be an issue in future years under the current engine.

[<Pion>]

Originally Posted by endgame

What about the many owners who only play fictional and have no desire to see any recognizeable Major League player? Why would they want anything included they wouldn't envision using?

I think Wiki would say that you shouldn't have been in this thread if you weren't interested. At least that's the impression I got when saying I wasn't interested in Cubby's rosters.

[Linenoise]

You don't need to see his identification...
These aren't the droids you're looking for...
He can go about his business...
Move along.

[ashantewarrier]

Originally Posted by Cooker

As a lawyer myself, in my opinion Markus and SI made exactly the right/safe call on the roster issue. Non-lawyers may think thinly disguised rosters/stats ought to work legally, but they won't. End of discussion. US intellectual property laws give draconian legal remedies to anyone whose intellectual property rights are infringed. MLB and the MLBPA have protected their rights in all the names, logos, images, etc. and licensed them exclusively to Take Two. Any company that infringes (directly or indirectly) is taking a big risk. Secretly preparing the files and then "giving" them to Cubby or others to use wouldn't save SI. Those who litigate intellectual property claims are very good at finding evidence that a company has end-run their legal protections.

Modders who create free roster sets/logo sets/stadium mods are likely safe from litigation. There's no incentive to chase those who prepare such sets for personal use and give them free of charge to others. But once anyone starts charging, or doing it in conjunction with a game's producer, watch out. The legal beagles from MLB and MLBPA will be all over them.

Simply stated, Markus and SI chose the only safe (and legal) approach on this issue. We might wish the laws were different, but they're not.

Excellent post!!!

[ashantewarrier]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Poppycock.

I demand Cubby and Rolen be put in shackles now, they must be doing something illegal!

Oh no , they do it for free, therefore it is not illegal.

So it must be the venue then. Cubby does it from home, (legal?)

Cubby walks into SI towers and liases with the game makers so that his hard work doesnt crash, he then produces it in exactly the same way as he does now at home but with the knowledge of SI. (Illegal?)

Someone else who might even have the stage name of Cubby, works full time for SI, is a programmer and knows the intricate ins and outs of the game and its database. He goes home produces a roster and posts it on the forum. (Illegal?)

Last time I checked being more advanced than someone else was not illegal!?

I think not, and your right this thread should be closed, because the doubters are sat at home in padded rooms scared to go out on the street incase they get run over by a UFO. They have no imagination whatsoever to solve this 1+1=? equation.

I am now officially bored.

Wake up USA

Who is this guy?

[SC_Dawg]

Originally Posted by Cooker

As a lawyer myself, in my opinion Markus and SI made exactly the right/safe call on the roster issue. Non-lawyers may think thinly disguised rosters/stats ought to work legally, but they won't. End of discussion. US intellectual property laws give draconian legal remedies to anyone whose intellectual property rights are infringed. MLB and the MLBPA have protected their rights in all the names, logos, images, etc. and licensed them exclusively to Take Two. Any company that infringes (directly or indirectly) is taking a big risk. Secretly preparing the files and then "giving" them to Cubby or others to use wouldn't save SI. Those who litigate intellectual property claims are very good at finding evidence that a company has end-run their legal protections.

Modders who create free roster sets/logo sets/stadium mods are likely safe from litigation. There's no incentive to chase those who prepare such sets for personal use and give them free of charge to others. But once anyone starts charging, or doing it in conjunction with a game's producer, watch out. The legal beagles from MLB and MLBPA will be all over them.

Simply stated, Markus and SI chose the only safe (and legal) approach on this issue. We might wish the laws were different, but they're not.

Maybe this will finally put the idea of being sneaky to bed once and for all?

[Ryan W.]

USA! USA! USA!

(sorry, couldn't resist...)

[wilkiburger]

Anyone for cricket?

[burnstuff]

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Poppycock.

I demand Cubby and Rolen be put in shackles now, they must be doing something illegal!

Oh no , they do it for free, therefore it is not illegal.

So it must be the venue then. Cubby does it from home, (legal?)

Cubby walks into SI towers and liases with the game makers so that his hard work doesnt crash, he then produces it in exactly the same way as he does now at home but with the knowledge of SI. (Illegal?)

Someone else who might even have the stage name of Cubby, works full time for SI, is a programmer and knows the intricate ins and outs of the game and its database. He goes home produces a roster and posts it on the forum. (Illegal?)

Last time I checked being more advanced than someone else was not illegal!?

I think not, and your right this thread should be closed, because the doubters are sat at home in padded rooms scared to go out on the street incase they get run over by a UFO. They have no imagination whatsoever to solve this 1+1=? equation.

I am now officially bored.

Wake up USA

I think you are missing the point. You cannot buy a game with MLB rosters from a company not licensed to sell them.

Think of it this way: downloading Led Zeppelin's "Stairway to Heaven" for free is illegal. But downloading a cover of it that someone made in their garage is legal; no one can sue you for that.
When you download MLB rosters from Cubby/Rolen, you get a cover, not the officially licensed MLB rosters.

Here's a better idea: Send a beta version of the game to roster makers so they can develop rosters before everyone has the game, making people like you a lot less pissed off.

[wilkiburger]

Originally Posted by burnstuff

I think you are missing the point. You cannot buy a game with MLB rosters from a company not licensed to sell them.

Think of it this way: downloading Led Zeppelin's "Stairway to Heaven" for free is illegal. But downloading a cover of it that someone made in their garage is legal; no one can sue you for that.
When you download MLB rosters from Cubby/Rolen, you get a cover, not the officially licensed MLB rosters.

Here's a better idea: Send a beta version of the game to roster makers so they can develop rosters before everyone has the game, making people like you a lot less pissed off.

Bingo, that in essence is what I am suggesting, its a simple concept, just thought that SI could use their wealth of contacts to find someone to do the rosters that had a handle on the bugs in the game, i.e knew how to imput the data without causing bugs. By the way im not suggesting that the current bunch don't know how to do it, I hear there maybe a game glitch.