Absolute Blockbuster of a Trade in my 42 year old Historical Random Debut

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Action, do you ever retire players or do you leave that 100% up to the game? I personally, always let the game do it, but sometimes I do find myself wanting to pull the trigger on guys that stick around too long. I'm using free agency and I feel that helps a great deal when it come to retirement, but it's far from perfect.

I leave it 100% up to the game, and I use free agency too. Some guys drop like a rock and quit. Other guys just keep hangin' around for no good reason. It's sad to watch once great players start to suck, but it happens to everyone sometime.

[JaBurns]

My latest, greatest dynasty in 18 is far from running hot. Started in 1901 should finish 1908 tomorrow all settings are advancing yearly (1901 is 1901 settings, etc). The stats are frigid for hitters, pitchers are having a great time, sub 2 ERA seems to be the norm, in my league. Will post some screen shots after 1908, if I remember, any early ideas on mistakes I could have made during the game setup?

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by JaBurns

My latest, greatest dynasty in 18 is far from running hot. Started in 1901 should finish 1908 tomorrow all settings are advancing yearly (1901 is 1901 settings, etc). The stats are frigid for hitters, pitchers are having a great time, sub 2 ERA seems to be the norm, in my league. Will post some screen shots after 1908, if I remember, any early ideas on mistakes I could have made during the game setup?

Well, you are in the heart of the deadball era, so that's what should be happening.

[JaBurns]

Ok, but this ball seems “deader” than I am used in other, somewhat misguided, attempts at random debut starting in 1901.

[David Watts]

Jarrod Parker update. Glad to say things have looked better for Parker over the last few seasons. Since going 8-19 in 1965, Parker has gone 12-10 in 1966, 14-6 in 1967 and is currently 6-2 a month and 1/2 into 68. Jarrod (36) is now a arm for hire, pitching for a new club each season.


What a start of a career. John Curtis gets drafted by the Beaumont Crush in the 1964 draft. A month later he gets traded to the Shreveport Captains. Then 4 months(4/29/1965) later the Captains trade him to the Biloxi Cardinals. Curtis still hasn't pitched a major league game. In fact, he won't pitch an inning until the start of the 67 season. He then proceeds to go 11-2 for the Cardinals, before going down for the season with shoulder inflammation. 1968 begins and Curtis rolls out to a 7-0 start, before losing a pitchers duel to the above mentioned Jarrod Parker. He's 18-3 to start his career. Pretty cool.

[JaBurns]

Here is the first one:

[JaBurns]

Here are the league records through 1908: It is crazy pitching. Any ideas?

[DCG12]

Originally Posted by JaBurns

My latest, greatest dynasty in 18 is far from running hot. Started in 1901 should finish 1908 tomorrow all settings are advancing yearly (1901 is 1901 settings, etc). The stats are frigid for hitters, pitchers are having a great time, sub 2 ERA seems to be the norm, in my league. Will post some screen shots after 1908, if I remember, any early ideas on mistakes I could have made during the game setup?

I think you need to visit Baseball Reference and look at the 1908 season or any early 1900's season. Your stats line up pretty well.

In 1908 18 pitchers had era's below 2.00 and 41 had era's below 2.30
The batting avg. of the combined AL and NL was .239
The hr leader was Tim Jordan of Brooklyn with 12 Honus Wagner hit 10, nobody else reached double figures.
Only 7 qualifying players hit over .300

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by JaBurns

Here is the first one:
Attachment 536629

Looks like you've got more plusses than minuses in most of the offensive categories except for R/G, which is not really something that can be controlled. The individual components of offense all seem to be slightly up from what they actually were. Even if they didn't lead to more runs, offense appears to be ever so slightly up from this graphic over the RL 1901 through 1908 seasons.

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by actionjackson

Looks like you've got more plusses than minuses in most of the offensive categories except for R/G, which is not really something that can be controlled. The individual components of offense all seem to be slightly up from what they actually were. Even if they didn't lead to more runs, offense appears to be ever so slightly up from this graphic over the RL 1901 through 1908 seasons.

To wit, here are the 8 year averages for your league:

AVG: +0.8%
2B/AB: +2.6%
3B/AB: +6.0%
HR/AB: +5.5%
BB/PA: +2.9%
K/AB: +4.1%
R/G: -6.7%
SB/1B: -5.2%
SB%: -7.0%
FLD%: +0.2%
BABIP: +0.3%

Nothing's really too far out of line with RL, but most of it is in the plus column. My guess as to why R/G is down is that there are more HR, BB, and K (fewer balls in play), and there's fewer SB attempts, and the SB% in those attempts is quite a bit worse than real life.

[actionjackson]

The general complaint was not about across the league averages being out of whack. Those appeared fine in both game versions. The general complaint was too many super-duper individual seasons in OOTP18, both on the hitting and pitching sides. That may still persist in your game. You'd have to check individual single seasons against individual single seasons that were posted IRL between 1901 and 1908 to know for sure.

[JaBurns]

It just seems scoring is way down, I saw one pitcher today with a record of 11-17 and an ERA of 2.61. Could SB be way down because of random debut of players from all eras?
This league is definitely not running hot.

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by JaBurns

It just seems scoring is way down, I saw one pitcher today with a record of 11-17 and an ERA of 2.61. Could SB be way down because of random debut of players from all eras?
This league is definitely not running hot.

Again, how are the individual seasons? That was where leagues were running hot in OOTP18, not in across the league averages.

[JaBurns]

I will look and see tomorrow.

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by JaBurns

It just seems scoring is way down, I saw one pitcher today with a record of 11-17 and an ERA of 2.61. Could SB be way down because of random debut of players from all eras?
This league is definitely not running hot.

That 2.61 ERA might've been a below league average ERA depending on what season it happened in. Here are all pitchers with a below .500 record and a 2.61 or lower ERA between 1901-1908:

1902:

Ed Siever: 8-11, 1.91
Christy Mathewson: 14-17, 2.12
Dummy Taylor: 8-18, 2.19
Pop Williams: 11-16, 2.49
Doc White: 16-20, 2.53
John Malarkey: 8-10, 2.59

1903:

Ed Siever: 13-14, 2.48
Frank Kitson: 15-16, 2.58
Red Donahue: 15-16, 2.59
Mordecai Brown: 9-13, 2.60

1904:

Ned Garvin: 5-16, 1.72
Noodles Hahn: 16-18, 2.06
Mike O'Neill: 10-14, 2.09
Harry Howell: 13-21, 2.19
George Mullin: 17-23, 2.40
Ed Killian: 15-20, 2.44
Bob Ewing: 11-13, 2.46
Weldon Henley: 15-17, 2.53

1905:

Cy Young: 18-19, 1.82
Harry Howell: 15-22, 1.98
Tom Hughes: 17-20, 2.35
Barney Wolfe: 9-14, 2.57
Weldon Henley: 4-11, 2.60

1906:

Jack Powell: 13-14, 1.77
Rube Waddell: 15-17, 2.21
Bill Duggleby: 13-19, 2.25
Bob Ewing: 13-14, 2.38
Lew Richie: 9-11, 2.41
Vive Lindaman: 12-23, 2.43

1907:

Bob Ewing: 17-19, 1.73
Ed Karger: 15-19, 2.04
George Winter: 12-15, 2.07
Red Ames: 10-12, 2.16
George Bell: 8-16, 2.25
Elmer Stricklett: 12-14, 2.27
Ralph Glaze: 9-13, 2.32
Cy Falkenberg: 6-17, 2.35
Harry McIntire: 7-15, 2.39
Jake Weimer: 11-14, 2.41
Lew Moren: 11-18, 2.54
Barney Pelty: 12-21, 2.57
Nick Altrock: 7-13, 2.57
Charlie Smith: 10-20, 2.61
Al Orth: 14-21, 2.61

1908:

Bill Burns: 6-11, 1.70
Andy Coakley: 10-18, 1.78
Lew Richie: 7-10, 1.83
Kaiser Wilhelm: 16-22, 1.87
Frank Smith: 16-17, 2.03
Bugs Raymond: 15-25, 2.03
Nap Rucker: 17-19, 2.08
Johnny Lush: 11-18, 2.12
Eddie Plank: 14-16, 2.17
Glenn Liebhardt: 15-16, 2.20
Rube Vickers: 18-19, 2.21
Vive Lindaman: 12-16, 2.36
Charlie Smith: 9-13, 2.41
Irv Young: 8-12, 2.42
Eddie Cicotte: 11-12, 2.43
Jim Pastorius: 4-20, 2.44
Billy Campbell: 12-13, 2.60

Context, context, context. It is everything. When analyzing the deadball era, you have to remove your live ball era shades, and realize that a 2.61 ERA in that time is nowhere near as good as a 2.61 ERA is today.

[actionjackson]

When I say "below league average", I probably mean above league average because lower is better.

[actionjackson]

1963 HoF class:

...Nobody.

5 players have signed contracts in excess of $1 million total value so far this offseason. It's getting to be so commonplace that this may be the last offseason that I report on it.

Nov. 27, 1962: SP Max Lanier signs a six-year, $1,372,000 deal with the Cleveland Indians. Four days later on December 1st, the Indians doubled down by signing 1B/OF Joe Rudi to a 7-year, $1,424,000 deal. 10 days later the White Sox struck, signing 2B/3B Edgar Martinez to a 7-year, $1,416,000 deal. On Christmas Day, 1962, SP Jake Arrieta found a present to his liking under the tree, and signed with the Milwaukee Braves for 6 years and $1,328,000. On January 9th, 1963, 1B/OF Cecil Fielder signed with the Chicago White Sox for a whopping 7-years and $1,826,000. That's the largest total value I've seen yet on a contract. And yes, you are reading the OF part of that right. "Big Daddy" has actually started 266 career games so far in LF if you can believe it.

[actionjackson]

First round of the 1962 Amateur Draft:

1. Colt .45's: John Smoltz, RHP
2. Mets: Waite Hoyt, RHP
3. Phillies: George J Burns, OF
4. Senators: Dan Driessen, 1B/3B
5. Dodgers: Jack Billingham, RHP
6. Angels: Bob Watson, C/OF
7. Red Sox: Richie Zisk, LF/CF
8. Pirates: Ross Grimsley Jr, LHP
9. Cubs: Horace Clarke, IF
10. Braves: Luis Marquez, 1B/RF
11. Braves: Jim Maloney, RHP
12. Yankees: Glenn Wright, SS
13. White Sox: Clyde McCullough, C
14. Tigers: Shawn Camp, RHP
15. Indians: Elliott Maddox, IF/OF
16. White Sox: Phil Todt, 1B
17. Cardinals: Charlie Gelbert, SS
18. Cardinals: Al Mamaux, RHP
19. Braves: Sammy Hale, 3B
20. Reds: Max Surkont, RHP

The Tigers also drafted Joe Gilbert, LHP, Rob Maurer, 1B, and Mike Brannock, 3B.

[actionjackson]

Top ten AL MVP for 1962:

1. Max Lanier, 27, MIN, LHSP
2. Willie McCovey, 21, WS2, 1B
3. Steve Gromek, 24, BAL, RHSP
4. Johnny Podres, 23, DET, LHSP
5. Walter Johnson, 28, BOS, RHSP
6. John E Briggs, 26, CWS, LF
7. Brett Anderson, 22, CWS, LHSP
8. Jose G Santiago, 21, BAL, RHSP
9. Gil Hatfield, 21, NYY, SS
10. Sherm Lollar, 33, BAL, C

Top five AL CYA for 1962:

1. Max Lanier, 27, MIN, LHSP
2. Steve Gromek, 24, BAL, RHSP
3. Johnny Podres, 23, DET, LHSP
4. Walter Johnson, 28, BOS, RHSP
5. Brett Anderson, 22, CWS, LHSP

Top three AL Mariano Rivera Award for 1962:

1. Chief Yellow Horse, 28, BAL, RHRP
2. Brad Lidge, 32, CLE, RHRP
3. Kevin Chapman, 31, CLE, LHRP

Top three AL Jackie Robinson Award for 1962:

1. Gil Hatfield, 21, NYY, SS
2. Don Robinson, 19, WS2, RHSP
3. Marty Pattin, 27, KC1, RHSP

The Indians and Twins finished tied for 2nd in the AL at 87-75, so they went to a game 163 on October 1st, 1962. It was no contest really as Indians' SP Cory Lidle and RP Clay Roe were injured in the first inning of the game. Kevin Chapman, Mark Littell, and Jeremy Accardo managed to hold the damage to 3 runs over 7.1 IP the rest of the way, but the damage had already been done as Twins' SP Max Lanier was absolutely brilliant in a CG 6-hit shutout with 6 K and 0 BB. That gave Lanier his 25th win of the season (25-6), to go with a 1.82 ERA. He would then add a 3-1 postseason record with a 1.64 ERA to help lead the Twins to the promised land. 3B Allie Clark pitched in with his 32nd HR of the year to go with 94 RBI, and the Twins were on their way.

As mentioned above the Twins rode the momentum of their Game 163 victory all the way to the World Championship in 1962. Their first stop in the postseason was Baltimore. The Orioles postseason struggles are well documented in this thread. They've now made the postseason six straight times and seven times in the last eight seasons, with nothing to show for it as far as the big trophy is concerned. Things got off to a good start for the O's as 2B Bernie Allen hit a 2-out first inning HR to give them a 1-0 lead, and that was all she wrote for the offense. The Twins were able to push across a run in the sixth, and the game headed to extras where the O's proceeded to hand the game to the Twins courtesy of two bases loaded walks, and a 2-run single. 5-1 Twins in 11 innings. Max Lanier came back for the Twins on three days rest in Game 2, and was every bit as effective as he had been in Game 163 for the Twins. He coasted to a 4-hit CG shutout with 7 K and 0 BB. Andy Pettitte was the hard luck loser for the Orioles, as he went 8.1 IP and allowed just 1 run in a 2-0 loss for the O's. Just like that the O's pooched away homefield advantage.

Now the O's faced three on the road down 0-2 with Ken Brett (9-17, 6.17) starting Game 3 for them against Wes Ferrell (14-15, 3.33). The Orioles proved that you should never judge a game by its pitching matchup though, as they powered through to win 5-3, and put themselves back in the series. Just like that though, the Twins put them on the brink with a tremendous job from 23-year old RHSP Fred Hutchinson (11-13, 3.74) in Game 4 with a CG 7-hit shutout, with 1 BB, and 8 K in a 5-0 whitewashing. The Orioles now faced elimination with eventual Cy Young and MVP winner Max Lanier taking the mound for the Twins against Andy Pettitte (2-7, 6.68 in an injury plagued season) in a rematch of Game 2. Wouldn't you know it, the Orioles came up with the goods again in a 5-4 win to stave off elimination. 3B Edgar Martinez came up with a huge 2-run double in the eighth to put the O's up 4-1, and they hung on for a 5-4 win. So the Orioles went back to Baltimore still alive in the series.

The Twins blitzed the O's with 6 in the fifth and two more in the sixth to take a commanding 8-0 lead in Game 6. Oscar Charleston's 2-run HR brought it back to 8-2 after 8, and the Twins added one more in their half of the ninth to seemingly put it out of reach. Hold the phone. The problem for the Twins was that starter and eventual winner Wes Ferrell could not get anyone out in the ninth. Homerun, single, triple, wild pitch, single, single, walk was how the first six batters went. LHRP Tom Borland entered a rather sticky situation with nobody out and the bases loaded in a 9-5 game. He rolled a 5-4-3 DP on his first pitch to Jose Hernandez to make it 9-6, with 2 out and a runner at third. He proceeded to balk home the seventh run, and it was 9-7, but the bases were clear, and he could focus on Oscar Charleston, who he struck out swinging to end the inning, game, and series for the Twins. Series MVP went to C Tom Haller, who went 13 for 25 with 6 RBI and a .520/.571/.720/1.291 slash line out of the cleanup spot for the Twins.

Up next for the Twins, the best team in MLB, the Cincinnati Reds (102-60, +189 Run Diff), with their deadly duo at the top of the rotation Toad Ramsey (18-5, 1.30) and Tom Seaver (24-4, 2.45). The Reds would've been even more deadly, but they were missing another SP, Dick Redding (20-7, 2.46). It was absolutely no contest as the Twins streaked to the World Series win in a sweep, outscoring the Reds 22-7. The only game the Reds had a chance/lead in was Game 3, when they had a 3-0 lead after 5 and a half innings. Unfortunately they had Tom Candiotti (11-14, 3.24) on the mound, and the Twins were able to mount a rally with 3 in the sixth on a 3-run HR by LF Joe Rudi, one in the seventh on a solo shot by CF Ginger Beaumont, and one in the eighth on an RBI single by 1B Eddie Robinson, in a 5-3 victory to give themselves two shots to clinch ultimate victory at home. In their first shot, they scored four second inning runs off the great Toad Ramsey, and made them stand up in a 4-2 victory to complete the sweep. 1B Eddie Robinson was named MVP, going 8 for 15, .533/.563/.933 with 2 HR and 4 RBI for the Twins out of the number six slot in the batting order.

[David Watts]

My advice to all, avoid 1968 like the plague. I'm almost to July and can't wait to have this season in my rearview mirror.