College Basketball

[andymac]

Originally Posted by jaxmagicman

Oh, Providence did.

Yup, Gomes, who is awesome, doesn't have much help there.

[KILLERBS24]

It doesnt matter who's #1, they wont be there long. It seems like every team is a little up and down this year. Thats why I say Wake didnt show up more than Illini were great. Wake has looked really good and not so good at times, UNC one game played well enough to beat 5 NBA teams yet they lose to Santa Clara and look bad against Indiana last night. Maryland was awesome a few days ago and not as good against Wisconsin. It seems like everyone is real close so any particular night a team can win and theres not the consistant dominant team

[jaxmagicman]

I don't mean to steal your thread, because I watch Illinois last night (oh and by the way Playboy picked them to win it all) and they seem to have better guard play than Wake Forest, Dee Brown is a 1 man fast break, he seems like he can run from one end of the floor to the next in like 2 seconds, but since this a college basketball thread, I wanted to plug the fact that Florida is beating teams on average by 30 points. Now that is not that big of feat because they are not beating powerhouses, but the most impressive thing is they play for the full 40 minutes. Something they have never done.

[KILLERBS24]

I dont know if Illini has better guards than Wake. Brown is good but I'd still take Chris Paul over him any day

[andymac]

Hey, I'm just happy to get some college basektball talk going on here.

As for Florida, they have a lot of talent that is for sure. However, their guards are so inconsistent it is hard to have much confidence in them. Walsh and Robeson can both light it up, but then they can also turn the ball over 10-12 times between them. Now that they are another year older I would hope they can become a little more consistent. I havn't seen them play yet this year (caught some highlights of the Providence game), so I can't say much about where they are right now.

[andymac]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

I dont know if Illini has better guards than Wake. Brown is good but I'd still take Chris Paul over him any day

Did you watch the game last night at all. You can actually make a case that Brown is the 3rd best guard on Illinois' team and I would take him over Paul. Also, Paul is not a very good defensive player which was a key to the lopsided score last night.

[KILLERBS24]

One night doesnt make a player good or bad, its too early still. Wasnt it just last year the Illini were supposed to be great and then collapsed second half. 5-0 doesnt make them a final four team

[jaxmagicman]

We were talking about last night, and last night they seemed to have better guard play than Wake. That is exactly what I said.

[KILLERBS24]

Sorry it was 2 years ago the Illini collapsed not last year

[andymac]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

One night doesnt make a player good or bad, its too early still. Wasnt it just last year the Illini were supposed to be great and then collapsed second half. 5-0 doesnt make them a final four team

Actually that wasn't the case at all. Last year, Illinois started out somewhat slow, mostly due to a brand new coach with a new system. Then they caught fire winning their last 9 or 10 big ten games and nearly knocking off Duke in the sweet 16. In regards to Paul, he has never been a good defensive player. He gets a lot of attention because he is a very good offensive player. However, all three of Illinois' guards are BOTH good offensive and defensive players and after last night I'm not sure how anyone can say that Wake's guards are on the same level.

[andymac]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

Sorry it was 2 years ago the Illini collapsed not last year

I'm not sure how they collapsed that year either? This was Brian Cook's senior year and I remember they won the Big Ten Tournament without even playing a close game. Then, with 3 freshman starting in their 1st NCAA tourny, the #4 seeded Illini were "upset" but the #5 seeded Notre Dame in the 2nd round.

[KILLERBS24]

they started out 12-1 and finished the second half 13-6

[andymac]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

they started out 12-1 and finished the second half 13-6

Yea, they started out 12-1 against teams like Western Illinois and Podunk Georgia. They were starting 3 freshman and lost a few games once they got into the Big Ten. They were actually only a win over Wisconsin in their last regular season game away from a share of the Big Ten title, and then easily won the Big Ten Tournament. I sure wouldn't qualify the end of that season a collapse.

[Skipaway]

Originally Posted by abailey3313

Back to the idea that the regular season doesn't matter...

This comment is sort of illogical, mainly because you aren't suggesting anything to solve what you consider the problem. Are you saying the 64-team tournament format should be altered, or what? I don't understand.

I don't think it's a problem. It's up to the league itself that how would they emphasis their product. Some leagues like the idea of exciting playoffs, like NCAA basketball, NBA, and NHL, where a huge number of team are in the playoffs. And you also get the other end of spectrum, like college football, MLB, or even most soccer leagues where there is no playoffs at all.

Still, it's a fact that the more important the playoff is, the less important regular season would be. And I was simply answering to andymac why there was little interest about the game.

Let's consider a 10-team league. If we got a 10 team playoff, the best team in the league can rest their starters all year and be the last team in the league and still come back to dominate in the playoffs. If we got a 2 team playoff or no playoffs, you know every regular season game would count.

Do I want to cut down the number of NCAA playoff teams? No. Do I think the huge number of teams in the playoffs hurt its regular season ratings? You bet.

[KILLERBS24]

To 90% of the college teams the regular season is super important. there are 300+ 1A Basketball teams, the only ones who can place less importance are the top half of the teams in the power conferences. To every other team each game is super important. I would much rather watch a bball game between two highly ranked teams in a season that 'doesnt mean anything', than watch 80% of the games the football teams play in a season that 'matters'. Who cares if all the games 'count' if they are playing Louisiana Monroe, or somebody like that. I'd much rather see someone like UT play Tennessee or Michigan or some other BCS conference team knowing that even if they lose they will make the playoffs, than watch them play teams like North Texas so they make sure they don't lose in order to get into a fraud of a playoff system like the BCS

[Skipaway]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

To 90% of the college teams the regular season is super important. there are 300+ 1A Basketball teams, the only ones who can place less importance are the top half of the teams in the power conferences. To every other team each game is super important. I would much rather watch a bball game between two highly ranked teams in a season that 'doesnt mean anything', than watch 80% of the games the football teams play in a season that 'matters'. Who cares if all the games 'count' if they are playing Louisiana Monroe, or somebody like that. I'd much rather see someone like UT play Tennessee or Michigan or some other BCS conference team knowing that even if they lose they will make the playoffs, than watch them play teams like North Texas so they make sure they don't lose in order to get into a fraud of a playoff system like the BCS

I wouldn't care to comment on what you think. However, I am really curious if you got better explanations on the low interest on NCAA basketball this early in the season?

I think my model is pretty good, and you did nothing to disprove it?

[BleacherBum]

Originally Posted by KILLERBS24

the only ones who can place less importance are the top half of the teams in the power conferences.

I'd even argue this point. Take Illinois last year. They finished 24-6, the Big Ten regular season champs. They won their last 10 regular season games and then 2 more before losing in the finals of the conference tournament. Top team in a power conference. But in the NCAAs they only managed a #5 seed, and ended up playing top seed Duke in the 3rd round.

If they had a win on their resume like the one last night, they likely would have gained some respect vs other conferences, and earned a higher seed in the Big Dance. And don't discount the importance of seeding and matchups in the NCAAs.

[BleacherBum]

Skipaway, what data are you using to quantify the "low interest" in college basketball? And what period are you comparing too?

Regardless, I wouldn't think that the NCAA tournament is having a damaging effect on regular season interest. The tournament is a large reason the sport has thrived over recent decades. Any recent declines in fan interest are much more likely attributable to the early departure of the top talent to the NBA.

[Skipaway]

Originally Posted by BleacherBum

I'd even argue this point. Take Illinois last year. They finished 24-6, the Big Ten regular season champs. They won their last 10 regular season games and then 2 more before losing in the finals of the conference tournament. Top team in a power conference. But in the NCAAs they only managed a #5 seed, and ended up playing top seed Duke in the 3rd round.

If they had a win on their resume like the one last night, they likely would have gained some respect vs other conferences, and earned a higher seed in the Big Dance. And don't discount the importance of seeding and matchups in the NCAAs.

Isn't the importance of playoffs and regular seasons a zero-sum game? By keep saying how important the regular season is, are you guys saying the playoff is not very important?

Maybe we should all give scores to playoffs and regular seasons. In my mind, it breaks down like this:

Soccer leagues with no playoffs:

regular season 100 playoffs 0.

College football:

regular season 90 playoffs 10

MLB:

regular season 80 playoffs 20

NBA:

regular season 50 playoffs 50

College basketball:

regular season 60 playoffs 40

Apparently regular season is not as important in college basketball as in college football.

[KILLERBS24]

The regular season games arent important to college football teams because they make 80% of their money from their post season games